PRO PLAYERS AND INSTRUCTORS - Why the controversy?

CJ Wiley

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
Like I've said many times, I'm friends with Randy G, his pool school here in Dallas and as far as I know we've never even had a disagreement. I played league with him and he even beat me the last time we played. I shook his hand and told him "nice game, you played well", there was not even the slightest animosity.

I've lost more pool games that most people could lose in their life times. I"ve won several too, but it's based on playing hundreds of thousands of games in my life time. I've always felt you have to learn how to lose to truly learn how to win in life.

People refer to me posting on here as advertising, yet this is a forum and many people advertise themselves, their products, their expertise and their opinions. Why am I so different. I do advertise, but it's on TV, Radio and in print ads. Most of my writing will be used in a book that's coming out later this year. I have one I'm doing on my road experiences and one on my instructional experiences with golf, tennis, martial arts, and of course pool.

Most people know I'm in the bar and restaurant business for the past 20 years, not the pool business. I do this as a hobby and use it to try to help other people with their games. There is very little money in this and overall since I've been posting on azbilliards I've spent much more than I can ever hope to make.

I've given away over 20 DVDs to members here,as well as signed posters and other memorabilia in "Goodwill" and in hopes that it makes someone happy. I do get more aggressive with the pictures and posts when people start attacking me personally, and who doesn't have a self defense mechanism? I've been attacked quite a bit and continue to be by lou, neal, pjslasher, scott, duckie, and others with "hidden identities".

This is not unusual in the least to me, I"ve been scrutinized ever since I became a champion player, but so does pros from other sports and certainly other pros in pool. If you don't have "haters" in life you're probably not making an impact is what Hank Haney used to tell me.

He wrote a book on Tiger Woods and his experience coaching him and got attacked from numerous people, far more than could ever attack me on this forum. Does he complain or fret about it? Not at all, he laughs about it because he knows it's part of being in the public light. These attacks say more about the person saying them than the people they are said about. On here "some" hide behind secret identities and they have the least impact because everyone knows what they are secretly doing on here.

I will continue to try to help people on here with their games and my azbilliards videos are due out soon. The whole reason I ever started on here is to help this web site with supplying video content to their new video department. I have 12 web sites I work with, this is one I do for fun and entertainment.

So far I really like most of the people I've encountered on here and have made many new friends and of course I'm back in touch with hundreds of old friends from years ago. I like Randy G. and if he posts something about his school on one of my threads I would not even give it a second glance. I'm of the opinion that people on here can write whatever they want as long as it's civil and not some kind of personal attack on anyone.

There is always a level of professionalism that can be maintained in the Game or in this Forum. "The Game and This Forum are the Teacher'
 
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Why controversy ? Because some people just live for controversy .
With others I would guess envy. I think it's a great addition to the forums myself. Keep on keepin on
 
I think you are great for AZ and the Pool community!

Too bad that so many people are so set in their ways and/or have some axe to grind if their own ideas differ from yours. They are threatened by your openness and good writing skills as well as your talent as a professional.

I for one admire you and I really like that it is very hard to ruffel your feathers.

You know your stuff and you stick by your guns in trying to teach but that is hard to accept by some of the posters on AZ.

AND you were a great player and maybe the one and only to be so open in trying to share your knowledge.

Thanks CJ!

--Jeff
 
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I will soon encourage many more professionals to get involved, as soon as it's ok

peteypooldude said:
Why controversy ? Because some people just live for controversy .
With others I would guess envy. I think it's a great addition to the forums myself. Keep on keepin on
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The "funny" thing about this experience on azbilliards Forum happens when I try to be "funny". I've never made so many harmless, humerus remarks that people have taken the "wrong way" in my life. For me, this is just a fun thing to do when I"m stuck at home working on other things. On a one to ten "seriousness scale" this ranks at a 1 or 2 compared to my "real life".

I'm in the nightclub/bar/restaurant business and it's stressful (to say the least). My main "forte" is consulting for bars and pool room and helping them with their advertising/marketing/ and "theft management" checks and balances through developing "end of day reports" (EODs) that show how much they profit or lose on any given day. This, from my experience is the difference between being successful and losing your business in some cases.

I have to say there's a passion I have for pool that will probably never leave me. Despite the negativity there's been a HUGE amount of enjoyment I've experienced from being a part of this forum. I will soon encourage many more professionals to get involved, as soon as it's appropriate. 'The Game is the Teacher'

 
Illegitimi non carborundum

Your posts have been a catalyst for me and have led me to try new and better things. Thank you. :thumbup:
The background noise is a shame and does make it hard at times to seperate the wheat from the chaf.
Hard to imagine what some peoples agendas are.:confused: I guess they do not realize their behaviour reflects on their Mother.

Bill Cosby had a routine about shop class and somebody putting a bullet in the furnace. The shop teacher asks "alright who put the bullet in the furnace?".........Silence. "Well, I guess you realize it reflects on your Mother when you put a bullet in the furnace!"........Voice from the class, "I didn't put no bullet in the furnace, and you stop talkin' about my Mama!"
 
I don't always understand everything you post like the hammer action of the wrist but I appreciate you imparting your knowledge and answering questions, even those from detractors, in a courteous and thoughtful manner. Your TOI has helped me as I have a tendency to line up slightly to the right of center. As for the aforementioned detractors, several of them always seem to inject negativity to any thread they contribute to, others just knock people who say something that is contrary to what they teach or believe. Your credentials speak for themselves. When I watched you in the mid 90's at the Bicycle Club you had a very, very strong, confident game. Keep contributing so those of us with open minds can keep learning.
 
