Lol, i put that * mark there cause i was exaggerating. There is a llot more money up for grabs in which sport? wich one has more people trying to master?
pro players are they the best instructors?
- Thread starter lastdimetaker
- Start date
The one thing I learned as a House Pro was that anybody can be taught but not many can listen. That is.... Do what needs to be done. the difference between a guide and an instructor is seeing what needs to be assessed or applied to ONE person's needs to improve their game.
I could tell people "Certain things in this game are automatic and some other things are problematic.."
Basically saying I can teach and SHOW you certain shots that require almost no amount of skill to the other shots that require touch and feel... Feel and touch being the best you can explain to your student but do they hear of FEEL that?? NO!!! Saying.... "Just hit this lightly with a touch of inside..." is much more difficult than it seems. Its much easier to tell them to hit it hard and hope for the best but is this what they need or want?? HELL NO!!
The only thing they can do is give what you teach them with solid fundamentals to get them to that next level..
You have to show them the path and break it down to them the easiest way to that path. That is the hardest and most rewarding part of being an instructor...
I could tell people "Certain things in this game are automatic and some other things are problematic.."
Basically saying I can teach and SHOW you certain shots that require almost no amount of skill to the other shots that require touch and feel... Feel and touch being the best you can explain to your student but do they hear of FEEL that?? NO!!! Saying.... "Just hit this lightly with a touch of inside..." is much more difficult than it seems. Its much easier to tell them to hit it hard and hope for the best but is this what they need or want?? HELL NO!!
The only thing they can do is give what you teach them with solid fundamentals to get them to that next level..
You have to show them the path and break it down to them the easiest way to that path. That is the hardest and most rewarding part of being an instructor...
Pool instructors are they the best players?
You're right, pool is by far the easiest game I've ever played. I don't "cheer lead," however, I've always liked Badminton, tennis, ping pong, Foosball, golf, and my curling is coming along nicely.
We could start a thread POOL INSTRUCTORS ARE THEY THE BEST PLAYERS?....and of course it would fizzle out before it got started. I'm not sure why any of this matters, it's just humerus to contemplate. 'The Game is the Teacher'
Chris, this has always been a silly analogy to me, because some of the best baseball hitting instuctors NEVER played at the top level, heck some never got drafted out of college...(me included, but a pretty good hitting coach none the less)
Some of the best QB coaches in the NFL never played the position at the top level.
Some of the best NHL coaches NEVER competed at the top level in their sport.
Some of the best golf instructors never played top speed.
There has got to be a reason for that?? And pool cannot be so special, that it is the only sport on the planet, that only those that played pro level know what it takes to play top notch.
What makes pool so freaking special, when it is NOT even in the top 50 of difficulty to play...
No offense, but billiards ranked below such sports as curling, bowling, cheerleading, badminton, and ping pong... but billiards did finish one spot ahead of fishing..... fishing ??
I mean, I still love the game...but enough with the you need to be the top dog to teach a sport when the cheerleading coach can kick most of our arses
You're right, pool is by far the easiest game I've ever played. I don't "cheer lead," however, I've always liked Badminton, tennis, ping pong, Foosball, golf, and my curling is coming along nicely.
We could start a thread POOL INSTRUCTORS ARE THEY THE BEST PLAYERS?....and of course it would fizzle out before it got started. I'm not sure why any of this matters, it's just humerus to contemplate. 'The Game is the Teacher'
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IT DOES NOT MATTER.
Wherever you are in life is where you are. You have choices to make. In pool instruction the choice isn't neccesarily between one guy or the other for instruction. None of us are so broke that we are saving our pennies to go to pool school.
If you get the opportunity to take lessons or a lesson from a pro then take it. Be clear about what you want from them. If you get the opportunity to take a lesson from a well-known instructor then take it.
Both will have something to teach you. It's INSANE to go at each other's throats over who teaches better. INSANE and childish. You could argue about something that matters like which case protects better if you want to argue. ;-)
I mean REALLY - come on.
I have known Scott for close to 20 years now I guess. He is a good guy who has chosen to be a professional instructor as well as a trick shot artist. He has done a lot to keep pool alive traveling the country for decades and showing off the magic of making balls bend to your will to eager audiences.
