Questions CSI should answer about 25July2014 Ko Pin Yi-Ralf Souquet 8ball semifinal

[prewarhero]

I'm taking the bets on over and under for how many pages all these threads turn in to after Mark comes on and gives an explanation of what happened...you think people are posting now.... If I were Mark I would just simply say: I ran a tournie with 16 of the top pros in the world; I made decisions some of them were hard. If anyone has a problem with my decisions you are more than welcome to run your own tournie. I'm looking forward to the next tournie..and that's it.

That doesn't fly with me as his decisions were not victimless (Ko, other knocked out players, and the sport itself). He put him self in a place that carries certain responsibilities and when the decisions became tough he made poor choices. Isn't that when were are to be judged, our actions when things are not easy?

Moreso, there are a slew of people that have very negative things to say about CSI in the past and the defense of their actions has always been they are trying to enhance the image of pool and clean up the sport. This was in complete opposite of that. With the information presented so far, this was as unethical as it gets in pool. So no, Mark must counter what has been posted and provide ample evidence to the contrary.

 

[takeitdown]

I'm taking the bets on over and under for how many pages all these threads turn in to after Mark comes on and gives an explanation of what happened...you think people are posting now.... If I were Mark I would just simply say: I ran a tournie with 16 of the top pros in the world; I made decisions some of them were hard. If anyone has a problem with my decisions you are more than welcome to run your own tournie. I'm looking forward to the next tournie..and that's it.

And that mentality is part of why pro pool is in the toilet. If you are a businessman act like it. You gotta try to give everyone what they want. If you aren't willing to explain things to the little people, AKA your customers, it's time to close shop.

 

[yobagua]

never mind


If this is what spending my money to promote pool does, then I think I might just keep it.

Royce

Yes, but then how would you feel not being more qualified or superior to have opinions to those that don't?

 

[one stroke]

And that mentality is part of why pro pool is in the toilet. If you are a businessman act like it. You gotta try to give everyone what they want. If you aren't willing to explain things to the little people, AKA your customers, it's time to close shop.

Bingo ,,,


1

 

[NlceGuy]

Also this isn't really a tiered tournament ,
I'll add this post by: Niceguy
"Typical round robin knock out stage implies a stage in which you play for a qualifying spot of a separate paying tournament bracket. In this case, the knock out stage was part of the same tournament, evident by the place and prize money received by the round robin finishers.
-please describe how the FIFA world cup (which is clearly a 2 stage tournament) fits Niceguy's definition of a 2 stage tourney.

I don't know why you bring up FIFA but since you want to talk about something you clearly don't understand, let me explain FIFA to you.

FIFA world cup does contain qualification rounds, but that is in the 3 years prior to the world cup finals actually being played. Once the world cup finals start, it is a single tournament, where the places and prize payouts are clearly defined. There is no precedent in the actual world cup finals where a team forfeits in the round of 16 after getting out of group stage.

What FIFA does have in place is a very solid regulations on what occurs if a team does forfeit and the game is NOT PLAYED (3:0 victory to opponents, penalties to forfeit team that includes reimbursement on damages to FIFA, the opponents... etc). However, nowhere in the guidelines do they talk about bringing back another opponents to make up the game, much less bringing back a team that has already been eliminated.

Continue on with your discussion on how Mark handled this like a saint~

 

[yobagua]

Mark is neither a Saint nor a Sinner. Hes a businessman. They make decision based on their hopes and aspirations. Part of that is profit. Sometimes he makes decisions that does not fit to the general publics hopes and aspirations. We cant always have it our way and he cant either.
So what is he supposed to do. Will an apology suffice? Yes I messed up Ill try to be better? That does not cost a businessman anything as far as material goes.
What is it you want?
Im sure he, if he is an astute businessman, (and Im sure he is) he will give you that.
But what is it you exactly want? If you want me to hate him Im sorry I cant. I don't know the man enough to. I know I like his wife very much. Sunny.
I know he is the man to revive the US Open One Pocket. And he can run that no matter what after a long drought of it.
Im not defending him you see.
The only hope I have is he rescinds his ban against last years US Open 10 ball champion, Rodney Morris. Until then I hold my money.

He made perhaps an error. We all do. Ask your wife or your husband or your kids or your parents or your priest or your union rep. Are you without mistakes?

Not taking sides but lets let it go and wait for 2015 for a better fruitful pool season with a better understanding of each other..

 

[watchez]

I don't know why you bring up FIFA but since you want to talk about something you clearly don't understand, let me explain FIFA to you.


Continue on with your discussion on how Mark handled this like a saint~

How many Taiwanese players were originally invited to this event?

