Refusing to adjust weight when you're ahead...bad form or not?
- Thread starter ktrepal85
- Start date
No.
Either the two parties agree with the spot and play, or they don't agree with the spot and not play.
Two sets is not much of a sampling but having said that.
I am surprised he is just asking to adjust the weight. The 7 ball is not really so much weight that it will make a set lopsided unless it was much too much to start with. It sounds like he should be saying play even, you don't need the 7..
You can adjust to a spot that is more fair and keep your action, or refuse to adjust and lose your action. From the sounds of it, you could adjust to the 8 and still be the favorite. If some sloppy 7's were dropped, you could offer the call 7. Or call 8 and the breaks. Lots of options to adjust, and still be the favorite most likely. Adjusting the spot doesn't mean you have to take the worst of it. You can adjust and still get the better of it. You just need to know how to make a good game.
Who asked/offer the spot ???
I think the table can also be a big factor. The 7 on a table with 5" buckets isn't the same thing as the 7 on a tight table with 4" pockets.
2strong4u
Banned
A lot of factors here:
Have you just started playing with him, no history? Then adjust. It's obvious you have the nuts...by the end of the night you could be spotting him, just keep the fish on the line.
You have history with him and you are down to him over time, then don't adjust or tell him you'll take the 8 ball for 1 set, but the set after that needs to revert to the wild 7...wheter you win set 3 or not.
Hey it's gambling. Sucks he's gonna lose money, but that's the risk.
I'm ususlly spotting local players and play for decent sums all the time. I don't care if you are losing your rent money. If you can't afford to lose then don't play. If you havea guy stuck, you try to stick him even deeper. If giving up more weight gets it done do it.
The momentum you can get when matching up has nothing to do with "tournament ratings". To get action I will give up terrible spots to good players. When they get down I can grind them to dust. I never have money worries like some guys so that's a big advantage too.
You can shorten the race too, I'd always offer that. Or give up the breaks. When I was playing strong none of it seemed to matter. I gave a guy 1 rating under me all the breaks the 7 ball and a gameand destroyed him. The next time we played we went right back to him getting a game or the called 8....just keep being the boss.
there's 2 schools of thought here.
if you are just playing someone to have an opponent and you are just trying to practice but have a little $$$ on it to make you bear down, then yes, adjust to keep playing.
if you are gambling and the goal is to make some $$$, then you don't owe anyone anything ever. if you don't want to adjust and he wants to quit, let him quit. if you think you can adjust and still win, they I guess that's also up to you.
if you are just playing someone to have an opponent and you are just trying to practice but have a little $$$ on it to make you bear down, then yes, adjust to keep playing.
if you are gambling and the goal is to make some $$$, then you don't owe anyone anything ever. if you don't want to adjust and he wants to quit, let him quit. if you think you can adjust and still win, they I guess that's also up to you.
2strong4u
Banned
This is the reality. I give weight to them all just to stay in action. You win and they want even more.
I got a guy who want the 7 out and all the break plus 2 games...and he is a borderline A player. He says he'll bet a few hundred, so would I. I'd play anybody on the planet if they gave me that game.
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There are way to many variables to take into account, especially playing a race.
The guy is under no obligation whatsoever to adjust. They made the game and if someone doesn't like it they can quit.
Where do you go from the 7 ball, the 7 and the breaks or the 6 ball, that is a ton of weight?
Maybe give him the 6, one set for 500?
peace
The guy is under no obligation whatsoever to adjust. They made the game and if someone doesn't like it they can quit.
Where do you go from the 7 ball, the 7 and the breaks or the 6 ball, that is a ton of weight?
Maybe give him the 6, one set for 500?
peace
Of course not
Of course not. Players are big boys. If they gave up a spot that's not right and the other person doesn't want to adjust, then too bad. You either play with the existing spot or you don't play and you pay up.
This whole idea that someone is morally obligated to play a game that they don't want to is bs. If you don't want to play at any time you can quit.
It may be chicken shit or whatever. So what...
Jaden
Of course not. Players are big boys. If they gave up a spot that's not right and the other person doesn't want to adjust, then too bad. You either play with the existing spot or you don't play and you pay up.
This whole idea that someone is morally obligated to play a game that they don't want to is bs. If you don't want to play at any time you can quit.
It may be chicken shit or whatever. So what...
Jaden
2strong4u
Banned
Nah man HE'S getting the weight and winning.
So you say you'll take the wild 8 ball and play.
Heck if he's the "better" player and can't run 5 balls then let him have all the breaks and you keep the wild 7. It won't matter.
You have to make all your offers sound great...but some really don't matter. If I'm giving the 7 ball...giving the 7 out is not a lot different...espescially if you make them call the shot on the money balls.
Don't be dumb enough to play when You need weight.
Go Big or Go Home. Playing Even is the best way to find out
If You are Ever going to be a Contender or just a Rail-Bird.