CJ Wiley walks the walk, has gambled with and beaten the best of the best, competed and won at the highest levels, run a successful pool hall/nightclub, created a professional association and been responsible for the biggest payday pool has ever seen.
Both men are good guys who have done and continue to do a lot of good for the game. Jeeze guys do we have to really be so petty with each other?
You both have the same goal, make people play better. I seriously doubt that anyone who goes to either of you will be worse off than when they started. I am so close to uttering some words that would get me banned when I see two good guys cutting each other up like this.
Please stop.
Wherever you are in life is where you are. You have choices to make. In pool instruction the choice isn't neccesarily between one guy or the other for instruction. None of us are so broke that we are saving our pennies to go to pool school.
If you get the opportunity to take lessons or a lesson from a pro then take it. Be clear about what you want from them. If you get the opportunity to take a lesson from a well-known instructor then take it.
Both will have something to teach you. It's INSANE to go at each other's throats over who teaches better. INSANE and childish. You could argue about something that matters like which case protects better if you want to argue. ;-)
I mean REALLY - come on.
I have known Scott for close to 20 years now I guess. He is a good guy who has chosen to be a professional instructor as well as a trick shot artist. He has done a lot to keep pool alive traveling the country for decades and showing off the magic of making balls bend to your will to eager audiences.
CJ Wiley walks the walk, has gambled with and beaten the best of the best, competed and won at the highest levels, run a successful pool hall/nightclub, created a professional association and been responsible for the biggest payday pool has ever seen.
Both men are good guys who have done and continue to do a lot of good for the game. Jeeze guys do we have to really be so petty with each other?
You both have the same goal, make people play better. I seriously doubt that anyone who goes to either of you will be worse off than when they started. I am so close to uttering some words that would get me banned when I see two good guys cutting each other up like this.
Please stop.
I'll listen to you too John, just in "case".
You're right, of course, John. What starts out to be humorous banter can sometimes get personal and be taken personally. I will now practice self restraint and the meditative approach, and even if attacked will take pride in not responding without kindness and care.
These are the things I'm here to learn, the only thing I'll teach in return is just a "touch" of pool. And I'll listen to you too John, just in "Case".
'The Game is my Teacher'
You're right, of course, John. What starts out to be humorous banter can sometimes get personal and be taken personally. I will now practice self restraint and the meditative approach, and even if attacked will take pride in not responding without kindness and care.
These are the things I'm here to learn, the only thing I'll teach in return is just a "touch" of pool. And I'll listen to you too John, just in "Case".
'The Game is my Teacher'
I am talking specifically about pool.
I am NOT referring to any other sport.
And in regards to pool, learning high level pool IMO, is a very specific process, and professional mentors figure into that equation at a much higher % rate, then standard instructors.
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I am often amazed at how many people, simply DON'T GET IT.
But at the same time, how COULD they possibly know, unless they have seen it first hand?
We are not talking about one or two lessons from a professional.
We are talking about a specific block of time, where the pro mentor had access to the protege continuously, and exerted continuous influence over them.
Having watched 1st hand, and having heard and read about mentor/protege relationships of the past in pool, I would say that NO AMOUNT OF LESSONS from a regular instructor, can equal the value of the pro mentor/protege relationship, in terms of breeding a high level player.
You're right, of course, John. What starts out to be humorous banter can sometimes get personal and be taken personally. I will now practice self restraint and the meditative approach, and even if attacked will take pride in not responding without kindness and care.
These are the things I'm here to learn, the only thing I'll teach in return is just a "touch" of pool. And I'll listen to you too John, just in "Case".
Trust me I didn't get to 12,000+ posts by taking the right approach. You don't want the bulk of your content to be back and forth sniping with anyone.
Now I go back into some of the old threads and I am kind of ashamed of the way I allowed myself to be drawn in to the sniping. Even though I feel I was right almost all of the time I still wasted a lot of time on people who ultimately did not matter and for whom it was only sport to see how long they could get me to engage them.
I read some of things I wrote and think that's not who I am. I was raised to say yes sir, no maam, and not to start anything with anyone. But on a forum it's so easy to get into a downward spiral of defensive aggression that even nice people can show their mean side.
