Pro side of pocket?

PoolBum:
I believe the pro side of a pocket would be the inside.
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This is the correct answer. Pros don't aim for the best miss.

Cheating the pocket causes everybody, pro and amateur, to miss more often. "Cheating on the pro side" means you're trying to miss the shot more often so you won't leave as good a shot for your opponent. The only sure way to not leave your opponent a shot is to make your shot.

pj
chgo
 
When I miss on the "pro" side of the pocket, I just figure I missed it SO bad, I left it bad for my opponent.
 
The pro side is the side of the pocket is the side that offers you a facing, therefore improving your % to make the shot.

Defined: Most players line up shots straight for the back of the center of the pocket, but professionals aim shots to cross over the center of the pocket opening (the line of aim takes the ball across the middle of the felt and into empty space).

In other words, a shot coming in from the player’s right cross the middle of the felt semi-circle inside the pocket and if still has speed left, flies into the left side of the pocket backing. Thus, the “pro side of the pocket” is the left side of the back coming from the right side.
 
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Dawg:
Most players line up shots straight for the back of the center of the pocket
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They do? I don't. It seems natural to me to aim for the center of the opening (at the front of the pocket). Why would you do it any other way?

pj
chgo
 
Obviously when you play to the pro side, you are still trying to pocket the ball. You have to play the percentages. And if the thought of "pro side" even pops in your head, it must be a tougher shot than you would like... in which case, the odds of missing increase. You clearly want to pocket the ball, but that doesnt always happen. Even the best miss.

"You don't leave much when you miss, do ya fat man?"
 
cleary said:
Obviously when you play to the pro side, you are still trying to pocket the ball. You have to play the percentages. And if the thought of "pro side" even pops in your head, it must be a tougher shot than you would like... in which case, the odds of missing increase. You clearly want to pocket the ball, but that doesnt always happen. Even the best miss.
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I think this is bad reasoning. Increasing the number of times you'll leave a poor shot for your opponent doesn't make up for increasing the number of times you'll miss your own shot.

What I've heard most often from pros about this is that you should either commit fully to the shot or commit fully to a safety.

pj
chgo
 
SloRoller said:
Wow,ok, thanks guys. I think I get it now.

I agree with Neil, I just aim for the center of the pocket and hope to make the ball.

I am reading a pool book (Zen Pool) and it states this about the pro side:

"The professional side of the pocket is the actual opening, as opposed to the visual entity of the pocket. This will help you avoid hitting the rail on the way in."

This statement confused me and you explanations are more clear.

Zen is deep....lol


SR
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Here's an illustration of what the book is saying, which is different than what I've usually heard "the pro side" defined as (I've usually heard sjm's definition of the side that will bring a better outcome if you miss).

Consider these two shots:

CueTable Help



The 1 ball has been shot towards the center of "the visual entity of the pocket". The 2 ball has been shot toward the center of the pocket opening. You can see that the 1 ball will hit the rail on the way towards the pocket, decreasing the chances of pocketing it, especially if you shoot it hard. The 2 ball should drop no matter how hard you hit it, because it's going directly into the opening of the pocket.

-Andrew
 
I think Patrick and Dawg are on the right track with this one.... The diagram below is how the pro side was explained to me by a pro player. In this example the pro side would be the left pocket facing as you look at it because it affords the greatest probability of making the ball. You are using the left facing as a backboard of sorts, if you hit the center of the pocket its good, if you hit the pro side (left facing) even better because the english imparted on the OB from the CB will help spin the ball into the pocket. But if you hit the ameteur side (the side rail) it may go on a bucket table but the tighter the table the odds go way down..... JMO

It's not a case of what is the best way to miss but which shot gives you the best chance of making the ball........ Pros don't think much about missing....

CueTable Help

 
Andrew Manning said:
Here's an illustration of what the book is saying, which is different than what I've usually heard "the pro side" defined as (I've usually heard sjm's definition of the side that will bring a better outcome if you miss).

