Players that cheat

We had one scumbag guy at a tourney I used to play in weekly
I was told he-
Moved his coin to steal a game if you went to the bathroom or left table
Would stand between you and the balls and open his balls up or tie yours up by hand
Stand between you and table and move his cue ball better

I personally saw him foul on me and ignore it,to later win rack and tell me I was an idiot not to call him on his foul.

He is a violent souless person with zero to lose who I wouldn’t put anything past so I just smiled and said good game.
 
I had a guy clearly missed the kick by at least a quarter-inch playing eightball in a league and he immediately said, “Did you see it wiggle? It was one of those ones the barely touches.”

I responded with, “You should wait to pull that move when someone actually NEEDS ball in hand. I’ve got ducks everywhere here.”


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trentfromtoledo said:
Well that all depends on who you are talking to! :eek:

Some people think because the rules address certain situations and label them a "foul" that it is not breaking the rules.

My opinion is this: I feel anything with the INTENT of breaking the rules is cheating. Acknowledgement of breaking a rule and having a consequence does not negate that the rule has been broken and INTENT is everything to me. Many people disagree and I use this analogy for it: "Every man is willing to commit a certain level of larceny".

Everyone has different opinions about what is cheating and what is not. I play by the rules and feel allowing this or allowing that just brings forth more ways people are willing to compromise the rules. Winning with dignity is the only route for me!

Trent from Toledo
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Do you feel this way about all sports? In football, running off the playing field is against the rules and the play ends then and there, yet it is done deliberately in every game, even when there is open field to run.

How about a QB barking out a hard count on 3rd and short, unsportsmanship?

Enquiring minds...
 
jimmyco said:
Do you feel this way about all sports? In football, running off the playing field is against the rules and the play ends then and there, yet it is done deliberately in every game, even when there is open field to run.

How about a QB barking out a hard count on 3rd and short, unsportsmanship?

Enquiring minds...
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First, I am not here to argue with or appease anyone else. I have stated my opinion on the topic.

Second, I don't care what sport it is: intentional fouling is wrong. As for football, I don't know any of the rules or play or watch it, so I really do not have any ability to give an educated opinion. I can say this about physical contact sports: they are dangerous enough, people using intentional fouling as strategy is ridiculous because someone could get hurt really bad.

Trent from Toledo
 
It’s smart,and fair because both players can legally benefit from it within the structure of the rules.You are starting to beat a dead horse in a bizarre way.
 
I have a couple examples using rules to your benefit..

Had 2 players playing apa 8 ball. As most of you are aware the pocket is marked when shooting the 8 ball. As is the case with most players during regular session these guys were not marking the pocket. It gets hill - hill and my player points at the pocket and shoots. His opponent tells my player immediately after the 8 falls he lost because he did not mark the pocket. Now I am a laid back guy but I went ballistic on that call. Never the less a rule is a rule and after the smoke cleared I accepted the loss for my team. As the saying goes ...payback is a *****. I knew they only had 4 players . The rules state a team with only 4 there can have a player play twice if the opposing captain allows. Well when they requested to be allowed a replay in the Las 8 and 9 ball matches I refused and made them forfeit both. The first time I had ever made a team forfeit. Well they cried and complained and even called the league operator to no avail.

Another time involved the division rep who is a real dickhead. Rules state you cannot play both 8 and 9 at the same time and you have 3 minutes to throw some one after a match is over. Well he asks me id his player that shows up late could play both at the same time. I would not allow it at first but relented because he was practical begging and then said thank you when I relented and said he owed me one.

The next time we faced each other i requested a replay back to back . He refused and said it was against the rules. I was livid and reminded him of what I had dome for him which was against the rules and that he owed me. He still refused. Come to find out later that rule had been thrown out years before. So I bided my time. Next time we faced his team it was his turn to throw the third match ..he was across the room. So I sat there not saying anything until 3 minutes was up. I casually told his team they forfeited the 3rd match since they did not throw anyone in the required time and I was throwing xxx the 4th match. The co captain took off running to look for the captain and told him what transpired. The captain came running back and said I couldn't do that . I said a rule is a rule and you broke it. He said I am the division rep and I was taking care of a problem . I said I dont give a shit I'd you are the pope . You should be smart enough to have your co captain throw in your absence. He called the lo to no avail and apparent did not like what the lo told him so he packed up his cues and left ...leaving his team dumbfounded.

Like I said I am an was going guy and mist want to have fun playing pool but when some one wants to throw the rule book at me when its to their advantage they better cover their ass from then on when playing teams.

Well the
 
lorider said:
I have a couple examples using rules to your benefit..

