Pop quiz.. hotshot.. selling scenario
- Thread starter classiccues
- Start date
Hal said:
I agree with Hal and everbody else who said the same..
i recently bought a cue from another azer.. transaction went flawlessly..
after i got the cue, i didnt like the hit on it one bit.. but i never said one word about it.. i ended up sending it back to the original cue maker and he made some changes, now i absolutley love the cue and way it plays..
the hit of a cue has nothing to make the seller liable unless there is/or was something wrong with it that wasnt disclosed.. at one point, i was dying to sell the cue i had or even trade it up on another.. and i am so glad i didnt..
never once did i say, hey.. i dont like it.. i want my money back..
some people need to wake up and be reasonable.. what one person likes, the next might not.. i think the moral of the story is, know what your buying and be remember its not always the sellers fault.. he doesnt know what you like and what you dont..
chris
I think it is important to explain your return policy or lack of, prior to accepting payment. that way = no confusion. Sales on this sight to "end users" are mostly motivated by "the search for the Holy Grail." That's one of the big reasons this site exists. If they go to the local dealer, they can hit cues. If you/we are going to compete with the local dealer half way across the country, I think you/we are going to have to give the customer comparable peace of mind. Just my $.02
thanks-jeff
thanks-jeff
I agree that if you chalked it, hit with it, it's yours unless an agreement was made ahead of time. Just because you don't like the hit doesn't mean you can change your mind of the purchase.
Personally, I wouldn't be buying or trading for a cue that I don't how it hits. If I buy a Mottey or a Scruggs, I buy it for the looks because I already know how it hits.
I wouldn't go ahead and just pick up an unknown cuemaker's cue.
just my opinion...
Personally, I wouldn't be buying or trading for a cue that I don't how it hits. If I buy a Mottey or a Scruggs, I buy it for the looks because I already know how it hits.
I wouldn't go ahead and just pick up an unknown cuemaker's cue.
just my opinion...
Very interesting topic. Here's my experience:
I started out buying & selling cues because I wanted to learn about the different cuemakers and their different hit. I would find a cue that is reasonably priced so once I played with it & experienced the hit, I could sell it fairly quickly - and not at top dollar. I considered it a free education. If I liked the cue, I would keep it to play with it a little longer then make a decision of keeping for good or selling it. Because of this I was able to find out what I like in a cue, the right amount of deflection for me, balance, weight & feel of the hit when delivering a stroke. (There are a number of very good cuemakers out there)
Even though I have a few keepers, I continue to try out new cue makers stuff. After I play with them, I sell them locally to those that know I can be trusted to let them know how it plays & and allow them to try before they buy. I have outfitted many league players with their first "custom cues" as well as others (collectors included). At no time would I return a cue I buy here or else where unless it is not as described. After all, I bought the cue to try out the hit. If it's not to my liking, someone else will like it fine. But it is my responsibiltiy to find it a new home, not the sellers.
Just my opinion.
Dave
I started out buying & selling cues because I wanted to learn about the different cuemakers and their different hit. I would find a cue that is reasonably priced so once I played with it & experienced the hit, I could sell it fairly quickly - and not at top dollar. I considered it a free education. If I liked the cue, I would keep it to play with it a little longer then make a decision of keeping for good or selling it. Because of this I was able to find out what I like in a cue, the right amount of deflection for me, balance, weight & feel of the hit when delivering a stroke. (There are a number of very good cuemakers out there)
Even though I have a few keepers, I continue to try out new cue makers stuff. After I play with them, I sell them locally to those that know I can be trusted to let them know how it plays & and allow them to try before they buy. I have outfitted many league players with their first "custom cues" as well as others (collectors included). At no time would I return a cue I buy here or else where unless it is not as described. After all, I bought the cue to try out the hit. If it's not to my liking, someone else will like it fine. But it is my responsibiltiy to find it a new home, not the sellers.
Just my opinion.
Dave
Gotta agree with its in the dealings. If you make plans ahead of time to have a 'test' period, thats great. If you don't- don't cry about a cue. Simply turn around and sell it again. You now know enough to not buy that cue for a small fee (provided you resell it for a decent buck back). The seller is ONLY obligated to send out the package and get you a tracking number IMO. After that-its out of his/her hands.
On another note, jkmarshall- that is a damn nice looking cue. It sucks what happened to you, but as a cue maker, I take it you rely highly on word of mouth. At least this man can't have anything bad to say about you! I hope it all works out clean for you.
On another note, jkmarshall- that is a damn nice looking cue. It sucks what happened to you, but as a cue maker, I take it you rely highly on word of mouth. At least this man can't have anything bad to say about you! I hope it all works out clean for you.
Hay John
You are way to nice! I knew that already.
Nick
You are way to nice! I knew that already.