Consider these two shots:

CueTable Help



The 1 ball has been shot towards the center of "the visual entity of the pocket". The 2 ball has been shot toward the center of the pocket opening. You can see that the 1 ball will hit the rail on the way towards the pocket, decreasing the chances of pocketing it, especially if you shoot it hard. The 2 ball should drop no matter how hard you hit it, because it's going directly into the opening of the pocket.

-Andrew
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I didn't read your explainations, just saw the diagrams....

The shot on the one, your diagram shows you shooting to the amatuer side (see how you angle does not offer you the pocket facing and does not cross the front of the pocket?

Shot on the two you are shooting the pro side. see how your angle crosses the center of the pocket and is hitting the pocket facing and deflecting into the pocket?


The Saw said:
I think Patrick and Dawg are on the right track with this one.... The diagram below is how the pro side was explained to me by a pro player. In this example the pro side would be the left pocket facing as you look at it because it affords the greatest probability of making the ball.

CueTable Help

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BINGO. DEAD NUTS. that's the pro side.

Don't make it harder than it is... the pro side is the side which offers you the pocket facing.
 
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Patrick Johnson said:
I think this is bad reasoning. Increasing the number of times you'll leave a poor shot for your opponent doesn't make up for increasing the number of times you'll miss your own shot.

What I've heard most often from pros about this is that you should either commit fully to the shot or commit fully to a safety.

pj
chgo
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Patrick, as I said, you are still aiming to pocket the ball which is the number 1 goal. It just doesn't always work out. You are still aiming for the pocket. Depending on the table, you should have a lot of room to work with.
 
The Saw said:
I think Patrick and Dawg are on the right track with this one.... The diagram below is how the pro side was explained to me by a pro player. In this example the pro side would be the left pocket facing as you look at it because it affords the greatest probability of making the ball. You are using the left facing as a backboard of sorts, if you hit the center of the pocket its good, if you hit the pro side (left facing) even better because the english imparted on the OB from the CB will help spin the ball into the pocket. But if you hit the ameteur side (the side rail) it may go on a bucket table but the tighter the table the odds go way down..... JMO

It's not a case of what is the best way to miss but which shot gives you the best chance of making the ball........ Pros don't think much about missing....

CueTable Help

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Danny Basavich showed me this version of pro side. I still struggle figuring out which side is which from shot to shot. :(
 
sjm said:
Here's an example from the game of nine ball, as noted by Woody. In the shot on the nine below, cutting it on the left side of the object ball toward the corner pocket, the pro side of the corner pocket is the overcut side, because if your speed is correct for the situation, an overcut will leave opponent a very difficult position. The amateur side, however, is the undercut side of the pocket, and you'll usually sell out if you miss on that side of the corner pocket.

CueTable Help

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Well done as usual S Man!
 
cleary said:
Danny Basavich showed me this version of pro side. I still struggle figuring out which side is which from shot to shot. :(
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Ok.... Do you know what the pocket facing is? whatever angle offers you the ability to hit a pocket facing is the pro side. If the is ZERO chance of hitting a pocket facing that is the amatuer side... the side of the pocket that offers you the ability of hitting the pocket facing and the ball rebounding in is the pro side.

So now it should be easy to figure out... which side of the pocket offers you a chance of hitting the facing (inside edge if the pocket ie; rail) and the ball deflecting into the pocket... that's the pro side.

***coincedently that side of the pocket also offers best chance of not "selling out" based on angles of deflection should you miss the shot.

 
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Neil said:
I've always found this concept rather odd. I'm aiming to make the ball. If I miss it, I can't control how I am going to miss it. If I could, I wouldn't miss it. I think that what happens, is some tend to want to miss on the pro side if they miss, so they automatically end up overcutting the shot. Then feel good that they missed on the pro side.

I think that if they had only been concentrating on MAKING the shot, and NOT on how they were going to MISS it, they would have made it in the first place.

