Ruling please

[pt109]

Why would anybody want to?

I've actually seen a player (a very good player!) call a push shot and make the one ball, leaving a difficult looking shot on the two. He totally confused his opponent (also a good player) and the guy stood there transfixed for a moment, unsure about how to proceed. He looked up at me and I just shook my head. It was a legal shot and now he had the choice to shoot or pass it back. The second player appeared to be a little lost as to what to do and finally gave the shot back. Then the first player who had pushed out, quickly got down and shot a lock up safety. The other guy had not seen or even considered this option, because he had been so stymied in his thinking. He fouled and lost the game. That was a turning point in the match and the first player went on to win decisively.

On a "push out", I can think of a couple scenarios that would require hitting the lowest number on the table.
1) The low ball is very close to a pocket but you have another ball blocking your shot. In this case you may opt to kick at the ball so it won't be near the pocket for your opponent.
2) You can only see part of the low ball, not enough to pocket it. You can play a safety but are worried that the speed of the cue ball needed may not hit a rail. So you call a "push out" just in case you don't get the rail.
These situations don't come up to often but it is possible.

But to the OP, you can hit the lowest number on the table with a "push out".

I pushed out a lot...more than a lot of younger posters on AZ....
...I played a lot in the old ‘roll out’ days.

I have never seen a situation where it would benefit a player to call push while hitting
the ball on....you’re just giving your opponent an extra decision to make....
...which is not to your advantage.

..it’s the same thing in call-shot eight-ball...
...why would anybody call ‘safe’ and make their ball?

If someone could post a pic showing these two layouts where it would be a good move...
...I’d like to see it.

pt....willing to learn something

 

[PoolBum]

If I fail to make 3 balls pass the line at 9ball break. And my opponent decide to let me play.

Can I still play a "push" ?

Not according to the rules they just played by in the U.S. Open.

 

[JoseV]

Was playing in a local 9 ball tournament with 16 players. A heated disagreement started taking place at the far end of the room. One of the out of town players was saying that you can not push off of the object ball.
I have always played you can push off of any ball,including the object ball.
Ruling please.

Which tournament was this ?

 

[Pushout]

Are you saying the cue ball is frozen to the 1 ball? Or just that you can't call a push when hitting the 1 ball? Very curious and I've played probably as much push-out 9 ball as PT.

 

[pt109]

Are you saying the cue ball is frozen to the 1 ball? Or just that you can't call a push when hitting the 1 ball? Very curious and I've played probably as much push-out 9 ball as PT.

With a name like that.....probably more....:smile:

 

[hang-the-9]

..it’s the same thing in call-shot eight-ball...
...why would anybody call ‘safe’ and make their ball?

If someone could post a pic showing these two layouts where it would be a good move...
...I’d like to see it.

pt....willing to learn something

There could be plenty of situations, you have one less ball to run out, it may be easier to play a safe by making the ball and playing position to put the cueball somewhere as you can avoid a double-hit with the ball bouncing off the rail or avoid having to cut the cueball to not make the ball when you don't want to send it that way. You could have an issue with making the ball and getting position on the next shot or to play a shot after that, so you make the ball and try to get ball in hand to get better shape and not have to play the same position again.

I have not done this much, but I have done it at times, usually just to clear a ball towards the endgame. When your opponent leaves you with a lot of your balls but he only has a few or just the 8, calling a safe while pocketing a ball can be a strong move.

In the first shot it may be a good idea also, if the table broke horribly and you have almost no chance to run out, even if you can make one ball, you can call safe, pocket a clear shot, and leave the mess for your opponent to start with. Works great against weaker players since they are not likely to outmove you in a game, they just start shooting at things which is likely to leave you openings later on.

 

[Black-Balled]

I still don't understand why one would call a push and make a shot that would otherwise be legal.

Doing so improves your opponent's position (deferring shot choice to him), which weakens the pushers position.

Only (and very arguable) advantage I can see is if the pusher felt he could execute a fear-bringer...but shooting those harrigans is by definition, risky.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I still don't understand why one would call a push and make a shot that would otherwise be legal.
...