The people who matter are the ones who converse sincerely and debate respectfully. These are the ones who genuinely want to come to a mutual understanding. And the other people who matter are all the readers who don't post. And make no mistake, that is a LOT of people.
When you meet mean spirited comments with nice but firm rebuttals then the mean people just look foolish in the eyes of the other readers. And they themselves know that they can't continue to meet kindness with mean comments lest they be ostracized. But as long as like is met with like it just continues unchecked until a whole bunch of people are pissy and mad.
Anyway that's my forum wisdom, it took a six month ban for me to realize this. To me it's important to be able to speak on any forum that exists in my real name and voice. That is honestly a privilege, not a right. But it carries a responsibility to not allow oneself to be trolled in any way, whether maliciously or not. We have to be the ones the hold the higher standard as industry pros, amateurs can't be expected to. After all, as you said, pros are simply playing a different game.
To the topic:
Coaching vs. Instruction.
We hardly have any coaching in amateur pool in the United States. Nor was there coaching in Germany when I lived there from 89-99.
What there are though is plenty of instructors with whom anyone can book as many lessons as they can pay for. This rarely emulates a true coaching relationship and I say also it rarely goes in the same way as a coach would train an athlete.
To me an instructor has more of an arm's length relationship with a student trying to ascertain their weaknesses and work on them to the satisfaction of the student being about as hard as the student is willing to go.
A coach on the other hand tries very hard to make their charge strong on many levels through intense and rigorous training that takes the athlete into territory that is tough and frustrating in order to push their limits.
A coach goes to the tournaments, is there all the time. Uses a lot of motivational methods, knows their charge inside and out and which buttons to push at the right times. The same could be said of a mentor on some levels.
So we are kind of speaking about apples and oranges here.
For instruction, 8 hours with Stevie Moore, 8 hours with Jose Parica, 8 hours with Randy G. or Scott Lee I firmly believe that any student is going to come away with a lot of positive stuff to work on. They will be a better player when done. Will they learn the same things the same way? No. Not even if the instruction is branded and from a workbook that two instructors use the instruction will be different in some way.
Will it be helpful? Yes, unquestionably spending time with a professional player or a professional instructor will be helpful. Which one is MORE helpful is only something that a person who does both can compare for themselves and then it's only between the people he went to. My experience with Jose Parica might not be your experience. My experience with Stan Shuffett might not be your experience.
Whether an instructor or coach, professional player or not, there has to be some gelling between the student and the teacher. If for whatever reason that does not happen then the information flow will not be smooth. Just like a teacher you don't like and don't pay attention to. Her information could be the best on earth but if you could care less then you're not getting it. Change the teacher to one whom you like and she can present the same info and you will absorb it readily.
So there is no clear cut answer. Only that what ever you choose be ready to learn and think about what you really need to work on. For me personally when I go to an instructor I am asking them about my form. When I go to a pro I am asking them about strategy.
Coaching vs. Instruction.
We hardly have any coaching in amateur pool in the United States. Nor was there coaching in Germany when I lived there from 89-99.
What there are though is plenty of instructors with whom anyone can book as many lessons as they can pay for. This rarely emulates a true coaching relationship and I say also it rarely goes in the same way as a coach would train an athlete.
To me an instructor has more of an arm's length relationship with a student trying to ascertain their weaknesses and work on them to the satisfaction of the student being about as hard as the student is willing to go.
A coach on the other hand tries very hard to make their charge strong on many levels through intense and rigorous training that takes the athlete into territory that is tough and frustrating in order to push their limits.
A coach goes to the tournaments, is there all the time. Uses a lot of motivational methods, knows their charge inside and out and which buttons to push at the right times. The same could be said of a mentor on some levels.
So we are kind of speaking about apples and oranges here.
For instruction, 8 hours with Stevie Moore, 8 hours with Jose Parica, 8 hours with Randy G. or Scott Lee I firmly believe that any student is going to come away with a lot of positive stuff to work on. They will be a better player when done. Will they learn the same things the same way? No. Not even if the instruction is branded and from a workbook that two instructors use the instruction will be different in some way.
