Question about Kinister's shot# 1
- Thread starter pmata814
- Start date
No need for two hole reinforcements. Just one for the OB. Once you shoot the shot, before you move the CB, you try to replace the OB on the HR, and OBSERVE where the CB is. It should be directly in line with the OB, on the straight line to the pocket, and up against the OB. Can I do it? Yep! In one try...NOPE! Like I said...this is the example we want our students to TRY to achieve...I never said it was easy! I'd have to agree with your assessment that an elite pro couldn't do it either...which is just more ammunition on the difficulty of the drill...which is called The Stop Shot Drill! 
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
It sure is...which is why it's vital to understand and be able to deliver a perfect stop shot. It's always about speed and spin (or skid if you're playing true centerball). Understanding the stop shot is the foundation for learning how to move the CB accurately around the table.
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
"He was on a 7'er when he said that. On a 9'er, you must hit a hair low or you have to hit the CB at the speed of light."
I got the DVD a year ago. The camerawork is a little funky and everything looks foreshortened. The balls look more ovoid than round. I was having trouble making the shot on a 9-footer with center ball. So I called Bert and asked him if it was a barbox or a 9-footer in the video. He said it was a 9-footer.
I got the DVD a year ago. The camerawork is a little funky and everything looks foreshortened. The balls look more ovoid than round. I was having trouble making the shot on a 9-footer with center ball. So I called Bert and asked him if it was a barbox or a 9-footer in the video. He said it was a 9-footer.
No way.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6zBTXwTHGs
Go to 1:00 where he lays his cue on the table. That's a pretty small table.
at 2:04 you can see the ball return on the side of the table (prob from when the table was a coin-op).
I don't disagree, just repeating what he told me.
Stun vs Stop
According to the Billiard Encyclopedia you are correct. I should have called it a 'stun through' shot.
As far as your center ball question, this is the way Bert explained it to me over the phone and it made a world of difference.
Both the q ball and your tip have a curvature to them. When people talk center ball, yes it has an exact center, but if you hit center ball or slightly below center, and using the uper half of the curvature of your tip, you will create the slide or drag on the q ball. When the q ball changes from slide to follow that is when contact on the OB is made and it will roll forward. Look at this shot from a physics point of view. You are trying to achieve that perfect balance between weight and mass of the balls, speed, slide or drag and all the other factors to make a mass replace a mass. Use a striped ball, stripe horizontal, and a well chalked q, hit the shot and you will see how little below or close to center you need to have the top side of your q to execute this shot.
According to the Billiard Encyclopedia you are correct. I should have called it a 'stun through' shot.
As far as your center ball question, this is the way Bert explained it to me over the phone and it made a world of difference.
Both the q ball and your tip have a curvature to them. When people talk center ball, yes it has an exact center, but if you hit center ball or slightly below center, and using the uper half of the curvature of your tip, you will create the slide or drag on the q ball. When the q ball changes from slide to follow that is when contact on the OB is made and it will roll forward. Look at this shot from a physics point of view. You are trying to achieve that perfect balance between weight and mass of the balls, speed, slide or drag and all the other factors to make a mass replace a mass. Use a striped ball, stripe horizontal, and a well chalked q, hit the shot and you will see how little below or close to center you need to have the top side of your q to execute this shot.
The speed of the shot is a variable with the same tip position. Or, the amount of draw you use is a variable if using the same speed. I don't think the shot is possible on a 9'er with a true center ball hit. The speed required is too high. You need a smidgen of low.
I agree with Scott on this 100% I drove myself crazy day after day trying to perfect that replacement shot, work on your stop shot, then as you progress, you will get a feel for the replacement shot, sometimes you do need it to just get that tiny bit of clearance for your next shot.
My 60 minute workout is so old it's on VHS:yikes:
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On a 9 foot table it's roughly 2 diamonds give or take. Many variables come into play like speed, cloth etc. But typically 2 diamonds.
Hi Mike! :thumbup: Long time since you've been here! Hope things are going well for you. I'm looking forward to some 1-hole with you at the Flamingo next month! Fred Agnir (Cornerman) is living down there now too. Maybe he'll come over and play some with us!
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
champ2107...Don't pass on it...practice it. Start out with CB and OB 1,2 & 3 diamonds apart. That's pretty tough in itself, to do the way I described, but it will give you a killer stop shot...not to mention a much better draw shot too!
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
that drill sounds stressful, i think i will pass
This shot is one of the most impressive shots on the table if you ask me.
If I'm watching someone I'm not familiar with play and they fire in a ball and roll the cue ball forward 3 or 4 ball lengths for position, then I know they are a player. Now, I'm not talking about the drag/draw shot. I see guys shoot that one quite a bit. I'm talking about firing it in and then stunning through just a few ball lengths. I think it’s sort of a lost art form. I bet all the 14.1 players from a generation ago used this shot a lot. It’s really not needed as much in 9 ball.
Maybe it’s just me, but if you are trying to fly under the radar - don't pull that shot out of your bag.
***I guess my shot isn't exactly what the OP is about, but it's a derivative of it.***
If I'm watching someone I'm not familiar with play and they fire in a ball and roll the cue ball forward 3 or 4 ball lengths for position, then I know they are a player. Now, I'm not talking about the drag/draw shot. I see guys shoot that one quite a bit. I'm talking about firing it in and then stunning through just a few ball lengths. I think it’s sort of a lost art form. I bet all the 14.1 players from a generation ago used this shot a lot. It’s really not needed as much in 9 ball.
Maybe it’s just me, but if you are trying to fly under the radar - don't pull that shot out of your bag.
***I guess my shot isn't exactly what the OP is about, but it's a derivative of it.***
Hey, speakin of "MIA from the forum"...
Forget about that silly stuff, how is your "cute, young wife" doing?
You should post a pic of you two kissing or something :thumbup:
Eric >cant wait
Forget about that silly stuff, how is your "cute, young wife" doing?
You should post a pic of you two kissing or something :thumbup:
Eric >cant wait
Just been busy with work, not much of chance to get online.
Look forward to your visit
The reality of it is, this shot is an advanced stop shot so to speak. It shows the importance of the stop shot. I see variations of the replacement/stun through/ stop shot played regularly during matches. Weather it's the 2" draw back or drifting forward several inches.
The importance of this or the stop shot is more in finding consistency with your stroke while developing a basis to gauge most it not all of the rest of your shots. None of these shot should be taken for granted but should be used in developing a consistent straight and repeatable stroke.
The importance of this or the stop shot is more in finding consistency with your stroke while developing a basis to gauge most it not all of the rest of your shots. None of these shot should be taken for granted but should be used in developing a consistent straight and repeatable stroke.