Pool Made Simple … HOW TO AIM USING SIDESPIN … with GoPro POV

dr_dave said:
Thanks again. It sounds like when you are using sidespin, you still focus on where you want the CB to go and not along the cue direction required to compensate for CB deflection. Would you say that is a fair statement?
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Let's take this image as an example of my sight picture. Once down on the shot, I focus on the OB/CB as a whole (red circles drawn in the image are what my focus is on), and sense that their overlap is correct (intuitive assessment, if it feels wrong, stand up and restart the PSR), and stays the same (no accidental movement).

Having said this, I wouldn't say I'm doing either of the two things you are proposing. I'm not focusing on where I want the CB to go, but I'm also not focusing on the cue direction. It's definitely closer to focusing on the CB than cue if I had to pick one, but I don't really focus on either, I trust that both of these will be correct and the ball will go in, given that I aimed at the correct overlap and execute my shot routine properly.
 
Oikawa said:
View attachment 786426
Let's take this image as an example of my sight picture. Once down on the shot, I focus on the OB/CB as a whole (red circles drawn in the image are what my focus is on), and sense that their overlap is correct (intuitive assessment, if it feels wrong, stand up and restart the PSR), and stays the same (no accidental movement).

Having said this, I wouldn't say I'm doing either of the two things you are proposing. I'm not focusing on where I want the CB to go, but I'm also not focusing on the cue direction. It's definitely closer to focusing on the CB than cue if I had to pick one, but I don't really focus on either, I trust that both of these will be correct and the ball will go in, given that I aimed at the correct overlap and execute my shot routine properly.
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Understood. Thanks.
 
dr_dave said:
Thanks, Bob. That's what I think also. And I agree that a "study" would be interesting.

It would also be interesting if more AZB members (especially the good players) let us know where they focus (desired CB direction or cue direction) during sidespin shots. If they are not sure, because it comes so intuitively, maybe they can pay attention to it the next time they get to table and report back.
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I focus on CB direction. I've gotten to a point where I mostly use entire shot visualization for initial alignment, but I still use BHE when I use sidespin. I focus on getting on center ball after shot visualization and stepping into the shot and then I just use BHE after taking two or three practice strokes, then after swinging my back arm out for sidespin and lowering or raising my bridge for draw or follow, I focus on CB path.

On practice strokes, I follow the path that the CB will take with my eyes as the cue comes toward the ball and then on my final stroke, I look only at the OB. I have, over the years, toyed with looking at the CB last and it works, but requires more wearying focus IME.

Jaden
 
dr_dave said:
...snip... is your focus or attention more on where you want the CB to hit at the OB (i.e., the ghost ball or ball overlap), or is it in the direction the cue is pointing, realizing that CB deflection will send the CB in the direction necessary to achieve the desired OB contact). There is a difference, due to CB deflection.
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I think very few focus their eyes in the direction of the stick. In all the years I've been on here, I don't recall anyone writing anything like that in the thousands of aiming posts. When I "discovered" it 10 months ago, I thought it was something new. I made the thread about it and only one player said he did that. It was poolmanis, which is a plus;)

To me, it seems the logical place to look. I've long gone by GenoMachino's ideals that the "eyes steer the stroke". This builds on that and would make the eyes steer the stroke straight. Most instruction is the opposite, and teach that the muscle memory in the arm makes the stroke go straight.

Does anyone align their site completely with the stick direction?

I have not tried this eye alignment method when I started the thread: Put your vision center aligned completely with the stick/stroke direction. Not with the CB, not with the OB, not with the "theoretical, non-friction" Ghost Ball. Let's call it a "ghost stick point" near the OB. If you are...
forums.azbilliards.com
 
iusedtoberich said:
I think very few focus their eyes in the direction of the stick. In all the years I've been on here, I don't recall anyone writing anything like that in the thousands of aiming posts. When I "discovered" it 10 months ago, I thought it was something new. I made the thread about it and only one player said he did that. It was poolmanis, which is a plus;)

To me, it seems the logical place to look. I've long gone by GenoMachino's ideals that the "eyes steer the stroke". This builds on that and would make the eyes steer the stroke straight. Most instruction is the opposite, and teach that the muscle memory in the arm makes the stroke go straight.