Will it be helpful? Yes, unquestionably spending time with a professional player or a professional instructor will be helpful. Which one is MORE helpful is only something that a person who does both can compare for themselves and then it's only between the people he went to. My experience with Jose Parica might not be your experience. My experience with Stan Shuffett might not be your experience.
Whether an instructor or coach, professional player or not, there has to be some gelling between the student and the teacher. If for whatever reason that does not happen then the information flow will not be smooth. Just like a teacher you don't like and don't pay attention to. Her information could be the best on earth but if you could care less then you're not getting it. Change the teacher to one whom you like and she can present the same info and you will absorb it readily.
So there is no clear cut answer. Only that what ever you choose be ready to learn and think about what you really need to work on. For me personally when I go to an instructor I am asking them about my form. When I go to a pro I am asking them about strategy.
Apples and Oranges...
I think we're dangerously close to an "apples and oranges" comparison here, and it's getting a little off track. IMHO, some (the good ones) professional/certified instructors are ideal for beginning to intermediate players for all the reasons cited here. In many cases where a pro player knows something's off with his game (primarily in mechanics), a certified instructor is a great way to quickly get to the bottom of it and help correct it.
For advanced players, a pro who's willing to teach offers a much more nuanced, effective route to improvement...everything from advanced techniques to the overlooked mental approach to competition (notice I didn't say pool...it's more than that), relating experience. Pros at the top level can almost all point to a mentor in their past who also played top level pool and was able to help guide them to the next level...knowing how to win, advanced techniques, tips, unorthodox techniques and strategy (how often have you seen a champion player do something you totally didn't expect, and then a light goes on, "ah ha!") I don't need a pro to be a top notch instructor, up on the latest learning theories...just the opportunity to spend quality time shooting with a AAA player is worth the money to an advanced player looking to improve.
Both instructors and pros (who are willing to share) have something unique to offer. We always complained on this board that no pro would bother to come on here and share...then a couple do and get attacked. We all need thick skin to play on this board, but we're all in the majority. CJ, Mike Dechaine and Stevie Moore are three against the world, here! As someone posted earlier, "this is why we don't get to have nice things..."
I think we're dangerously close to an "apples and oranges" comparison here, and it's getting a little off track. IMHO, some (the good ones) professional/certified instructors are ideal for beginning to intermediate players for all the reasons cited here. In many cases where a pro player knows something's off with his game (primarily in mechanics), a certified instructor is a great way to quickly get to the bottom of it and help correct it.
For advanced players, a pro who's willing to teach offers a much more nuanced, effective route to improvement...everything from advanced techniques to the overlooked mental approach to competition (notice I didn't say pool...it's more than that), relating experience. Pros at the top level can almost all point to a mentor in their past who also played top level pool and was able to help guide them to the next level...knowing how to win, advanced techniques, tips, unorthodox techniques and strategy (how often have you seen a champion player do something you totally didn't expect, and then a light goes on, "ah ha!") I don't need a pro to be a top notch instructor, up on the latest learning theories...just the opportunity to spend quality time shooting with a AAA player is worth the money to an advanced player looking to improve.
Both instructors and pros (who are willing to share) have something unique to offer. We always complained on this board that no pro would bother to come on here and share...then a couple do and get attacked. We all need thick skin to play on this board, but we're all in the majority. CJ, Mike Dechaine and Stevie Moore are three against the world, here! As someone posted earlier, "this is why we don't get to have nice things..."
Playing Pro Level Players
LastDimeTaker,
I have played some good players and most of them can comment on your decisions, what you did wrong, what you should have done and why. As far as straightening out your stance, talking to you about your stroke, explaining the 5 corner system or things like it, some can and some can't however the present a value all of their own. If you are lucky enough to be able to play someone who plays at a high level of play you should do it whenever you can. Even if you just pay them to play you. Quite often a player of that caliber isnt challenged by a lesser player and hesitate to play someone for funsies and truthfully they shouldnt. Their stock in trade is the knowledge of the game they have and its worth something for you to purchase. If you find someone way above your level and you pay them to have your brains beat out and you walk away with nothing its only your fault. If its a lesson you should be trying to remember what they did under what situations they did it. Yes I think its okay to play professional players but its also okay to try to get a value for it. If they know that you will be coming back for more and more...usually they will be kind to you on price...otherwise they price themselves out of a job. No shame in it at all. Its a lesson.