Nick
Well said
You are right on the mark, Sean. Personally, if I purchased a new cue and played with it for several days, there is no way my conscience would allow me to ask for a refund. It is no longer a new cue. If I disliked the cue that badly, I guess I would try and resell the cue, take my losses and learn from the situation.
Sincerely, Jim Kissinger
cueaddicts said:
You are right on the mark, Sean. Personally, if I purchased a new cue and played with it for several days, there is no way my conscience would allow me to ask for a refund. It is no longer a new cue. If I disliked the cue that badly, I guess I would try and resell the cue, take my losses and learn from the situation.
Sincerely, Jim Kissinger
Rackforcash said:
Dude.. I catch alot of flak around here for standing up for some of the China man's cues.. There are not very many people to agree with me.... well I am not so much pro-import persay... I am just anti-luxury cues...I cant pay 2K for a stick..sorry.. . either way...
There are quite a few afluent collectors on this site and high priced cues are sold almost daily... what fu**ing forum are you talking about guy? Not this one ...surely.
Do us all a favor.....
The thing that I've found wrong in the cue buying/selling business...is the sometimes lack of specific stated guarantees or return policies. A seller should, of course, guarantee the cue will be delivered as described. But to guarantee HIT satisfaction is a real stretch.
Rackforcash said:
Looking for a ban?
Keep it up.
cueaddicts said:
I agree with this. Since we're selling over the internet or by mail, sight unseen, there should be a reasonable inspection period and a full refund (less shipping) for returns.
I would also suggest that no matter how disappointed your are as a seller in getting a return, accept that it goes with the territory and take it back with a smile. Buyers can have a tendancy to panic when they realize they paid a lot of money for something they don't want. They are always exposed to risk in the return process, so they might be nervous and defensive. If you want to have good relations with your customers, you have to make them feel at ease dealing with you. So just bite the bullet, smile, and cheerfully refund them.
Believe me, they don't want to tell you this anymore than you want to hear it.
On new cues, if I were a dealer, I would have a big sticker made and put it on the outside of the plastic shipping sleeve, something like: "Note: This is a new, unchalked cue. Please review our return policy. We suggest testing the cue unchalked. Once this cue is chalked, any subsequent return will result in a 10% restocking fee."
Chris
My 2 cents:
Scenario A - If the cue was exactly as described, the cue is now his. If he wants to sell it because he didn't like the way it plays, maybe consign it for a lower cost or no consignment fee, but taking it back in a condition worse than what it was sold as is not an option. Again, this is ONLY if the cue is exactly as stated.
Scenario B - This one would have a little more leway on. If the cue was in used condition, playing with it doesn't really make it any more used. Grant it I'm not talking about a case where the cue was damaged by the new customer, or even one where the shafts are now VERY dirty/blue from this person. Then there is a difference in value, and should be adjusted accordingly.
I guess I can sum this question up like this: My responsibility as a seller means making sure the item is EXACTLY as described, if not, THAT is MY problem. It does NOT mean I am obligated to make sure the person likes what they bought. If it was exactly what they wanted, and exactly as described, not "liking" the cue is THEIR problem.
Scenario A - If the cue was exactly as described, the cue is now his. If he wants to sell it because he didn't like the way it plays, maybe consign it for a lower cost or no consignment fee, but taking it back in a condition worse than what it was sold as is not an option. Again, this is ONLY if the cue is exactly as stated.
Scenario B - This one would have a little more leway on. If the cue was in used condition, playing with it doesn't really make it any more used. Grant it I'm not talking about a case where the cue was damaged by the new customer, or even one where the shafts are now VERY dirty/blue from this person. Then there is a difference in value, and should be adjusted accordingly.
I guess I can sum this question up like this: My responsibility as a seller means making sure the item is EXACTLY as described, if not, THAT is MY problem. It does NOT mean I am obligated to make sure the person likes what they bought. If it was exactly what they wanted, and exactly as described, not "liking" the cue is THEIR problem.
I agree with Tate and Sean. I think the restocking fee should apply if you don't like the cue also minus shipping. At least for new unchalked cues. For used cues, full satisfaction within a reasonable timeframe agreed upon in advance. I am not normally worried about hit, but more worried about condition on a new cue. The only exception would be if you hit with a new cue and there is a click. The seller may not have known about it prior to the sell, but it would indicate a structural problem with the cue, and the seller and cuemaker should back their product.
I am currently working through somewhat of a problem in structural integrity of a cue that went through 2 hands but is virtually unplayed. Neither prior owner was aware of the problem, but it is pretty obvious that the cue came from the cuemaker that way. The cuemaker is going to, in this case, stand behind his product and fix my cue. After all is said and done, I will post a big kudos thread about the whole ordeal.