Does anyone align their site completely with the stick direction?

I have not tried this eye alignment method when I started the thread: Put your vision center aligned completely with the stick/stroke direction. Not with the CB, not with the OB, not with the "theoretical, non-friction" Ghost Ball. Let's call it a "ghost stick point" near the OB. If you are...
forums.azbilliards.com
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. I read through your thread. When using SAWS the way I recommend, you are almost forced into looking in the direction the cue is pointing. This often causes experienced students to think they aiming in a different place with SAWS than they do when aiming intuitively or by "feel" (without SAWS). That's one reason why I brought up these questions.
 
dr_dave said:
Thanks for the link. I read through your thread. When using SAWS the way I recommend, you are almost forced into looking in the direction the cue is pointing. This often causes experienced students to think they aiming in a different place with SAWS than they do when aiming intuitively or by "feel" (without SAWS). That's one reason why I brought up these questions.
Click to expand...
I use my shaft direction for aim. I am bad to to writing this stuff so i made video how I (and i believe SVB) aim with sidespin. I use only outside here with only variable being cut angle to make it more simple to understand and explain. Hard to do this foreign language :D
 
Poolmanis said:
I use my shaft direction for aim. I am bad to to writing this stuff so i made video how I (and i believe SVB) aim with sidespin. I use only outside here with only variable being cut angle to make it more simple to understand and explain. Hard to do this foreign language :D
Click to expand...

Thank you for sharing that. You definitely went beyond the "call of duty" on this one. Good job.
 
Poolmanis said:
I use my shaft direction for aim. I am bad to to writing this stuff so i made video how I (and i believe SVB) aim with sidespin. I use only outside here with only variable being cut angle to make it more simple to understand and explain. Hard to do this foreign language :D
Click to expand...
Nice video! I'm doing the exact same thing. When you called it "air" sometimes I find the shadow of the ball makes a line on the table that happens to align with either the center, left, or right edge of the shaft to be a good aiming point. Or sometimes there is a spot or defect in the cloth that is in the correct place. I "think" when I start missing, my eyes veer towards the Object Ball instead of that "spot" and messes me up.

On Shane's "Aiming my way" video, I don't recall he ever aimed in the "air". I recall he always had a spot "on the ball" that worked. That does not seem possible to me, and you showed its not possible on the shots you aimed in the "air". I might be mis-remembering it though.
 
One other thing with Geno-Machino's method, he has us move our head sideways until the shot picture just gets blurry, then move a hair back. The purpose is to get both eyes working together and find your individual "vision center". I've been doing that for 10 years, or whenever that was a big topic here, I forget now. (I think 15 years! wow time flies). What I did with this new method, is I combined his head shift with it. So I focus on this new "spot" with my eyes, but using his head shifting method to get my vision center aligned to that spot.
 
iusedtoberich said:
One other thing with Geno-Machino's method, he has us move our head sideways until the shot picture just gets blurry, then move a hair back. The purpose is to get both eyes working together and find your individual "vision center". I've been doing that for 10 years, or whenever that was a big topic here, I forget now. (I think 15 years! wow time flies). What I did with this new method, is I combined his head shift with it. So I focus on this new "spot" with my eyes, but using his head shifting method to get my vision center aligned to that spot.
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Hey, could you please clarify the details of this sideways head movement and shot picture clarity?

I'm looking to more precisely find my vision center and to define a rigorous pre-shot exercise to ensure that I am on it.

I'm a left-handed shooter whose vision center is somewhere between the nose and right eye, so I have to spend a little extra effort on my shots to get my head on point.

Thanks much
 
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