Please help me with this 8 ball situation!

rackmsuckr

rackmsuckr

Linda Carter - The QUEEN!
Silver Member
This came up last night in a tournament. (And I started so well with a break and run against my first opponent, a good player.) When my 2nd opponent missed, my 3 ball went around the table and as it slowed down, it looked like I would get a nice straight in shot to win, or a side pocket shot as it kept going. Unfortunately, it stopped at the one place I could not make it.

A ball was in the way to kick it in 2 rails or either logical way (on either side of the 8) 1 rail (or 2 if you kick long rail and then rail first into the 3) from the bottom rail to make it. I couldn't thin it to go around the table and get back up table for a safe. I couldn't draw to that area, because my 3 would go into traffic and possibly make the 8 or get tangled up in his balls.

All I saw was to go rail first by the tit into traffic, or dink the ball straight on and sell out, or kick a skinny long rail (where I was standing) with the chance of scratching, or kick cross side with a chance to scratch if I was short. Which is what I chose to do and ended up giving him ball in hand. It was so frustrating to lose that way.

Afterwards, I felt like I would have rather frammed the 3ball into his balls, rearrange the furniture, and at least make him run out from there. :mad: He is a decent player, but I should have won. Anybody have any other suggestions? Now that I am setting this up on the Wei table, I guess I could have softly followed down and tried to hook him behind the 8 on all 3 balls, but then the 3 would be buried in case he sees a piece of any 3 balls he can probably hook me back. Or the 3 moves the 8 altogether. :(

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Then I tried to justify the loss in my mind (the pool gods, and I didn't deserve to win, so of course he got a lucky roll, yada yada) because I should have run out on him the first time I was at the table (overdrew the position from the preceding ball in the side (had to cheat the pocket to straighten out the shot) and got a weird little back cut on the 3. Could have cut it in either pocket but elected to cut to the left hand pocket (my original plan) because if I cut to the right hand pocket, while the 9 might stop me, it might have moved the 8 or gotten in the way for the 8, or I might scratch off it. Now back to cutting it into the left pocket - couldn't follow out of the corner 2 rails for shape because a ball was there at the time, and if I drew the ball too much, it could have scratched in the side. So I did a little nip draw and missed the 3. Not that tough, but I focused on whitey a little too much and missed the shot. :( Got perfect shape though! :D

Not sure where his other balls were in this diagram. He only ran 4 on his turn and then left me with the preceding situation. Boo hiss!

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The first thng I saw was this...

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It gives him the table, not sure if your ruls allowed you to make the 3 off the 8, I would have looked at that option as well...main goal is to block that pocket up so he has to do something

a) to get on the 8
b) to make the 8
Thsi type of shot put him in reactionary mode, it may or may not work depending on who you are playing.

I also would choose this as option B

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Its one of those "do or die" options, but if you like to go down swinging, and if your kick game is up to snuff, this is another choice. I don't like it personally because
a) you can miss the 3 completely
b) you can scratch
c) you let go of whitey (somewhat)

Just my thoughts on the situation...
 
Blackjack said:
The first thng I saw was this...

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It gives him the table, not sure if your ruls allowed you to make the 3 off the 8, I would have looked at that option as well...main goal is to block that pocket up so he has to do something

a) to get on the 8
b) to make the 8
Thsi type of shot put him in reactionary mode, it may or may not work depending on who you are playing.

I also would choose this as option B

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Its one of those "do or die" options, but if you like to go down swinging, and if your kick game is up to snuff, this is another choice. I don't like it personally because
a) you can miss the 3 completely
b) you can scratch
c) you let go of whitey (somewhat)

Just my thoughts on the situation...
Click to expand...

Thank you very much! I knew there was something I was missing! You are absolutely correct and I didn't see it, thinking of selling out the 9 at that speed. He may have still been able to run all the balls to one pocket or moved them out, but at least it was more viable than what I did which is to go down swinging, took the 2nd option and missed the ball completely (too afraid of scratching). Usually, I prefer a sure hit on a ball rather than a not so sure kick, but I thought at the time that I had a better percentage of kicking and coming out good.

Thanks again. Hope you had a great birthday. ;)
 
In that situation, it looked as if you had to kick at half of the ball. It comes down to your familiarity of that table and how the rails and the cloth are cooperating with your sudden nervous breakdown... we've all been there. Everything is smooth sailing until that ball drifts over an eyelash too far and an eyelash too short (as illustrated)... this is where a deep breath to regain your composure is prescribed. Its easy for me to see those options because the cue is not in my hands, nor is the pressure on me, and I also looked at the situation for about 5-10 minutes before responding. I've never missed a shot from here. In the heat of competition its completely different - and you did what you did, and hopefully you take that lesson in stride and build upon it.

My birthday - My ears are still ringing from the concert... but it was great!
 
I would have tried to block the pocket using a lot of left english. Maybe making the pot ....but that depends on the actual shot you had.

With 3 ball covering all 3 balls to that corner pocket the opponent has a very tough task.
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Another agressive semi-defensive option is this:
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David is right

I was thinking that the right thing to do would be to just block that pocket. It may not work if your speed control isn't just right but it's better than BIH. I don't like the kick because there's no need to go totally offensive and let whitey go crazy. IMO, I'd try to leave the 3 in the jaws of the pocket and let him try to play 1-hole in the opposite foot pocket. The only prob with that is he could come right back at you and combo the 3 in with one of his own and play safe down the table with the cue and block your 8-ball leaving you the following. This situation calls for prayer to the pool gods. lol

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Hard to tell from the WEI, but I believe you could of made that 3 in the corner and using top enlish, not very firm, played the cue off the tit and out of the side pocket. It would of made a steep cut on the 8, but you were safe because of his balls. Regardless, I just about always play BLOCK THE HOLE! Even if you scratched and just put the three in front of the pocket, it would still make his life harder.

