Rant: A cuemaker's grievance

jov3n

jov3n

Cuemaker
Silver Member
I wish to relate an unpleasant experience that I have just had with a PF.

Some time ago, this PF approached me to recondition and refinish a cue that was made by my teacher and I several years ago. He clearly told me that he wanted to keep it for himself. The cue was made at a time when my teacher and I were less experienced. With the wisdom of hindsight, certain aspects of the cue could have been done better. I was delighted and proud as a young cuemaker that someone would want to own and keep one of my earlier cues. I felt an obligation to recondition and refinish the cue to the best of my present ability. And because this PF had said that his intention was to keep the cue, I told him that I would give him a discount on the cost of the whole job.

This evening, I found out from this PF himself that he intended to sell the cue after I had completed the job. Not to keep for himself. I felt betrayed.

PFs, please understand. Making a cue is not easy. In certain respects, it is like childbirth - there's blood, sweat and tears involved. And an indescribable pride when the cue is finally completed. And possessiveness. There have been times when I almost wanted to tell the buyer, "Take back your money. I want to keep this cue for myself." It is that difficult to part company with the cue, sometimes. So, when somebody comes along and says that they want to keep a cue that I had made, I feel very happy that someone else also treasures my creation, to the extent that I am prepared to bend over backwards to help that someone appreciate the cue even more by not charging more than I should for work done. It would appear that my generosity was misplaced, at least in this case.

The money is not the issue. I do not make cues for the money, but because I love to make cues and I love it when people love my cues enough to want to buy them and keep them. If anyone is prepared to do a comparison, he will find that my prices are one of the cheapest in the market.

Anyway, I have told this PF to keep his money. I have already done most of the reconditioning work but since he broke faith with me, I refuse to do the remaining aspects. He can come and take his cue back in its current unfinished condition. I will never ever do any cue work for him again - that is my prerogative. But thanks to this PF, I will no longer give discounts to anyone for work done on any cues, even those I made.

Joven
 
Just curious, what is a PF? Personal friend? Anyway, if I were you, I would always work on the assumption that any cue brought to you by anyone may end up being sold after you do the work. You will not be disappointed if you take that approach. I know I have cues that I tell people are not for sale, but if the right cue comes my way, many of those I have might be offered up in a trade.
 
Sorry, as a consumer I can't agree with you or your decision not to finish the cue. You sold that cue, it's his now whether you like it or not. What he chooses to do with it is his business. You agreed to refinish the cue for him so I think it's only right that you finish what you started. I can respect the love you have for your cues but a customer is a customer.

And look on the other side of it, someone else wants it so it's not like he's tossing it in the trash.
MULLY
just an opinion from someone that buys custom cues
 
i was wondering what PF is too.you should finish the cue and just let it go.if that is the worst thing that happens to you then you got off easy in life.so the guy tricked you into refinish,it really isn't that big a deal.
 
if anything just tell him to pay full price. u told him earlier that u'd give him a discount cuz he's keeping it, so just tell him that since hes not keeping it, u will charge the regular price for it plus the cost of any additional work required.
 
PF =Pool Fanatic

Hi Jov,
There are a lot of cuemakers around who do cues in your prices.As u are about new in this market,this attitude would not take you a long way.

I am shocked to see your response here.
Your work is to make cues and once u sold it and get a fair price,it should not concern u whether he sells it or not.because the cue is made by you so it is definately the right of the owner to ask discount from you.you give discount or not is upto you.If the cue is so dear to you than you should not sell it at all.I think you should stand up and finish the cue.
 
i can understand and respect your decission about not finishing the work but to be honest if that's how you feel about it you should buy the cue off of him yourself.

he spent his money on it and it's his to do with as he wants. giving him a cue that's unfinished (now more exposed to moisture) and what some might call in worse shape than what you got it in is just bad business
 
PFs, please understand.
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A lot of people here do not understand what PF means in your context.

Poolfanatic.com is not that well known internationally yet.
Thanks to you, more people know it now.

Making a cue is not easy. In certain respects, it is like childbirth - there's blood, sweat and tears involved. And an indescribable pride when the cue is finally completed.
Click to expand...
I think most of us here know that long time ago. Thanks for the reminder again.


The money is not the issue. I do not make cues for the money, but because I love to make cues and I love it when people love my cues enough to want to buy them and keep them. If anyone is prepared to do a comparison, he will find that my prices are one of the cheapest in the market.
Click to expand...
In some cases, people buy custom cues from some new cuemakers because they are cheaper than very good production cues.