Had 2 players playing apa 8 ball. As most of you are aware the pocket is marked when shooting the 8 ball. As is the case with most players during regular session these guys were not marking the pocket. It gets hill - hill and my player points at the pocket and shoots. His opponent tells my player immediately after the 8 falls he lost because he did not mark the pocket. Now I am a laid back guy but I went ballistic on that call. Never the less a rule is a rule and after the smoke cleared I accepted the loss for my team. As the saying goes ...payback is a *****. I knew they only had 4 players . The rules state a team with only 4 there can have a player play twice if the opposing captain allows. Well when they requested to be allowed a replay in the Las 8 and 9 ball matches I refused and made them forfeit both. The first time I had ever made a team forfeit. Well they cried and complained and even called the league operator to no avail.

Another time involved the division rep who is a real dickhead. Rules state you cannot play both 8 and 9 at the same time and you have 3 minutes to throw some one after a match is over. Well he asks me id his player that shows up late could play both at the same time. I would not allow it at first but relented because he was practical begging and then said thank you when I relented and said he owed me one.

The next time we faced each other i requested a replay back to back . He refused and said it was against the rules. I was livid and reminded him of what I had dome for him which was against the rules and that he owed me. He still refused. Come to find out later that rule had been thrown out years before. So I bided my time. Next time we faced his team it was his turn to throw the third match ..he was across the room. So I sat there not saying anything until 3 minutes was up. I casually told his team they forfeited the 3rd match since they did not throw anyone in the required time and I was throwing xxx the 4th match. The co captain took off running to look for the captain and told him what transpired. The captain came running back and said I couldn't do that . I said a rule is a rule and you broke it. He said I am the division rep and I was taking care of a problem . I said I dont give a shit I'd you are the pope . You should be smart enough to have your co captain throw in your absence. He called the lo to no avail and apparent did not like what the lo told him so he packed up his cues and left ...leaving his team dumbfounded.

Like I said I am an was going guy and mist want to have fun playing pool but when some one wants to throw the rule book at me when its to their advantage they better cover their ass from then on when playing teams.

Well the
Click to expand...

As far as the APA and intentional fouls go...I cannot tell you how many times I've seen a cue ball picked up (without a shot taken) and handed to the incoming player because he/she totally had no other choice...that, or lose the game. All within the rules.


Maniac (I'm betting trentfromtoledo would not do that)
 
Maniac said:
As far as the APA and intentional fouls go...I cannot tell you how many times I've seen a cue ball picked up (without a shot taken) and handed to the incoming player because he/she totally had no other choice...that, or lose the game. All within the rules.


Maniac (I'm betting trentfromtoledo would not do that)
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Oh man....i have dine that numerous times not wanting to take a.chance on breaking out clusters for my opponent..

Another one used when the situation warrants it. Your ball is froze to the 8 ball. No way your opponent can make the 8 or play a safe even with bih. your opponent has one ball left and he just hits a rail with it leaving you to break out the frozen balls. You pocket his last ball giving him bih to break up the frozen balls. I have seen some give the cue ball right back . Then I hand it right back. Some will then try something crazy. Others are smart enough to know it can end in a stalemate then you have to replay the rack.
 
I used to let my opponent get away with calling fouls on me when I know I got a good hit. I figured: it's just a game, I'll get back to the table anyway, I'd rather be the bigger person than sweat the drama....

Usually it's close split hits or "did I get a rail" on soft shots. I'm usually the first person to get a third person to watch a shot if I think it might be close but sometimes, things go weird. I can see their point, I've been on the receiving end of close calls. I've had a couple shots in the last year that I'll admit were close but if I'm certain it was a good hit, I stand my ground and I know that's ruffled some feathers. I've heard "Well, I'll just have someone watch all of your shots" but I know I'm honest when I get a bad hit (even when my opponent isn't paying attention) so being honest when I get a good hit is just the other side of the coin.
 
Maniac said:
As far as the APA and intentional fouls go...I cannot tell you how many times I've seen a cue ball picked up (without a shot taken) and handed to the incoming player because he/she totally had no other choice...that, or lose the game. All within the rules.


Maniac (I'm betting trentfromtoledo would not do that)
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Actually Maniac, back when I used to play APA 8 years ago I learned to do that because I saw another player do it and that was before I realized how wrong it was/is. I never said I was perfect and am always trying to improve in pool and in life.

I realize that there in rare situations I would have no other choice but to foul, very very rare situations. I think it makes someone work hard to try and make the impossible situation work for them. I think picking up the cue ball(moving or not) should be loss of game hands down. I love pool and love playing whether I win or lose. I don't need to win every game I play, as long as I played decent its always fun. :)

Trent from Toledo

"Within the structure of the rules" hmmm, when talking about breaking the rules intentionally, this sounds like a way to tell yourself its ok to cheat....Sociopaths do the same about killing people, they lie to themselves so they can do the terrible things they do!