LastDimeTaker,
I have played some good players and most of them can comment on your decisions, what you did wrong, what you should have done and why. As far as straightening out your stance, talking to you about your stroke, explaining the 5 corner system or things like it, some can and some can't however the present a value all of their own. If you are lucky enough to be able to play someone who plays at a high level of play you should do it whenever you can. Even if you just pay them to play you. Quite often a player of that caliber isnt challenged by a lesser player and hesitate to play someone for funsies and truthfully they shouldnt. Their stock in trade is the knowledge of the game they have and its worth something for you to purchase. If you find someone way above your level and you pay them to have your brains beat out and you walk away with nothing its only your fault. If its a lesson you should be trying to remember what they did under what situations they did it. Yes I think its okay to play professional players but its also okay to try to get a value for it. If they know that you will be coming back for more and more...usually they will be kind to you on price...otherwise they price themselves out of a job. No shame in it at all. Its a lesson.
I felt that same feeling deep in my soul, this time I went out and played Basketball
I appreciate your input, I've followed your writing style and opinions with interest and a "curious eye". Even what other people said about your past "ban" gave me valuable input. You see I'm a student, not as much of the Game as I once was, but a student of human behavior and communication.
I needed to learn some things about myself and others involving patience and understanding. I still have my competitive "killer instinct" and the closer I get to the pool table the more power it has over me. I had an incident happen a few years ago that taught me a valuable lesson about this "part of me".
I had a good friend that once was a professional baseball player. He was a lot of fun to be around and we used to play golf two or three times a week. He was a charismatic guy that had a "way with the ladies," and I took a lot of mental notes when he interacted with women because still to this day he was the "best I'd ever seen".
He also played scratch golf and could consistently beat me, sometimes it was close and I would win (9 holes) occasionally, for the most part I never could win an entire day. He also "razzed" me about it and, with my competitive nature it was difficult to tolerate at times.
Many times I had to just take a deep breath to keep from snapping back at him and saying something that would not have been very positive. Or just snapping his neck, which also would not have been good for our friendship
(I'm kidding of course:wink.
One day after he beat me playing golf and rubbed it in my face the usual egotistic way he wanted to go to the pool room with me. He also played pool pretty decent and could run a rack on a 9' table once an hour or so. So, I agreed and we went to my pool room. When we got there he said "you haven't been playing very much lately, I bet you can't beat me playing pool right now either."
I looked at him and something deep in my soul started to churn....he was stirring up my killer instinct at a level I hadn't felt in a while, maybe sense I was gambling for a living. I said "you really think so....get the balls and let's find out!"
To make a long story short, I went into a deep trance, Dead Stroke is what we road players used to call it. I beat him over 50 games in a row and rarely even gave him a shot at his pocket. I did this without remembering much, like I always did when I gambled, except we weren't gambling for money. I guess the stakes were higher, we were betting our pride or maybe ego, I'll never really know. I just know not to "bet" with friends unless it can be a friendly "dollar amount".
After it was over, I "woke up" out of my trance and smiled at him. He didn't smile back, something had happened to him and I"ll never honestly know what that was for sure. You see I never saw him again.....he completely disappeared and would never return my messages. Still to this day I haven't seen him and that was over 8 years ago. I lost a good friend over a silly pool game, and it was because I couldn't control my killer instinct and desire to, not only win, but to demoralize my opponent.
I'm not proud of this quality, and I can't "destroy it," like the dragon or demon it can't be destroyed it can only be identified and trained to act in a different manner.....our dragons can not be killed educated from my past experience and what I'm told by older, wiser men.
This {Dragon behavior} was my M.O. in my gambling days and there are many people that can attest to it. I was not a very nice guy to gamble with, not because of what I said or did, because I never said anything and usually never even acknowledged my opponent. Other players said years later, "it was like the light was on, but you were not at home".
