Rambow Cue? Opinions welcomed. Selling soon.
- Thread starter Phylo
- Start date
I hope he doesn't mind, but another AZer owns the Rambow cue below and I'm posting the signature to be used for comparison. Since this thread in particular is asking for opinions, I have a couple of questions and would like to learn something. I own no Rambow cues, and know nothing about how to authenticate one, however here is something I noticed.
1) All of the cues posted except the original poster's have the "squiggles" around the signature.
2) I was then looking at some of the lettering and notice that the 's' in the original poster's signature is significantly different from two of the others posted, the one below, and J Marshall's example.
3) The 'a' in James is very slightly different than those in Tate's example. Could be a normal deviation.
4) The "squiggles" surrounding the signature of John Marsharl's signature are different from Tate's and the example below, which are similar.
I'm not trying to cast any doubts here, I just wonder, did Herman Rambow ever have someone else sign these cues for him? And, is there anyone who has enough examples to verify the above inconsistencies?
1) All of the cues posted except the original poster's have the "squiggles" around the signature.
2) I was then looking at some of the lettering and notice that the 's' in the original poster's signature is significantly different from two of the others posted, the one below, and J Marshall's example.
3) The 'a' in James is very slightly different than those in Tate's example. Could be a normal deviation.
4) The "squiggles" surrounding the signature of John Marsharl's signature are different from Tate's and the example below, which are similar.
I'm not trying to cast any doubts here, I just wonder, did Herman Rambow ever have someone else sign these cues for him? And, is there anyone who has enough examples to verify the above inconsistencies?
Mr Hoppe said:I hope he doesn't mind, but another AZer owns the Rambow cue below and I'm posting the signature to be used for comparison. Since this thread in particular is asking for opinions, I have a couple of questions and would like to learn something. I own no Rambow cues, and know nothing about how to authenticate one, however here is something I noticed.
1) All of the cues posted except the original poster's have the "squiggles" around the signature.
2) I was then looking at some of the lettering and notice that the 's' in the original poster's signature is significantly different from two of the others posted, the one below, and J Marshall's example.
3) The 'a' in James is very slightly different than those in Tate's example. Could be a normal deviation.
4) The "squiggles" surrounding the signature of John Marsharl's signature are different from Tate's and the example below, which are similar.
I'm not trying to cast any doubts here, I just wonder, did Herman Rambow ever have someone else sign these cues for him? And, is there anyone who has enough examples to verify the above inconsistencies?
Basically, Rambow had a helper who also did lettering. I think Bill at Cornerstone Cues once sent me a newpaper article about that many years ago (which I no longer have). Rambow's writing style also changed several times over the years and I have guesed that over time he must have studied calligraphy and copied known styles. He certainly became better at it as the years passed. His early writing was neat but not fancy compared to the later samples. There were enough photographed samples of cues with documented history to check the writing.
The fancy lines before and after lettering are known as flourishes and there are many different styles - and he used them. I kind of got interested in this when a cue did come up with a famous name. The writing could not be matched to other examples and I believe it turned out to be a fake.
At one time I collected scans and photo's of a number of Rambow cue signatures. These photos were not mine to publish so I can't share them. Most helpful were the styles of the first letter. Of course, anybody could copy the calligraphy but it would take a lot of work and research to pass off a fake; you have to build the cue right and have the writing copied, hard to fake and old, aged cues. But that's why it's good to have a history on the cue.
I haven't sat down and checked the signature you've shown in detail on the "Otis Skimmer" cue, but at a glance it looks totally authentic to me. What especially makes it look authentic is the way it was done - it looks to me it was done in pencil and was copied over several times until it became dark, then clear coated. You can see the Haddad cue is done that way too. That's the style Rambow used on most of the cues I've seen.
Concerning the Frank James Wolf Cue, if you look closely in the Billiards Encyclopedia (I don't have a copy here), there is an example shown of a cue that has the capital letters and the "Jr" on it - you can see that and other capital letters are consistent - so I believe the lettering is authentic.
Chris
Last edited:
Rambow
Troy,
Thanks for posting pics of one of my Rambow cue. The person I acquired these three cues from a 3-cushion player, who had these cues in his possession since the 1940's. One of the other cues is a Hoppe style Rambow, and I read that Willie Hoppe specifically asked Herman Rambow not to put any markings of the Hoppe Rambow's.
I did a google search for Otis Skinner, and found out that he was a famous screen actor from the Booth Theater, (1880-1942) His daughter Cornelia Otis Skinner was a famous writer, and she wrote articles about billiards, and biographys of famous people.
If anyone wants additional pics, let me know
Thanks
Ted
Mr Hoppe said:I hope he doesn't mind, but another AZer owns the Rambow cue below and I'm posting the signature to be used for comparison. Since this thread in particular is asking for opinions, I have a couple of questions and would like to learn something. I own no Rambow cues, and know nothing about how to authenticate one, however here is something I noticed.
1) All of the cues posted except the original poster's have the "squiggles" around the signature.
2) I was then looking at some of the lettering and notice that the 's' in the original poster's signature is significantly different from two of the others posted, the one below, and J Marshall's example.
3) The 'a' in James is very slightly different than those in Tate's example. Could be a normal deviation.
4) The "squiggles" surrounding the signature of John Marsharl's signature are different from Tate's and the example below, which are similar.
I'm not trying to cast any doubts here, I just wonder, did Herman Rambow ever have someone else sign these cues for him? And, is there anyone who has enough examples to verify the above inconsistencies?
Troy,
Thanks for posting pics of one of my Rambow cue. The person I acquired these three cues from a 3-cushion player, who had these cues in his possession since the 1940's. One of the other cues is a Hoppe style Rambow, and I read that Willie Hoppe specifically asked Herman Rambow not to put any markings of the Hoppe Rambow's.
I did a google search for Otis Skinner, and found out that he was a famous screen actor from the Booth Theater, (1880-1942) His daughter Cornelia Otis Skinner was a famous writer, and she wrote articles about billiards, and biographys of famous people.
If anyone wants additional pics, let me know
Thanks
Ted
Hey There,Phylo said:
I own a Rambow. I've had it for 40yrs. Your cue looks almos exactly like mine. It's my understanding that only 10% of Rambows were actually signed, and then typically signed with someone else's name such as the purchaser.
DrDanbro
Former Owner
Boone's Classic Billiards
Lonaconing, MD