Sure, it's better to miss on the pro side. But, if you can control how you are accidentaly missing, why on earth are you missing anything??
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When we talk about missing on the pro side, usually it is in reference to a long difficult cut shot that a pro player has over cut. It may have been a 50-50 shot at best. Yes they wanted to make the shot but were also playing the leave in case they missed. In this case many pros will slightly over cut a ball, aiming for the high side of the pocket. If they do miss they want to leave their opponent a difficult shot/leave. The "miss" actually turns out to be a good safety. And that's good pool, as played by the pros.
 
jay helfert said:
When we talk about missing on the pro side, usually it is in reference to a long difficult cut shot that a pro player has over cut. It may have been a 50-50 shot at best. Yes they wanted to make the shot but were also playing the leave in case they missed. In this case many pros will slightly over cut a ball, aiming for the high side of the pocket. If they do miss they want to leave their opponent a difficult shot/leave. The "miss" actually turns out to be a good safety. And that's good pool, as played by the pros.
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Yes, and to make it simple to remember (this is how I remember)... it is the only side that offers a pocket facing. on any given cut shot there is always only one side of the pocket that offers the ability to hit a pocket facing. In most cases it's a over cut. In some it could be an undercut though. For example... in this shot...
proside.jpg


if you were to move the cueball over a few inches to the rail and slice the ball into the same pocket, to hit the pro side or the side that offers the facing you would actually be slightly undercutting it. pro side; it is the side of the pocket that offers the ability to hit the pocket facing... coincedently that side of the pocket also offers best chance of not "selling out" based on angles of deflection should you miss the shot.

Hope this helps
 
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cleary said:
Patrick, as I said, you are still aiming to pocket the ball which is the number 1 goal. It just doesn't always work out. You are still aiming for the pocket.
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You're aiming for less of the pocket, so it will "work out" even less often.

If I'm faced with a shot that I'm unsure of, I won't reduce my already small chances of making it so I might get safe when I miss. I'll either shoot for the center of the pocket or I'll shoot a good safety - not a half-assed version of both.

pj
chgo
 
SloRoller said:
Been reading a pool book and it mentions the pro side of a pocket but doesn't go into any details about it. I have heard this expression before but not sure exactly what this is.

Most of the time I heard it is after a bank and they hit it short and leave the object ball in the middle of the rail.

This intrigues me as I am having a issue with position lately.

thanks
SR
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I haven't read the responses yet but I "believe" missing to the pro side just means you got a roll.

I've had people explain it to me as missing the best way possible but if I tried that I would just miss more, so I don't do that. Of course I cheat the pocket from time to time if I need to when I'm up close but on a long shot, it's center cut for me.
 
Patrick's got it right. While you might need to hit the fat or thin side of a pocket to increase your chances of making it go in, 100% of your aiming should be focused on making it go in. Not 80% on making it go in and 20% getting a good roll if you miss.

To those who still want to aim to miss... Say you see a shot where aiming to overcut slightly will give you a "pro side" miss. So you aim to overcut the ball a hair 'just in case'. The ball proceeds to miss the pocket because it was overcut a hair. Ask yourself: "Am I truly surprised and pleased with this outcome?"
 
Andrew Manning said:
Here's an illustration of what the book is saying, which is different than what I've usually heard "the pro side" defined as (I've usually heard sjm's definition of the side that will bring a better outcome if you miss).

Consider these two shots:

CueTable Help



The 1 ball has been shot towards the center of "the visual entity of the pocket". The 2 ball has been shot toward the center of the pocket opening. You can see that the 1 ball will hit the rail on the way towards the pocket, decreasing the chances of pocketing it, especially if you shoot it hard. The 2 ball should drop no matter how hard you hit it, because it's going directly into the opening of the pocket.

-Andrew
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So the visual entity of the pocket is that your aiming for the pocket as a whole. (hole:grin-square:)

Whereas aiming at the actual opening,you are aiming for a specific spot in the pocket? That sound right?

To me given the explanations here on the board, this sounds different than what the pro side of a pocket is.

I never paid much attention to exactly where I am aiming, generally I aim for the pocket as a whole (except for cheating the pocket of course). I might look into this a bit more on my next practice round.

thanks
SR
 
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