This is the way I learned to gamble when it was "life or death," and it's difficult to turn this "on and off." So I learned that important lesson years ago and for the first time yesterday when a guy challenged me to "give him the 2 out and the breaks {for pride or ego}," I felt that same feeling deep in my soul. Except this time I went out and played basketball (with Mary Avina) and when I came back I was feeling enlightened with a feeling of well being, not a feeling of "killer instinct" or negativity. Thank Goodness.
Today I am approaching things differently, and although I am still excited about releasing my new TOI video I will respect the fact that I can be overbearing at times. Not to sell, just to share something that I believe will make a difference in the world....the pool world that is. I am grateful that I didn't say or do something yesterday that could have cost me a friend or someone's future friendship. You see I am the student and, yes......'The Game/Life is the Teacher'
I appreciate your input, I've followed your writing style and opinions with interest and a "curious eye". Even what other people said about your past "ban" gave me valuable input. You see I'm a student, not as much of the Game as I once was, but a student of human behavior and communication.
I needed to learn some things about myself and others involving patience and understanding. I still have my competitive "killer instinct" and the closer I get to the pool table the more power it has over me. I had an incident happen a few years ago that taught me a valuable lesson about this "part of me".
I had a good friend that once was a professional baseball player. He was a lot of fun to be around and we used to play golf two or three times a week. He was a charismatic guy that had a "way with the ladies," and I took a lot of mental notes when he interacted with women because still to this day he was the "best I'd ever seen".
He also played scratch golf and could consistently beat me, sometimes it was close and I would win (9 holes) occasionally, for the most part I never could win an entire day. He also "razzed" me about it and, with my competitive nature it was difficult to tolerate at times.
Many times I had to just take a deep breath to keep from snapping back at him and saying something that would not have been very positive. Or just snapping his neck, which also would not have been good for our friendship
(I'm kidding of course:wink.One day after he beat me playing golf and rubbed it in my face the usual egotistic way he wanted to go to the pool room with me. He also played pool pretty decent and could run a rack on a 9' table once an hour or so. So, I agreed and we went to my pool room. When we got there he said "you haven't been playing very much lately, I bet you can't beat me playing pool right now either."
I looked at him and something deep in my soul started to churn....he was stirring up my killer instinct at a level I hadn't felt in a while, maybe sense I was gambling for a living. I said "you really think so....get the balls and let's find out!"
To make a long story short, I went into a deep trance, Dead Stroke is what we road players used to call it. I beat him over 50 games in a row and rarely even gave him a shot at his pocket. I did this without remembering much, like I always did when I gambled, except we weren't gambling for money. I guess the stakes were higher, we were betting our pride or maybe ego, I'll never really know. I just know not to "bet" with friends unless it can be a friendly "dollar amount".
After it was over, I "woke up" out of my trance and smiled at him. He didn't smile back, something had happened to him and I"ll never honestly know what that was for sure. You see I never saw him again.....he completely disappeared and would never return my messages. Still to this day I haven't seen him and that was over 8 years ago. I lost a good friend over a silly pool game, and it was because I couldn't control my killer instinct and desire to, not only win, but to demoralize my opponent.
I'm not proud of this quality, and I can't "destroy it," like the dragon or demon it can't be destroyed it can only be identified and trained to act in a different manner.....our dragons can not be killed educated from my past experience and what I'm told by older, wiser men.
This {Dragon behavior} was my M.O. in my gambling days and there are many people that can attest to it. I was not a very nice guy to gamble with, not because of what I said or did, because I never said anything and usually never even acknowledged my opponent. Other players said years later, "it was like the light was on, but you were not at home".
This is the way I learned to gamble when it was "life or death," and it's difficult to turn this "on and off." So I learned that important lesson years ago and for the first time yesterday when a guy challenged me to "give him the 2 out and the breaks {for pride or ego}," I felt that same feeling deep in my soul. Except this time I went out and played basketball (with Mary Avina) and when I came back I was feeling enlightened with a feeling of well being, not a feeling of "killer instinct" or negativity. Thank Goodness.