Some are students of the game and some want everyone to join them playing hooky.

I doubt that I am alone in saying that if it weren't for this site and it's "advertisers" my game wouldn't be anywhere near where it is now. Because of those horrible ppl sharing their knowledge I learned quite a few things that I doubt I would have learned on my own. Even if I did figure it out on my own who knows when that would've happened.

I say keep class in session....all the bad kids can go to detention.
 
CJ, first off, in the spirit of your post, I would say just keep on keeping on. Your contributions are certainly appreciated and there is also a silent readership/audience on AZ that I am certain is following along on topics that interest them.

Secondly, will you do me (and possibly others) a small favor? Please go back to posting in normal font size, not the small type you've recently adopted. I'm a little old and your new size is very hard on my eyes to read. Sorry if it seems like I am picking a nit, but I'm serious... :embarrassed2:

Thanks for hanging out here and best wishes.

~Razor
 
Members should be thrilled to have you and your participation on the site. Lots of former players and some instructors advertise their services on this site by posting but most make several contributing posts as well.

In my opinion the forum is better with participation of former and current players. What other sport can we get to know the stars of the sport?

Do you think people would get upset if Tom Kite went on a golf forum and had a few things to add?

What about Jimmy Connors on a tennis forum?

Some people are just pissed. There is nothing the rest of us can do about it.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk
 
Ego

I think the answer in one word is ego.

As we all know ego's are huge in the pool world. In the pool room the battle of ego's is settled on the table. In the forums, unfortunately some people want to satisfy their ego with a battle of words debating knowledge of pool, the instruction of pool, etc. You, being a pro in real life pool, become a huge target.
 
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I couldn't agree more there pete.........

peteypooldude said:
Why controversy ? Because some people just live for controversy .
With others I would guess envy. I think it's a great addition to the forums myself. Keep on keepin on
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CJ has been part of our pool world for many years. It's good to have him back.

Class act all the way...........
 
just one thing, CJ, PJFidget has a better ring to it than PJSlasher, hope this helps:)

also, i like your style
 
The high road

There is a reason the high road is less traveled. Glad you found it and took it. Let the others get stuck in the mud on the low road.

Most of us that come here are not championship caliber and come here to learn from those that are. It's a treat to be taught. Ask a pro in any other sport to write an article trying to help less experienced players and see how far it gets you. I am not saying it does not happen, but much less likely.

If you are posting things in the wrong forum then it is for the moderators and the moderators alone to make that call.

Good luck and thanks, at least from me, for trying to help with my pool game.
 
OUSooner said:
Members should be thrilled to have you and your participation on the site. Lots of former players and some instructors advertise their services on this site by posting but most make several contributing posts as well.

In my opinion the forum is better with participation of former and current players. What other sport can we get to know the stars of the sport?

Do you think people would get upset if Tom Kite went on a golf forum and had a few things to add?

What about Jimmy Connors on a tennis forum?

Some people are just pissed. There is nothing the rest of us can do about it.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk
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Boomer Sooner! What about John McEnroe on the same tennis forum? As vile is John is/was? What about Earl being an active member here? Talk about Chernobyl:thumbup: I would love it if Earl were a regular... U'd just need Michaela Tabb to referee instead of Mr. Wilson:D

On the the flip side of the coin...at times it can seem like an "infomercial" to some folks? Can't ya just yak yak without trying to sell something...like the good ole days???
 
CJ Wiley said:
Teacher'
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CJ, i think age difference in the forum lead to a lot of none sense responses; you have posters as young as low 20's to as high as 80's. With pool being game heavily rely on experience, some of young guns think they figure it all out; but when they grow up they will say OHHHHHH CJ said this, damn i wish i listened..I have noticed today's young generation have very little patience to listening to older people, not sure if it is the computer age that did it or what; On the other hand, older people, hate to be found wrong, and want to stick to what they know best, until they find out!

If i were you i would change the tone of the responses to a softer style, giving others a benefit of the doubt, yet still express your opinion.
 
I for one am thankful for any info that you (CJ) and any other pros GIVE to me. I dont think the bashers could even screw your cue together without fouling. I would give anything to be able to play at your level so any little bit I get for FREE like you are giving us is appreciated.
 
Hi CJ

As I have said before, you are doing good things here.......but remember the funny saying from Judge Judy........"No good deed goes unpunished".........
It's part of life, no?
 
Not a problem with me, your posts get me thinking about the game.

Some people aren't happy unless they are putting somebody down or complaining about something.

They can't help being moronic.
 
Let me preface my remarks by saying that you, CJ, are an exception to the rule. For the most part, there are few who find the time to become elite players and instructors, and that's because each has a full-time job in attaining and maintaining excellence in his/her chosen pursuit, whether it be playing or instructing. You, on the other had, are among the few that has managed to find the time to excel at both, including the development of cutting edge training mnaterials.

The reason there's a little bit of friction between players and instructors is that there is so little money to be made in competing these days that many professional players who'd rather not do so have turned to instruction to help make ends meet. This makes them competitors with those who focus solely on pool instruction, and each has a financial motive to discredit the other's capabilities to instruct.

In short, in most other sports, the money is in playing, not in instructing, but sad times for pool have, more than ever, made the professional player and the professional instructor rivals in the instruction business, which pays over $50 per hour.

Hence, the controversy. If players made a big income from playing, I doubt many of them would wish to be instructors until after their retirement from competition.

Your posts on this forum are well presented, insightful, and they are made with respect for other members of this forum. You also respond with clarity and civility to the posts of others. That you give your own products and services a push in the context of forum discussions is, in my view, prefectly reasonable. I think that you are a credit to this forum.
 
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