I am currently working through somewhat of a problem in structural integrity of a cue that went through 2 hands but is virtually unplayed. Neither prior owner was aware of the problem, but it is pretty obvious that the cue came from the cuemaker that way. The cuemaker is going to, in this case, stand behind his product and fix my cue. After all is said and done, I will post a big kudos thread about the whole ordeal.
I think it is fair to say that most cue dealers are pretty thorough as to the specs of any given cue found on their site. Also, most are pretty upfront as to condition.
At some point, the prospective purchaser has to take responsibility for asking any additional questions OR voicing concerns about any given cue being considered for purchase. It is also their responsibility to read/ask and clarify with the dealer/seller as to their policies on returns and refunds/restocking fees...as well as sharing with a dealer/seller any 'special' circumstances, ie; cannot inspect the cue right away upon delivery. All of this, in my opinion, is the responsibility of the BUYER!
I think that most would agree here that when the 'deal' is crystal clear-cut prior to the actual transaction, it generally goes crazy smooth for both parties involved...the are no surprises, and everyone is happy.
Now, as to an issue of wanting to return a cue after 3 days because of the 'hit'...well, I do not know about that one!
I am curious as to whether the ever-so subjective topic of 'hit' was discussed prior to the transaction? Actually, I am not even sure that that matters. As I just stated, it's is such an subjective topic...what may feel 'stiff' to me, may feel 'whippy' to some one else, (although I doubt it ).
I guess that I just do not think that 'hit' is a good enough reason to return a cue...especially after 3 days. We have all had to pay our dues finding the cues/cuemakers that work for us, it's not really something that can be taught...and it is not a dealer's job to educate...although many gladly will IF the right questions are asked.....and we're back to the buyer's responsibility again.
So I guess, in a long-winded sort of way, I would say that 'no', hit is not a reason to return a cue, especially after 3 days. However, should the dealer choose to try and accommodate the buyer, then there would definitely have to be a partial refund/restocking fee to bring the cue to selling condition and/or offset any devaluation that may have occurred.
Lisa
At some point, the prospective purchaser has to take responsibility for asking any additional questions OR voicing concerns about any given cue being considered for purchase. It is also their responsibility to read/ask and clarify with the dealer/seller as to their policies on returns and refunds/restocking fees...as well as sharing with a dealer/seller any 'special' circumstances, ie; cannot inspect the cue right away upon delivery. All of this, in my opinion, is the responsibility of the BUYER!
I think that most would agree here that when the 'deal' is crystal clear-cut prior to the actual transaction, it generally goes crazy smooth for both parties involved...the are no surprises, and everyone is happy.
Now, as to an issue of wanting to return a cue after 3 days because of the 'hit'...well, I do not know about that one!
I am curious as to whether the ever-so subjective topic of 'hit' was discussed prior to the transaction? Actually, I am not even sure that that matters. As I just stated, it's is such an subjective topic...what may feel 'stiff' to me, may feel 'whippy' to some one else, (although I doubt it ). I guess that I just do not think that 'hit' is a good enough reason to return a cue...especially after 3 days. We have all had to pay our dues finding the cues/cuemakers that work for us, it's not really something that can be taught...and it is not a dealer's job to educate...although many gladly will IF the right questions are asked.....and we're back to the buyer's responsibility again.
So I guess, in a long-winded sort of way, I would say that 'no', hit is not a reason to return a cue, especially after 3 days. However, should the dealer choose to try and accommodate the buyer, then there would definitely have to be a partial refund/restocking fee to bring the cue to selling condition and/or offset any devaluation that may have occurred.
Lisa
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On new cue's, I think hitting with it unchalked or a pay a restock fee is fair. Hard to really see how you like a cue unchalked, but then just because I buy something I don't like should I be able to return it? In most states I think there is a max amount of time where you can return any purchase if my memory is correct.
In my industry, computer networking, we deal with high dollar items that usually have a zero return policy with the suppliers. We will return items though if it doesn't work out the way it should. Sometimes you just have to eat a problem, instead of arguing over something that is small in the over all scope of things.
On used cues, when I sell them myself, I will take a return within 48 hours without asking any questions. After that I need a pretty good reason to return money. I figure if you've had a chance to hit with it, liked it, and then had buyers remorse when your wife found out that isn't really my problem. If I promised a refund with no questions in a certain time frame, then I will of course honor that time frame without questions. I prefer to have items returned to me first, unless its someone I trust. Most of the time I'm selling or buying from people that I know so hasn't been a issue as of yet.
In my industry, computer networking, we deal with high dollar items that usually have a zero return policy with the suppliers. We will return items though if it doesn't work out the way it should. Sometimes you just have to eat a problem, instead of arguing over something that is small in the over all scope of things.