Today I am approaching things differently, and although I am still excited about releasing my new TOI video I will respect the fact that I can be overbearing at times. Not to sell, just to share something that I believe will make a difference in the world....the pool world that is. I am grateful that I didn't say or do something yesterday that could have cost me a friend or someone's future friendship. You see I am the student and, yes......'The Game/Life is the Teacher'
Just as I figured
I knew it, I knew it. Now everybody's friends again and I will never get
50% better. Stakehorses and side betters beware it will be the same old
doggin Jack. I'll just wait on the DVD to come out like everyone else. Had
my tap shoes re-chromed for nothing.
jack
I knew it, I knew it. Now everybody's friends again and I will never get
50% better. Stakehorses and side betters beware it will be the same old
doggin Jack. I'll just wait on the DVD to come out like everyone else. Had
my tap shoes re-chromed for nothing.
jack
What quantifies as easy??? Ever tried to catch a 50lb BFT with 15lb when that is all they will bite??? There is fishing and there is FISHING. Sitting is a chair is not what I consider fishing.
I appreciate your input, I've followed your writing style and opinions with interest and a "curious eye". Even what other people said about your past "ban" gave me valuable input. You see I'm a student, not as much of the Game as I once was, but a student of human behavior and communication.
I needed to learn some things about myself and others involving patience and understanding. I still have my competitive "killer instinct" and the closer I get to the pool table the more power it has over me. I had an incident happen a few years ago that taught me a valuable lesson about this "part of me".
I had a good friend that once was a professional baseball player. He was a lot of fun to be around and we used to play golf two or three times a week. He was a charismatic guy that had a "way with the ladies," and I took a lot of mental notes when he interacted with women because still to this day he was the "best I'd ever seen".
He also played scratch golf and could consistently beat me, sometimes it was close and I would win (9 holes) occasionally, for the most part I never could win an entire day. He also "razzed" me about it and, with my competitive nature it was difficult to tolerate at times.
Many times I had to just take a deep breath to keep from snapping back at him and saying something that would not have been very positive. Or just snapping his neck, which also would not have been good for our friendship
One day after he beat me playing golf and rubbed it in my face the usual egotistic way he wanted to go to the pool room with me. He also played pool pretty decent and could run a rack on a 9' table once an hour or so. So, I agreed and we went to my pool room. When we got there he said "you haven't been playing very much lately, I bet you can't beat me playing pool right now either."
I looked at him and something deep in my soul started to churn....he was stirring up my killer instinct at a level I hadn't felt in a while, maybe sense I was gambling for a living. I said "you really think so....get the balls and let's find out!"
To make a long story short, I went into a deep trance, Dead Stroke is what we road players used to call it. I beat him over 50 games in a row and rarely even gave him a shot at his pocket. I did this without remembering much, like I always did when I gambled, except we weren't gambling for money. I guess the stakes were higher, we were betting our pride or maybe ego, I'll never really know. I just know not to "bet" with friends unless it can be a friendly "dollar amount".
After it was over, I "woke up" out of my trance and smiled at him. He didn't smile back, something had happened to him and I"ll never honestly know what that was for sure. You see I never saw him again.....he completely disappeared and would never return my messages. Still to this day I haven't seen him and that was over 8 years ago. I lost a good friend over a silly pool game, and it was because I couldn't control my killer instinct and desire to, not only win, but to demoralize my opponent.
I'm not proud of this quality, and I can't "destroy it," like the dragon or demon it can't be destroyed it can only be identified and trained to act in a different manner.....our dragons can not be killed educated from my past experience and what I'm told by older, wiser men.
This {Dragon behavior} was my M.O. in my gambling days and there are many people that can attest to it. I was not a very nice guy to gamble with, not because of what I said or did, because I never said anything and usually never even acknowledged my opponent. Other players said years later, "it was like the light was on, but you were not at home".
This is the way I learned to gamble when it was "life or death," and it's difficult to turn this "on and off." So I learned that important lesson years ago and for the first time yesterday when a guy challenged me to "give him the 2 out and the breaks {for pride or ego}," I felt that same feeling deep in my soul. Except this time I went out and played basketball (with Mary Avina) and when I came back I was feeling enlightened with a feeling of well being, not a feeling of "killer instinct" or negativity. Thank Goodness.
