PLEASE READ old westinghouse micarta

K

knifemaker

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have been contacted by someone on the forum which I will not name, that states the material I have sold on the forum is not the old westinghouse micarta from the 70's. I will not sell anymore until I can verify to him and everyone that it is. I am sending a sample to a man in California that is the utmost athourity on the old westinghouse micarta.
Please bear with me until this is solved.
The ones that have sent a check for some I will hold the check until this is solved.
I know from use that this is the asbestos material since most of it I got from very old knifemakers that used it in the 60's and 70's. I will keep this forum involved in this process. Several top cue makers that have purchased said it was what they wanted. I know it is what I have claimed and will set this straight.
Thanks and sorry for this happening.
Percy Richardson
richardsonkinives@yahoo.com
936-288-1690
 
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Just keep us posted...I hope it turns out to be the real deal. I can't wait to get the two I orderd from you onto a couple of shafts...:D
 
So far I have gotten two phone calls and severale-mails since I reposted this. The ones calling and e-mailing have gotten there material except one and he still wants his. They state it is what I said and they were happy with it.
I have a Frank Paradise cue that I had the ferrule changed in the late 70's and this is the material on it. I know they did not make the newer stuff then. I still have part of the block that, that ferrule came off of and posted it on Az in a picture.
Thanks

Bear with me as This will be worked out.
Percy
 
knifemaker said:
So far I have gotten two phone calls and severale-mails since I reposted this. The ones calling and e-mailing have gotten there material except one and he still wants his. They state it is what I said and they were happy with it.
I have a Frank Paradise cue that I had the ferrule changed in the late 70's and this is the material on it. I know they did not make the newer stuff then. I still have part of the block that, that ferrule came off of and posted it on Az in a picture.
Thanks

Bear with me as This will be worked out.
Percy
Click to expand...

Get a sample to Bob Runde, in Wisconson, If you can"
also Bill Stroud, in New Mexico ,
Bill Schick in Shreveport, La.
 
I received mine, and I like it. I am no expert on Westinghouse micarta, however.

Out of curiosity, what is the argument/evidence that it is anything other than what you stated that it was?
Joe
 
SINCE I WAS THE CAUSE FOR THIS THREAD, I WILL SPEAK UP AND MAKE A POST HERE.........

THE MATERIAL THAT WAS SENT TO ME BY "KNIFEMAKER" LOOKS TO BE THE MICARTA THAT WAS USED BY SCHON IN THE 1980'S. IT IS A GREAT PLAYING MATERIAL, AND IS A PAPER BASED PRODUCT THAT WAS MADE BY WESTINGHOUSE UNDER THE NAME MICARTA.

IMO, IT IS NOT THE ORIGINAL ASBESTOS BASED MATERIAL THAT WAS USED BY SOUTHWEST AND KERSENBROCK, AS WELL AS MANY OTHER CUEMAKERS.

I HAVE PIECES OF EACH HERE, AS WELL AS OTHER "MICARTA" MATERIALS AND CAN TELL THE DIFFERENCE.

LIKE I HAD SAID IN MY PM'S TO "KNIFEMAKER", I AM NOT CLAIMING THAT HE SOLD THIS MATERIAL WITH BAD INTENTIONS, JUST THAT THERE WAS MISCOMMUNICATION TO THE BUYERS OF THE PRODUCT.

WHEN "KNIFEMAKER" ORIGINALLY LISTED HERE MATERIAL FOR SALE HERE ON AZ BILLIARDS, HE CLEARLY LISTED IT AS "old yellow paper base micarta" AS SEEN HERE IN THIS THREAD http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=184473

WHEN THE MATERIAL WAS LISTED AT A LATER DATE IT WAS LISTED AS "old yellow micarta ferrules" AS SEEN HERE http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=185924

THE FIRST LISTING IS ACCURATE. IT IS OLD PAPER BASED MICARTA THAT WILL YELLOW SOME OVER TIME. PROBLEM IS, IT ISN'T THE "OLD YELLOW" ASBESTOS BASED MICARTA THAT CUE GUYS ARE REALLY LOOKING FOR. THE ASBESTOS BASED MATERIAL IS THE STUFF THAT BRINGS $75-100 PER FERRULE BECAUSE OF IT'S SCARCITY.

I HAVE FERRULES HERE THAT ARRIVED TODAY FROM "KNIFEMAKER" AND THEY ARE NOT THE SAME AS THE ASBESTOS BASED MATERIAL THAT I HAVE HERE.

I TRIED TO KEEP THIS VIA PM, BUT AFTER SEEING ANOTHER POST SAYING THAT IT WAS THE ORIGINAL STUFF, I FELT I HAD TO GO PUBLIC WITH MY THOUGHTS.

I WOULD BE WILLING TO SEND A PIECE THAT I GOT FROM "KNIFEMAKER" AND ONE OF MY ASBESTOS BASED PIECES TO AN INDEPENDANT PARTY TO EXAMINE. I AM NOT WILL THOUGH TO HAVE MY ASBESTOS STUFF CUT UP AND WASTED. IT IS CLEAR TO SEE THAT THERE IS A DIFFERNCE IN THE MATERIALS.

HERE ARE PICTURES I TOOK THIS AFTERNOON, OF THE ASBESTOS STUFF ON THE RIGHT, AND THE STUFF FROM "KNIFEMAKER" ON THE LEFT.