Shorty
 
Shoot straight into the 3 and draw the cb back to the head rail, leaving your opponent a challenging shot on the 9?

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Like Blackjack said, my frame of mind may have been a little on tilt from the ugly roll. Have any of you been there, where you think you have the game locked up and then the ball keeps on rolling and you still keep thinking offensively for the win? For a self-professed 8baller, that solution should have been in the forefront of my mind and now I can go back and say, yeah, Helloooo, but I was playing ahead and knew that whatever I did with this ball left him out. The obvious just escaped me and I went for the hero shot. :(

A couple of these choices offered bothered me because of movement of the 8 ball, either burying it deeper or making it out of turn
 
Captain said:
Shoot straight into the 3 and draw the cb back to the head rail, leaving your opponent a challenging shot on the 9?

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I don't like that option at all. There is a such thing as "doing too much". When ducking or playing safe, it is a good idea to contol either the object ball or the cue ball, not both. Sometimes you can't avoid it, but as a rule I try to control either one or the other. If you merely block the pocket, of course he can pocket the 9 afterwards - and then the others, but he'll have to work to find a home for the 8 ball, which is the only ball that matters. If he's dumb enough to run down to the 8, then if he doesn't pocket it, my ball is still a duck (unless he moves it - hopefully he wil be too busy worrying about running out). Its always an "iffy" situation when you give him the table, especially when you know he'll have a shot. Its simple strategy. Now... if i were to get what you left me after your shot, this is what I would give back to you.....

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by doing that, You are now in a safety battle where your opponent has 3 balls, and you have one... you will not be in control of that situation. He can play cat and mouse back and forth until you make an error, foul, or he runs out (in that situaton, eventually that will happen because you would have to make contact and move the 3 ball next - therefore opening the pocket up for the 8 to get through) so.... I'd rather block that pocket with the 3 and leave him the 9, and perhaps the other balls. That way, I know he's got to do something with the 8 ball, either bank it, or try to get in tight behind it to make it in the same pocket as the other balls. At least that way he earns the game.
 
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Go for the win, because if you give up the table, you're a big underdog. Conceding a tough shot won't work, because your opponent can always play safe.

The shot that gives you a chance to win with at least some downside protection is the three in the corner, rail first with a good draw stroke. The cue ball may go to top of the table, leaving opponent long on a miss. and, of course, if you make it, you're always on the eight.
 
I agree with Shorty. If the table layout is right then use TOP RIGHT ENGLISH, the object ball will go down the rail and either pot or block the pocket. The cue ball moves off to the right in position to pot the eight IF you hit with somewhere between easy and medium.

Terry
 
Tbeaux said:
I agree with Shorty. If the table layout is right then use TOP RIGHT ENGLISH, the object ball will go down the rail and either pot or block the pocket. The cue ball moves off to the right in position to pot the eight IF you hit with somewhere between easy and medium.

Terry
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Blocking the pocket is stil a loss. Oppopnent would be in total control.
 
Tbeaux said:
I agree with Shorty. If the table layout is right then use TOP RIGHT ENGLISH, the object ball will go down the rail and either pot or block the pocket. The cue ball moves off to the right in position to pot the eight IF you hit with somewhere between easy and medium.

Terry
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It was a scratch to make it in the corner with left, right, follow, draw, or natural. :( I would have had to hit it straight on and try to block the pocket.
 
rackmsuckr said:
It was a scratch to make it in the corner with left, right, follow, draw, or natural. :( I would have had to hit it straight on and try to block the pocket.
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Then your WEI table layout is off a little. Top right should miss the side pocket "the way it's laid out". An inch or so closer to the side pocket could make a big difference though.


Terry
 
rackmsuckr said:
It was a scratch to make it in the corner with left, right, follow, draw, or natural. :( I would have had to hit it straight on and try to block the pocket.
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Hard to believe, but if you're right, then try to kick the three into the side. Giving up the table here is a loss, and blocking the pocket has almost no value, as opponent would still be in the driver's seat.
 
sjm said:
Hard to believe, Bar box with huge side pockets - not too hard to believe, lol but if you're right, then try to kick the three into the side. Giving up the table here is a loss, and blocking the pocket has almost no value, as opponent would still be in the driver's seat.
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Kick 3 rails how? It was blocked as far as I saw, coming off the 2nd rail.

If you mean shoot uptable 3 rails, that is a low percentage shot for me and I could still scratch.

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I would opt BlackJack's 'A'. Play the 3 with soft left draw. Just enough angle and draw to keep it out of the side pocket and either make or block the pocket.
 
Well originally I thought if you could not make the 3 then how about a 2-railer? I am asuming there is room. If the balls are in the right place, I like this because if you shoot it with draw and make it you can get out. If you miss, you should have a duck and they would have a long tough shot. Not to mention if they went for the 9-ball the 8 might go too. If they go for a safety here, at least your ball will be close to hole and it will be the hole if you make contact, that is tough to shoot one of there balls from.

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