Today I am approaching things differently, and although I am still excited about releasing my new TOI video I will respect the fact that I can be overbearing at times. Not to sell, just to share something that I believe will make a difference in the world....the pool world that is. I am grateful that I didn't say or do something yesterday that could have cost me a friend or someone's future friendship. You see I am the student and, yes......'The Game/Life is the Teacher'
You sir, are refreshingly well spoken....
Let's just say this..... I would take Cj Wiley or Stevie Moore over basically any other non pro instructor in the states.... Some other pros may not be able to teach very well but Cj Wiley obviously has the skills to help others improve, I think he's already proven that by now.
I believe Scott, Randy, Stan, and quite a few others have proven themselves as well, and in spades... just saying :grin-square:
There is a difference between instructing someone and coaching someone.
Instructing someone is more about the how to's and what for's. Coaching is providing ongoing feedback of your performance over a period of time.
As example, I've mentioned I raced motorcycles. The wife was my pit crew, so to speak. During this one practice session, I thought I was flying through this one turn. I was really pleased at how well I thought I was doing.
Got back to the pits and the wife asked how come I was slowing down more than the others in the turn I thought I was flying through. She had never raced, and at the time, had limited seat time on a motorcycle. But she knew enough to give me some feedback on what I was really doing v what I thought I was doing.
From that point on, I asked her to watch certain turns and let me know what I was doing. My lap times dropped. She became my racing coach and yet never had raced. This is what I mean by long term observation. You can go to a instructor for a lesson, but this doesn't help unless they can observe you on a regular basis. like almost every time you practice or play, like the coaches do in pro sports.
One final example about another set of eyes during competition helps . I have been stopped by this one player. His stroke and CB control is unreal. Problem is, he doesn't come around much. Anyway, after one really bad match against him after doing great the week before, he mentioned that in the match I did great in, I was stroking straighter. That's coaching in that he had observed by playing in the past and spotted the difference between the two matches during competition.
FWIW, I was a instructor for 4 years in the Navy and after that provided instructions and training on security systems I designed and installed. So, I do know a little about what it takes to be a effective instructor.
Instructing someone is more about the how to's and what for's. Coaching is providing ongoing feedback of your performance over a period of time.
As example, I've mentioned I raced motorcycles. The wife was my pit crew, so to speak. During this one practice session, I thought I was flying through this one turn. I was really pleased at how well I thought I was doing.
Got back to the pits and the wife asked how come I was slowing down more than the others in the turn I thought I was flying through. She had never raced, and at the time, had limited seat time on a motorcycle. But she knew enough to give me some feedback on what I was really doing v what I thought I was doing.
From that point on, I asked her to watch certain turns and let me know what I was doing. My lap times dropped. She became my racing coach and yet never had raced. This is what I mean by long term observation. You can go to a instructor for a lesson, but this doesn't help unless they can observe you on a regular basis. like almost every time you practice or play, like the coaches do in pro sports.
One final example about another set of eyes during competition helps . I have been stopped by this one player. His stroke and CB control is unreal. Problem is, he doesn't come around much. Anyway, after one really bad match against him after doing great the week before, he mentioned that in the match I did great in, I was stroking straighter. That's coaching in that he had observed by playing in the past and spotted the difference between the two matches during competition.
FWIW, I was a instructor for 4 years in the Navy and after that provided instructions and training on security systems I designed and installed. So, I do know a little about what it takes to be a effective instructor.
It's not my intention to figure out "why?", just to follow my path and see where
Thanks Randy, and I like that picture on your avatar, Francisco sure delivers that cue perfectly down the shot line.
I'm sharing my "truth," not the truth, just my truth. I am under the impression it's the thing to do right now. It's not my intention to figure out "why?", just to follow my path and see where it leads. 'The Game is my Teacher'
Thanks Randy, and I like that picture on your avatar, Francisco sure delivers that cue perfectly down the shot line.
I'm sharing my "truth," not the truth, just my truth. I am under the impression it's the thing to do right now. It's not my intention to figure out "why?", just to follow my path and see where it leads. 'The Game is my Teacher'
TheThaiger
Banned
If there's room on AZ Billiards for CJ Wiley and Stevie Moore, there should be room on AZ Billiards for Patrick Johnson and Neil.