How did it get to be that four were in attendance?

 

[BJTyler]

Once the world cup finals start, it is a single tournament, where the places and prize payouts are clearly defined.

Just because YOU choose to define something as a single or multiple stage tournament doesn't make it so.

The FIFA world cup...not the preliminary qualifying stages...but the actual 32 team world cup tournament consists of TWO __________ (please fill in the blank).

The first ________ is a group _______. The second ________ is called the knockout _______.

So if you'd be so kind to fill in the blanks, I will stop using the word "Stage" and use whatever word you choose instead. And we can agree that the CSI invitational was a multiple __________ tournament.


And I've already given an example of a multiple _________ tournament where teams were disqualified after the group _______, and the 3rd and 4th place teams were advanced into the knockout _________. Plead read.

 

[NlceGuy]

Mark is neither a Saint nor a Sinner. Hes a businessman. They make decision based on their hopes and aspirations. Part of that is profit. Sometimes he makes decisions that does not fit to the general publics hopes and aspirations. We cant always have it our way and he cant either.
So what is he supposed to do. Will an apology suffice? Yes I messed up Ill try to be better? That does not cost a businessman anything as far as material goes.
What is it you want?
Im sure he, if he is an astute businessman, (and Im sure he is) he will give you that.
But what is it you exactly want? If you want me to hate him Im sorry I cant. I don't know the man enough to. I know I like his wife very much. Sunny.
I know he is the man to revive the US Open One Pocket. And he can run that no matter what after a long drought of it.
Im not defending him you see.
The only hope I have is he rescinds his ban against last years US Open 10 ball champion, Rodney Morris. Until then I hold my money.

He made perhaps an error. We all do. Ask your wife or your husband or your kids or your parents or your priest or your union rep. Are you without mistakes?

Not taking sides but lets let it go and wait for 2015 for a better fruitful pool season with a better understanding of each other..

You are right, and I've said before, I'm glad we got to witness good pool despite his bad decisions. What I want from him is an acknowledgement and apology for a spur of the moment decision he made that was incorrect, and the means he used to enforce that decision.

Privately, he should make it right John and the Taiwan crew... pay the 2500 difference between 2nd and 3rd place finish. From a business standpoint, Shane should be payed where he finished, 2nd place in the group, and Ralf should get nothing as he did not complete the tournament requirements. This should actually save him money.

He should also have the foresight to realize that without properly documented rules and some type of committee to make decision, human error will occur. He himself is not without prejudice when making decisions, so he really shouldn't be making them without the backings of a decision making committee (from what I understand, there were well respected people in that discussion that disagreed with him, but he made the call anyways).

Is that unreasonable?

 

[NlceGuy]

How many Taiwanese players were originally invited to this event?

How did it get to be that four were in attendance?

I'm going to continue to be polite and answer you... even though I don't think you are very sincere in wanting a response.

It's flipped a couple times because this occurred when Kevin was in Houston with me, it started with 4, then 2, then 4 again only if Wu was one of the 4. Later on when Wu declined it just stayed 4.

Do I get a prize?

 

[robsnotes4u]

you are exactly right

The only question is wtf is this such a big deal, oh yeah its the internet. Move on people this forum use to be full of information to read but this constant BS is not needed. PM/IM/Email them directly if you are so bent on an answer. Does anyone moderate these boards?

Why does anyone think they have a right to ask why something was one the way it was done. It is CSI's business.

My Invesment
My Business
My Rules

Who do you people calling out CSI think you are?

 

[NlceGuy]

Just because YOU choose to define something as a single or multiple stage tournament doesn't make it so.

The FIFA world cup...not the preliminary qualifying stages...but the actual 32 team world cup tournament consists of TWO __________ (please fill in the blank).

The first ________ is a group _______. The second ________ is called the knockout _______.

So if you'd be so kind to fill in the blanks, I will stop using the word "Stage" and use whatever word you choose instead. And we can agree that the CSI invitational was a multiple __________ tournament.


And I've already given an example of a multiple _________ tournament where teams were disqualified after the group _______, and the 3rd and 4th place teams were advanced into the knockout _________. Plead read.

Sorry, I'm not reading many of your post because most of it is gibberish. I assume you are referring to 1950 games where france and portugal were invited but did not actually play. That is the qualification round, prior the the world cup finals... qualification round is where the only thing you are trying to win is a spot into the world cup finals.

And yes, I'm ok with you calling the world cup finals a 2 stage tournament, but even in that case there is no precedent of ever having someone eliminated in group stage of the tournament and still being allowed to play in the round of 16 due to forfeit. Also, prize money for 2014 was 8 million for teams knocked out in group stage, and 9 million for losing in round of 16. How do you think it would have went if they took a knocked out team and gave them a shot at 9 million+ because of a forfeit... FIFA would crash and burn on that decision...