On used cues, when I sell them myself, I will take a return within 48 hours without asking any questions. After that I need a pretty good reason to return money. I figure if you've had a chance to hit with it, liked it, and then had buyers remorse when your wife found out that isn't really my problem. If I promised a refund with no questions in a certain time frame, then I will of course honor that time frame without questions. I prefer to have items returned to me first, unless its someone I trust. Most of the time I'm selling or buying from people that I know so hasn't been a issue as of yet.
I just copied this from Billiard Warehouse website. I always thought this was a very fair return policy. Greg is a great guy to do business with..
At the Billiard Warehouse, we are completely obsessed with cues, so we know what an important decision it is when choosing your cue. Finding a cue that will fit your taste and budget at The Billiard Warehouse is extremely easy because we have the very best selection found anywhere; and at extremely discounted prices. Buying your cue from The Billiard Warehouse is simple with our
1. Buy your cue at The Billiard Warehouse from our huge selection of production or custom cues.
2. Play with your cue for 5 days.
3. If you are not satisfied with your cue, return it for credit towards another cue from The Billiard Warehouse.
Try a Cue Rules and Details:
You may exchange a cue up to three times for the Try a Cue Program. You have up to five days from the date you receive your cue to decide if you would like to return your cue. You must inform the Billiard Warehouse at 888-809-7665 by 5 pm on the 5th day you receive your cue. The Billiard Warehouse will give you a return number to authorize your return. You can not return your cue without authorization from The Billiard Warehouse, Inc. We must receive your cue within 10 days of your authorization of return. After 10 days, starting on the 11th day, there will be a late charge of $20.00 per day against your credit until we receive your cue. Once the late charges reach the value of your cue; the sale is considered final. You are responsible for returning the cue to The Billiard Warehouse via UPS, US Priority Mail or Federal Express, postage prepaid and insured for the full value of the cue. The cue must be returned in the original condition, free of any kind of damage. If the cue is damaged, the amount of repair plus 10% will be deducted from your credit. Normal chalk residue is not considered damage. Any kind of tip change, re-taper, or use of sand paper or anything abrasive on the shaft will void the try a cue Guarantee. After the 5 day try a cue period is over, cues can not be returned for any reason other than manufacturer's defect; in which case you will be given details to return your cue to the manufacturer for evaluation. If you do not insure your cue during its return, you are responsible for loss or damage. Unchalked cues can be returned for full refund or exchange for the purchase price of the pool cue. Shipping charges are non refundable. Returned chalked cues can only be returned for credit towards another cue from The Billiard Warehouse. No cash refunds are offered for chalked cues. Cues ordered with customs options including, but not limited to Custom Stain, Pearl, Joint, Length, Taper or Engraving options can not be returned or exchanged for any reason other than manufacturer's defect.
Dan
At the Billiard Warehouse, we are completely obsessed with cues, so we know what an important decision it is when choosing your cue. Finding a cue that will fit your taste and budget at The Billiard Warehouse is extremely easy because we have the very best selection found anywhere; and at extremely discounted prices. Buying your cue from The Billiard Warehouse is simple with our
1. Buy your cue at The Billiard Warehouse from our huge selection of production or custom cues.
2. Play with your cue for 5 days.
3. If you are not satisfied with your cue, return it for credit towards another cue from The Billiard Warehouse.
Try a Cue Rules and Details:
You may exchange a cue up to three times for the Try a Cue Program. You have up to five days from the date you receive your cue to decide if you would like to return your cue. You must inform the Billiard Warehouse at 888-809-7665 by 5 pm on the 5th day you receive your cue. The Billiard Warehouse will give you a return number to authorize your return. You can not return your cue without authorization from The Billiard Warehouse, Inc. We must receive your cue within 10 days of your authorization of return. After 10 days, starting on the 11th day, there will be a late charge of $20.00 per day against your credit until we receive your cue. Once the late charges reach the value of your cue; the sale is considered final. You are responsible for returning the cue to The Billiard Warehouse via UPS, US Priority Mail or Federal Express, postage prepaid and insured for the full value of the cue. The cue must be returned in the original condition, free of any kind of damage. If the cue is damaged, the amount of repair plus 10% will be deducted from your credit. Normal chalk residue is not considered damage. Any kind of tip change, re-taper, or use of sand paper or anything abrasive on the shaft will void the try a cue Guarantee. After the 5 day try a cue period is over, cues can not be returned for any reason other than manufacturer's defect; in which case you will be given details to return your cue to the manufacturer for evaluation. If you do not insure your cue during its return, you are responsible for loss or damage. Unchalked cues can be returned for full refund or exchange for the purchase price of the pool cue. Shipping charges are non refundable. Returned chalked cues can only be returned for credit towards another cue from The Billiard Warehouse. No cash refunds are offered for chalked cues. Cues ordered with customs options including, but not limited to Custom Stain, Pearl, Joint, Length, Taper or Engraving options can not be returned or exchanged for any reason other than manufacturer's defect.
Dan