Go Big or Go Home. Playing Even is the best way to find out
If You are Ever going to be a Contender or just a Rail-Bird.
i totally agree...too many variables to say what's bad form here.
that said, i have a regular game with a buddy, and the spot we use changes from week to week depending on how we are playing. we are both friends, so we're not gonna lie to each other. there are some nights we play the same spot all night, but others where one of us is clearly in stroke and needs to be giving up more. i've been up nights giving him 3 on the wire to 7, and i've also lost nights playing him even. it's usually pretty easy to know whether the game should truly be adjusted imo.
that said, i have a regular game with a buddy, and the spot we use changes from week to week depending on how we are playing. we are both friends, so we're not gonna lie to each other. there are some nights we play the same spot all night, but others where one of us is clearly in stroke and needs to be giving up more. i've been up nights giving him 3 on the wire to 7, and i've also lost nights playing him even. it's usually pretty easy to know whether the game should truly be adjusted imo.
You're right, I read the post wrong...
azbluemach1
Member
IMO, adjustment period should be set as part of the initial negotiation.
If Im pretty confident on the game then say we play 2, 3, 5 whatever sets before we adjust. Playing a game where you think your getting the worst of it try to set the stipulation that you will adjust after 1 set.
Of course this is just assuming your playing someone for the sole reason of winning the $$, not making a new BFF.
But as stated, I think you should have negotiated after 2 sets, esp with the margin you won by, unless you thought the guy was a total a$$ and was trying to steal from you, if so, then he can keep playing or go home.
If Im pretty confident on the game then say we play 2, 3, 5 whatever sets before we adjust. Playing a game where you think your getting the worst of it try to set the stipulation that you will adjust after 1 set.
Of course this is just assuming your playing someone for the sole reason of winning the $$, not making a new BFF.
But as stated, I think you should have negotiated after 2 sets, esp with the margin you won by, unless you thought the guy was a total a$$ and was trying to steal from you, if so, then he can keep playing or go home.
Phuck the fvck off??????????? :grin-square:
I can't speak for all of Europe (naturally), but the places I've been it's not very common to get spots like "the seven" etc. You are more likely to get games on the wire in rotation style games, and balls in straight pool and also in one pocket (which is practically NEVER played, except by a few world travellers). I just thought I'd make this clear before I continue.
Anyway, I don't see much of a point in playing with spots of the American nature. First of all it changes the nature of the game itself too much. Playing with the wild 7 or something similar completely changes the game, and it is no longer realistic match practice, neither for the spot giver or the taker.
Second: I you are going to adjust the spot during the matchup, what is the bloody point of it? You are neither practicing properly, nor will it be easy to make money since you will reach an equilibrium point sooner or later especially if you are not allowed to "quit winner". This is especially true when you are playing in your own pool hall. Hustling strangers is another thing all together. Of course this is where the hustling comes in where you grossly misrepresent your skill beforehand to "have a place to go" later. What can I say, I don't really enjoy that hustling stuff..
I never got the "gambling big with your fellow pool hall regulars" bit. Of course every pool hall has a sucker with a gambling problem, but I'm talking about good players playing each other every week. Eventually everyone breaks even, and you're only passing the same bills back and forth, only it's tied up because you can't ever spend it. How f-ing pointless is that?! At one point I remember in my pool hall that actually happened. When all the debt of 6 or 7 players was totalled with complicated passing back and forth of money it all evened out. Nobody owed anybody anything...lol. Might as well play for small change, that way you can keep it and the exitement is still there (to a degree). Or how about playing for the enjoyment of the game...oh, that's right, I forgot: Most of those guys don't really love the game unless something is on the line..Oh well.
Anyway, I don't see much of a point in playing with spots of the American nature. First of all it changes the nature of the game itself too much. Playing with the wild 7 or something similar completely changes the game, and it is no longer realistic match practice, neither for the spot giver or the taker.
Second: I you are going to adjust the spot during the matchup, what is the bloody point of it? You are neither practicing properly, nor will it be easy to make money since you will reach an equilibrium point sooner or later especially if you are not allowed to "quit winner". This is especially true when you are playing in your own pool hall. Hustling strangers is another thing all together. Of course this is where the hustling comes in where you grossly misrepresent your skill beforehand to "have a place to go" later. What can I say, I don't really enjoy that hustling stuff..
I never got the "gambling big with your fellow pool hall regulars" bit. Of course every pool hall has a sucker with a gambling problem, but I'm talking about good players playing each other every week. Eventually everyone breaks even, and you're only passing the same bills back and forth, only it's tied up because you can't ever spend it. How f-ing pointless is that?! At one point I remember in my pool hall that actually happened. When all the debt of 6 or 7 players was totalled with complicated passing back and forth of money it all evened out. Nobody owed anybody anything...lol. Might as well play for small change, that way you can keep it and the exitement is still there (to a degree). Or how about playing for the enjoyment of the game...oh, that's right, I forgot: Most of those guys don't really love the game unless something is on the line..Oh well.