DSC03413.jpg


DSC03414.jpg


DSC03415.jpg


DSC03416.jpg


LIKE I SAID, I DIDN'T WANT TO DO THIS PUBLICLY, NOR AM I LOOKING TO GIVE "KNIFEMAKER" A HARD TIME, I AM SIMPLY LOOKING OUT FOR THE AZ MEMBERS THAT BOUGHT THIS MATERIAL THINKING THAT IT WAS THE ORIGINAL ASBESTOS BASED MICARTA.

I WOULD HAVE TO THINK THAT PETE TASCARELLA WOULD BE ABLE TO TELL IF I SENT HIM PIECES OF EACH, AND I WOULD BE WILLING TO ASK HIM TO TAKE A LOOK AS A THIRD PARTY.

Marcus

P.S. I WILL BE OUT THE REST OF THE NIGHT, SO I WON'T BE ABLE TO REPLY UNTIL MUCH LATER TONIGHT, OR UNTIL TOMORROW MORNING. IF ANYONE HAS QUESTIONS, GIVE ME A CALL.
 
By looking at the pictures there is a difference in looks, take into consideration that mine was freshly cut and turned and his was not.
If you look at the pictures with the original label from westinghouse it looks the same these are on my early posting. I put the pictures up for every one to see what they were buying, that is what I was selling.
It is the old micart fromt he 70's i know that for sure as I bought it from a knifemakers family after he died in 1980. This will turn colors just like what his pictures show as you can see in my pictures. Everything I sold come off of the large block with the label.
Have a great day.
Percy
 
I believe I got the Original Westinghouse Micarta Ferrule from Joe Blackburn at the Expo a few weeks ago.

It was VERY EXPENSIVE.

I have been dealing with Joe for some time and I do not think he would in any way be mis-representative about what he sold me.

He showed me examples of what other people were selling as the real thing, then he showed me what he said was the real stuff.

I watched as he turned my ferrule, it started out as the same yellow shade that it ended up after he turned it to size.

My ferrule is definitely YELLOW.

And - Oh yeah - It does have a really nice hit - well worth the cost !!!


Tommyd1
 

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For whatever it's worth:

I have used a lot of Micarta over the years, starting in the early 70's. But, not for pool cues. We used it in the machine tool industry, primarily for vibration damping. The reason??? Micarta is a laminated material, which I have always been told was layer upon layer of canvas and glues. The layers are easily seen and identifiable. If there are no layers, it is not Micarta. These hundreds of layers reduce the transfer of vibration. Micarta was also known to be extremely stable with tremendous "memory" so that it retains its original shape when brought back to ambient temperature after being heated.
When being drilled, bored, milled, or turned, Micarta produces only dust. NO CHIPS. If it doesn't produce dust it isn't Micarta.
 
Bama cues has a good idea I am ordering the kit.
I talked to someone that is an authority on this subject. What I have is the original just as the label shows. Back in the 70's the quality control was not what it is today and they weren't making it for color. As it was made in different batches the color would very likely be a little different.
This person was a salesman for westinghouse in the 70's and know his stuff. All ferrules were cut from the micarta pictured in my post. I still have several square ft of it and have used it for knives for many many years it changes just as it suppose to and that is why collectors of knives like it. It ages well.
I will post what the test shows when it comes in. I tried to do it by online order but their site did not take orders tonight. Tomorrow I will order by phone and have it ups to me.
Stay tuned as the drama continues.
Percy
 
Send a piece to Butch Vallotton, Vallotton Custom Knives in Oregon ...

He grew up near the old Westinghouse Plant in Sunnyvale and has
made several Custom Folders for me using that old (yellow) Micarta
for Knife Scales.

I'm certain he can verify it for you.
 
It really will not do me any good to send it to Butch as I am a knifemaker also and have probably used more of it than Butch has. All I have came from old knifemakers. Butch is a great guy though.
Thanks for the thought.
Percy
 
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I have had several of the cuemakers that bought some contact me about this and they all say they feel this is the good stuff. They understand that being cut and turned will make it light color until it ages. There is some on the market that is lemon yellow and doesn't change at all. It is yellow all the way through cut or not. I did not misrep what I have you can look at the label in the picture to see that. It is the original westinghouse micarta.
Thanks for the replies.

Percy Richardson
Knifemaker
 
none

I'm no authority on this stuff but knifemaker had a label on a block that said westinghouse. The ends where they are not turned are yellow. He sent me an extra one that was free of charge because it was chipped on the edge of the block that will make a short ferrule and where it's chipped it's turning yellow. The only other proof is for someone to grind a ferrule into dust and snort it , if it kills them I'll asume it was the asbestose in it. Anyhow mine is heading to paul dayton where it should spend the rest of it's life on the end of a pool cue with a nice peice of leather on it. Any volunteers on the snorting ?:thumbup:
 
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good_lawd_yall said:
I'm no authority on this stuff but knifemaker had a label on a block that said westinghouse. The ends where they are not turned are yellow. He sent me an extra one that was free of charge because it was chipped on the edge of the block that will make a short ferrule and where it's chipped it's turning yellow. The only other proof is for someone to grind a ferrule into dust and snort it , if it kills them I'll asume it was the asbestose in it. Anyhow mine is heading to paul dayton where it should spend the rest of it's life on the end of a pool cue with a nice peice of leather on it. Any volunteers on the snorting ?:thumbup:
Click to expand...

"wow"
"reminds of Up in Smoke"
Tommy Chong fantasizing over a plate of Ajax or Comet,
Then his girlfriend comes up, and snorts the whole pile,LOL:D
 
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