Anyway, I have told this PF to keep his money. I have already done most of the reconditioning work but since he broke faith with me, I refuse to do the remaining aspects. He can come and take his cue back in its current unfinished condition. I will never ever do any cue work for him again - that is my prerogative. But thanks to this PF, I will no longer give discounts to anyone for work done on any cues, even those I made.
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Sounds personal over business here.
He cheated you and you are pissed, you do not want to finish the cue even though he is paying at the price which you have quoted for the job. :rolleyes:




Dear Joven,
May I know what is the real motive of your post?

You did not even bother to edit your post in Poolfanatic.com and posted the exact words of your post at that forum. :rolleyes:

I have the same reaction as Monto when I saw this post here. :eek:
I thought you would just make a rant in Poolfanatic.com and let it known to the local pool players that you will not give any more discounts for your work.


If you want to vent your frustrations and let go of your unhappiness, you can find your buddies. I am sure they will lend a listening ear to you better than all of us here.

Players do change their cues time and time again. Once they change cues, most of them will sell their old cues.
This is how it goes in the billiard world, nothing surprisingly about this.

If you intend to make cues and sell them, then please get used to this.
If you cannot get used to this, my suggestion would be for you to keep all the cues which you make. You will feel happier that way.


Paul Dayton said:
You need to finish the job and learn from it.
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Please kindly heed this sound advice from a renowned cuemaker.
 
very well said marcel... its all part of the craft joven, get used to it...;)
 
hey

Really not trying to be mean, but once the cue was purchased, its none of your business what the guy does. If he uses it as kindling to start a fire or make tooth picks out of it, its his perogative.

I also agree that as a new cuemaker, this attitude is not gonna help you for the future.........
Steve
 
Joven, I hope you're seeing a pattern here. Man, you have every right to refuse service to this person ever again, I doubt anyone would hold that against you, but not finishing the cue though, not a good idea. Word spreads fast about cue makers and one thing like this could really damage your reputation. You're getting replies from people that purchase cues and I haven't seen one response agreeing with your decision.

I think you need to take this one on the chin, finish HIS cue, and send it back to him or have him come get it.
MULLY
I would never buy a cue from someone that does something like that
 
Monto P2 said:
PF =Pool Fanatic

Hi Jov,
There are a lot of cuemakers around who do cues in your prices.As u are about new in this market,this attitude would not take you a long way.

I am shocked to see your response here.
Your work is to make cues and once u sold it and get a fair price,it should not concern u whether he sells it or not.because the cue is made by you so it is definately the right of the owner to ask discount from you.you give discount or not is upto you.If the cue is so dear to you than you should not sell it at all.I think you should stand up and finish the cue.
Click to expand...

monto, do you know my prices?
 
One customer's thoughts

Joven, Thank you for caring so much about your craft. As a collector, I see signs of cost cutting in materials and technique that dissapoint...the cuemakers I want to deal with are those who are deeply committed.

When I considered who to ask to build my first high end custom cue, Ernie Guttierez came to mind. How could a cuemaker show more committment to his product than to name it after his daughter?

When I was honored many years later with the opportunity to interview Ernie for the Blue Book, we discussed many subjects. Among them was passion for the art...and one of the hardest things to learn: professional detachment.

If you are feeling hurt, I encourage you to talk to your peers. I expect most senior cuemakers have stories about their painstaking efforts and the conduct of their customers. I hope you never surrender your passion for building a superior product. Owners will come and go, but it will be your workmanship that endures.
 
If you agree to take the job and you start it then you should finish it. At the end of the day it's your cue that will be out there in the world and you should want it to be as good as you can possibly make it for the person who ends up with it.

Each cue you make is a little ambassador for your craft. If you truly love your craft then you will treat each piece that you put on your hands on as if it would end up in the hands of kings.

Lastly, the issue is between you and your PF. Is that like a BFF? It's not an issue for these boards unless you are looking for validation when you know in your heart that you are in the wrong here.

Your prices do not matter. It does not matter what your motivation was. If you did not clearly spell it out to this person that the price is ONLY VALID if he keeps the cue forever - a condition you cannot oversee - then you are obligated to finish the job if you want to be thought of as a professional.

If it were me and you refused to refinish your own cue after you agreed to do it and started the work then I would be sure to never purchase from you again at any price and also be sure to relate the unprofessionallism.

You say you don't do this for the money. If so then the pride of your work should be all motivation you need to finish the cue so that the person who really WANTS IT is happy to have a masterpiece.
 
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