Playing This Thin Cut

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DrCue'sProtege

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
ok, i'll be more civil here. i ran across these types of shots a couple of times yesterday, and wasnt for sure what to do. as you can tell its a very thin cut on the 2-Ball. and its pretty close to being a scratch into the opposite corner pocket.

how do you posters play this? cut the 2-Ball into the lower left corner pocket with perhaps a little low with inside english? or perhaps try and cut it into the top right corner pocket with some left english?

thanks for any and all quality responses!

DCP

CueTable Help

 
Yes, the shot here is to make the 2 in the upper corner. The position on the three can be played with left center to bring the cueball three rails slipping behind the 5, or if you feel good about your speed, high left for two rails toward the upper right corner in front of the 5.

This is not a particularly difficult shot, you just have to keep your head and hit it nice and smooth.

If you want to cut this one into the lower left corner, the position play is a lot harder. You would have to use inside english to come up with an unnatural path toward the lower right corner, othwise you will hit obstructing balls.

Chris
 
TATE made a point that is (I believe) a huge part of avoiding the scratch...(Hit it smooth)....

Using Top on the CB will help you escape the scratch.....But even top with too much POP will cause the CB to divert enough to scratch...

In short, Its not just the top, but how you hit the top...
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
ok, i'll be more civil here. i ran across these types of shots a couple of times yesterday, and wasnt for sure what to do. as you can tell its a very thin cut on the 2-Ball. and its pretty close to being a scratch into the opposite corner pocket.

how do you posters play this? cut the 2-Ball into the lower left corner pocket with perhaps a little low with inside english? or perhaps try and cut it into the top right corner pocket with some left english?
Click to expand...
DCP, this is a type of shot that you should absolutely have to have a good handle on if you're going to continue with this game. You need to find out for yourself how you can judge the scratch in the bottom left hand corner. Once you know if the scratch is on or not, then you can go about your business playing to the center of the table for a safe shot on the 3-ball.

If you need guidance, you should look at the 90° rule for stun shots, and the 30° rule for follow shots.

Fred
 
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No offense intended here, but playing the 2 into the bottom left pocket is a sucker's shot. First of all, it's a much harder shot than the opposite corner. Second, the position is much harder to reach for shape on the 3. If you use draw of any kind, you run the risk of (1) running into the 7, (2) scratching in the side, (3) running into the 5, or (4) snookering yourself behind the 9.

I would be much more comfortable playing the 2 into the top left corner pocket and getting shape on the 3 by using either center left or high left english. It's all about comfort so find out what feels good for you and practice it. Then after you practice it, practice it some more :)
 
ill play safe behind the 7 sending the 2 to the other end of the table. If I wasn't playing safe I would shoot it to the top left corner as described by others already.
 
For this shot I aim at ball A with the med/high left english (give or take). The trick is to get level and trust yourself that the english will throw the ball in the pocket, as the others said the best way to describe it is "nice and smooth." Once you trust yourself to hit the ball like you should that becomes a high percentage shot. I will make that ball a good majority of the time, the shape on the 3 might get me.

Eric.

CueTable Help

 
DCP, you may already know this so forgive me, but there's a general trick to avoiding a likely scratch on any type of cut. First decide if the natural path sends the cueball more towards one side of the 'scratch pocket' or the other.

Then, based on that, decide whether you will beat the scratch with follow or draw. Altho cutting in the other pocket is better, like the others mentioned... let's assume for the example you wanna play the ball in the bottom left pocket. If you hold up a piece of paper or envelope to your screen, you can pretty easily see the 90-degree line the cueball will take. If you cut into the heart of the bottom left pocket, the 90 degree line actually doesn't scratch, or at least it will hit the jaw. The cueball will go to the long rail just barely above the scratch pocket.

Therefore, it's easiest to beat this scratch with draw.
Once you've chosen top or bottom to help beat the scratch, you can actually use 2 more tricks to increase your odds of beating it:

1. cheat the pocket. So in this case, I'd hit the 2 towards the fat side of the pocket (hard to judge on a thin cut but it's good to try anyway). The thicker my hit, the further away I am from a scratch and the more my draw will take.

2. Use sidespin to throw the ball, allowing for an even thicker (or in other cases thinner) hit than usual. In this case, you'd hit even a bit more full than you think, but load up with right english to throw the ball a bit. The english might actually not be worth it in some cases like this, because follow or draw does more for beating the scratch than sidespin, especially on thin cuts. It also doesn't help here because it's the wrong kind of english to get the cueball running back up to the other end of the table. But on other cuts the position may not be such a problem and the ability to throw a ball really helps. The thicker the hit, the more the throw can help.

An example of the opposite situation is to beat a scratch with follow. You can overcut a ball a hair, so that it would miss the pocket if you had used pure follow... but combine the follow with inside english and you throw it into the hole still get to send the cueball along the 'thinner cut' path that beats the scratch.

Hopefully that made sense. The key is to measure the 90 degree line first and trust what it tells you. A common mistake even at intermediate level is to see scratches that aren't really there.
 
I rack balls said:
For this shot I aim at ball A with the med/high left english (give or take). The trick is to get level and trust yourself that the english will throw the ball in the pocket, as the others said the best way to describe it is "nice and smooth." Once you trust yourself to hit the ball like you should that becomes a high percentage shot. I will make that ball a good majority of the time, the shape on the 3 might get me.

Eric.

CueTable Help

Click to expand...

Ida know.. I like this previously mentioned shot better.

CueTable Help



Imagine a "hook zone" behind the 9 that prevents you from being able to see the 3. With the outside english spin shot, you have to put a lot of spin on the ball to overcome the follow on the ball and bend the cue ball into a favorable angle. Even then, that angle that you drew has two downfalls.. It's a scratch angle, and you are passing through the big part of the "hook zone" behind the 9.

With the follow/inside english shot I diagramemd, you are travelling through the very thinnest part of the "hook zone". Add to that, you can see the 3 ball the whole time, except for if you get a bit too much follow/spin on the cue ball, and end up passing right behind the 9 for 3 or 4 inches..

No chance to scratch anywhere with the second shot. I guess it all depends on which shot you feel more comfortable with. I learned watching a lot of Efren tapes, so I am fairly comfortable with this inside english shot.

Russ
 
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