So what is your point?

 

[BJTyler]

Why does anyone think they have a right to ask why something was one the way it was done. It is CSI's business.

My Invesment
My Business
My Rules

Who do you people calling out CSI think you are?

Because......."If you've got a business—you didn't build that. Somebody else made that happen."

...ok now I'm just being petulant.

 

[yobagua]

You are right, and I've said before, I'm glad we got to witness good pool despite his bad decisions. What I want from him is an acknowledgement and apology for a spur of the moment decision he made that was incorrect, and the means he used to enforce that decision.

Privately, he should make it right John and the Taiwan crew... pay the 2500 difference between 2nd and 3rd place finish. From a business standpoint, Shane should be payed where he finished, 2nd place in the group, and Ralf should get nothing as he did not complete the tournament requirements. This should actually save him money.

He should also have the foresight to realize that without properly documented rules and some type of committee to make decision, human error will occur. He himself is not without prejudice when making decisions, so he really shouldn't be making them without the backings of a decision making committee (from what I understand, there were well respected people in that discussion that disagreed with him, but he made the call anyways).

Is that unreasonable?

Nope not at all. But until we hear the other side of the story I cant really tell what is reasonable or unreasonable. But Im not here to judge or decide. I am just an interested party and a fan of the sport. I got too many other people and things to hate on.

 

[BJTyler]

...............................

Sorry, I'm not reading many of your post because most of it is gibberish.
- Is English not your native tongue?

I assume you are referring to 1950 games where france and portugal were invited but did not actually play. That is the qualification round, prior the the world cup finals... qualification round is where the only thing you are trying to win is a spot into the world cup finals.
- no, I was referring to the 2012 Olympic Games Badminton Tournament...please read before you speak.


And yes, I'm ok with you calling the world cup finals a 2 stage tournament, but even in that case there is no precedent of ever having someone eliminated in group stage of the tournament and still being allowed to play in the round of 16 due to forfeit.
- so you agree there is FIFA no precedent for either decision (bye vs. advancement)

Also, prize money for 2014 was 8 million for teams knocked out in group stage, and 9 million for losing in round of 16. How do you think it would have went if they took a knocked out team and gave them a shot at 9 million+ because of a forfeit... FIFA would crash and burn on that decision...
- so if say Uruguay was dq'd after the group stage, do you actually think FIFA would have awarded a bye to Columbia??? ROFLMAO

 

[robsnotes4u]

Here is a great quote I heard last night

Well, I guess some just want to be upset about something.

Ayn Rand once wrote, "Reason in not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it."



Royce

This fits, "ignorance breeds chaos, not knowledge"--Lucy

 

[NlceGuy]

...............................

Sir, I think you are confusing a DQ with a forfeit. Yes I do read English, but I usually ignore incoherent post that are rude or lack reasoning (like most of yours). I think I'm going to stop responding now, say what you like~

 

[BJTyler]

Yes I do read English,

I didn't ask if you read English, I asked if English was your native tongue. But I guess you answered my question, albeit indirectly.

 

[BJTyler]

Sir, I think you are confusing a DQ with a forfeit.

Please address the material difference between a dq and a forfeit vis-a-vis a tournament.

 

[eric671019]

This was down to the single elimination (or knockout) part of the tournament. The 4 four semi-finalists had already been determined. In fact the names had already been written in the semi-final brackets. It had already been determined where Shane had finished and what that prize was. You can't bring someone back who's already been eliminated, and yes once the four semi-finalists had been determined the rest of the field was eliminated. Only one of those four could become the Champion.

Other wise it's not a tournament it's a side show !!!

It's not "one person advances" from each bracket as many on your side of the discussion like to say, it's the winner of each bracket advances.

Also this isn't really a tiered tournament ,
I'll add this post by: Niceguy
"Typical round robin knock out stage implies a stage in which you play for a qualifying spot of a separate paying tournament bracket. In this case, the knock out stage was part of the same tournament, evident by the place and prize money received by the round robin finishers.

So how does someone who already finished in a place where prize money is assigned, get resurrected to play for more money. Shane was loose and firing in the semis, hard not to when you are on a free-roll."

As this stated it nicely.

Agree!! it came down to a final four men tournament.
If one of the four semi-finalists forfeited, it's a lost for the player who didn't play.
So according to CSI's decision on moving SVB up. what would they do if Shane forfeited after he beat big ko in the semi final? interesting~~
are they gonna move big ko up to play again since there is no one to play little ko in the final? even big ko was out. lol