Intent is the difference between murder and manslaughter.....
 
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If you have a nine ball hanging and a very tough hit on your next ball do you kick at it or pocket the nine and take the foul?
 
So many people “innocently” pick up the cue ball when they don’t want to take a shot That breaks up the only cluster and they don’t understand why they need to go through the formality of nudging the cue ball with a legal hit with their cue.

The reason you can’t do that is because if the cue ball was completely trapped behind a ball or two balls, it might be an advantage for your opponent if you were forced to move those balls. That’s why you can’t just pick it up and hand it to your opponent for ball in hand.


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Saw an A player facing a lock-up safety. He had two sets of problem balls. His opponent had two ducks and an easy 8. Ignoring the cueball he hit one of his opponents balls directly with his stick, moving that ball into one of his problem stacks.


Respectfully, Matt
(I don’t take myself too seriously. I hope you can return the favor.)
 
Intentional foul is part of the game. How can you tell if someone is fouling intentionally or not ?

BIH and "3 fouls in a row" rules creates a balance.

I respect opinions, but this is insane nonsense.
 
trentfromtoledo said:
Actually Maniac, back when I used to play APA 8 years ago I learned to do that because I saw another player do it and that was before I realized how wrong it was/is. I never said I was perfect and am always trying to improve in pool and in life.

I realize that there in rare situations I would have no other choice but to foul, very very rare situations. I think it makes someone work hard to try and make the impossible situation work for them. I think picking up the cue ball(moving or not) should be loss of game hands down. I love pool and love playing whether I win or lose. I don't need to win every game I play, as long as I played decent its always fun. :)

Trent from Toledo

"Within the structure of the rules" hmmm, when talking about breaking the rules intentionally, this sounds like a way to tell yourself its ok to cheat....Sociopaths do the same about killing people, they lie to themselves so they can do the terrible things they do!

Intent is the difference between murder and manslaughter.....
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I don’t get you.


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sjm said:
There aren't that many cheaters, but there are other ways of being inappropriate. The two I see very often are a) not going back to the chair promptly after your turn is over, and b) moving in your opponent's line of sight while they shoot. Each of these affects opponents' concentration and rhythm and, in my view, amounts to sharking, showing disrespect for your opponent.
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I always like the topic of table etiquette during tournament or match play.
Is there also an onus on the incoming player to stay seated or give way to the outgoing player?
I sometimes see a player who rushes right up and steps into the outgoing player's path as being as much inappropriate as a player who doesn't go back to their chair promptly after missing a shot.

I watched this recently at the snooker world championships...

https://youtu.be/cw_lLjidhbI

Now I'm a big Ronnie fan, so I may be biased, but I thought Carter was in the wrong here by not giving time for Ronnie to take his seat.

Here was the moment in real time...

https://youtu.be/2AnIZvR1Egg
 
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Cardigan Kid said:
I always like the topic of table etiquette during tournament or match play.
Is there also an onus on the incoming player to stay seated or give way to the outgoing player?
I sometimes see a player who rushes right up and steps into the outgoing player's path as being as much inappropriate as a player who doesn't go back to their chair promptly after missing a shot.

I watched this recently at the snooker world championships...

https://youtu.be/cw_lLjidhbI

Now I'm a big Ronnie fan, so I may be biased, but I thought Carter was in the wrong here by not giving time for Ronnie to take his seat.
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Ali Carter is a nit. I'd like to see him and the Rocket play for a stack of $$$$$. Ronnie would bust his pansy ass.
 
Cardigan Kid said:
I always like the topic of table etiquette during tournament or match play.
Is there also an onus on the incoming player to stay seated or give way to the outgoing player?
I sometimes see a player who rushes right up and steps into the outgoing player's path as being as much inappropriate as a player who doesn't go back to their chair promptly after missing a shot.
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As I alluded to the practice of the outgoing player staying at the table too long in a previous post, I have also, like yourself, witnessed many times an incoming player jumping out of his chair and almost bowling over his opponent. It not only looks stupid, but it's also poor etiquette IMO. It's like they are trying to intimidate their opponent or rub it in that they have missed.

Pool players.....geesh!!!!

Maniac
 
lorider said:
Like I said I am an was going guy and mist want to have fun playing pool but when some one wants to throw the rule book at me when its to their advantage they better cover their ass from then on when playing teams.*

Well the
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Yeah!!!!!!!
 
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