Apart from the case above of confusing your opponent, the only case I've thought of is when you are worried about the officiating. Suppose the one ball is in a cluster near the cushion but you think you can make it. You don't trust the ref to call fair/foul. You call a push out and shoot the one in leaving a pretty hard shot/safe on the two.

 

[GB Basher]

I pushed out a lot...more than a lot of younger posters on AZ....
...I played a lot in the old ‘roll out’ days.

I have never seen a situation where it would benefit a player to call push while hitting
the ball on....you’re just giving your opponent an extra decision to make....
...which is not to your advantage.

..it’s the same thing in call-shot eight-ball...
...why would anybody call ‘safe’ and make their ball?

If someone could post a pic showing these two layouts where it would be a good move...
...I’d like to see it.

pt....willing to learn something

How about this scenario for 8ball:
You are playing solids. You have 2 solids left. Your opponent is on the black.
The layout is you have a solid tight on the center of the short rail in the kitchen.
The cueball is also tight on the same rail, about 5" from your solid.
Your other solid is at the other end of the table on the foot spot.
The black is directly behind this solid with about a 1/2" gap between them.

So you are dead straight on the pot so unable to get the CB up table.
Would it be a good option to call safe, play a stop shot and pot your solid in the corner and leaving your opponent in a full ball snooker.

....just a thought

 

[Black-Balled]

Making your ball an calling safe is definitely the correct shot in 8b/ 14.1, at times.

I.beljeve the initial context was rotation games though

How about this scenario for 8ball:
You are playing solids. You have 2 solids left. Your opponent is on the black.
The layout is you have a solid tight on the center of the short rail in the kitchen.
The cueball is also tight on the same rail, about 5" from your solid.
Your other solid is at the other end of the table on the foot spot.
The black is directly behind this solid with about a 1/2" gap between them.

So you are dead straight on the pot so unable to get the CB up table.
Would it be a good option to call safe, play a stop shot and pot your solid in the corner and leaving your opponent in a full ball snooker.

....just a thought

 

[GB Basher]

Re the 8ball scenario, I was just answering pt109's post

 

[Black-Balled]

Re the 8ball scenario, I was just answering pt109's post

Sure...but he is a dangerous one to follow.

 

[GB Basher]

Re 8ball scenario, I was just answering pt109's post

 

[Black-Balled]

Re 8ball scenario, I was just answering pt109's post

Sure...but dangerous to follow he is.

 

[Swighey]

There are many situations where calling safe while plotting your ball is the correct option in 8 ball. In 9 ball, potting the lowest ball after the break on a pushout? Well, if not potting the lowest and leaving it as the object ball is viable the surely potting the lowest and leaving the now lowest must also be.....

 

[pt109]

I pushed out a lot...more than a lot of younger posters on AZ....
...I played a lot in the old ‘roll out’ days.

I have never seen a situation where it would benefit a player to call push while hitting
the ball on....you’re just giving your opponent an extra decision to make....
...which is not to your advantage.

..it’s the same thing in call-shot eight-ball...
...why would anybody call ‘safe’ and make their ball?
——————————————————————
If someone could post a pic showing these two layouts where it would be a good move...
...I’d like to see it.
———————————————————
pt....willing to learn something

There could be plenty of situations, you have one less ball to run out, it may be easier to play a safe by making the ball and playing position to put the cueball somewhere as you can avoid a double-hit with the ball bouncing off the rail or avoid having to cut the cueball to not make the ball when you don't want to send it that way. You could have an issue with making the ball and getting position on the next shot or to play a shot after that, so you make the ball and try to get ball in hand to get better shape and not have to play the same position again.

I have not done this much, but I have done it at times, usually just to clear a ball towards the endgame. When your opponent leaves you with a lot of your balls but he only has a few or just the 8, calling a safe while pocketing a ball can be a strong move.

In the first shot it may be a good idea also, if the table broke horribly and you have almost no chance to run out, even if you can make one ball, you can call safe, pocket a clear shot, and leave the mess for your opponent to start with. Works great against weaker players since they are not likely to outmove you in a game, they just start shooting at things which is likely to leave you openings later on.

I’m not being arrogant here...I have zero call shot league experience...other than as a
spectator.
I have witnessed a few times a ball made with the call safe option...they were always better
off to have not made the ball but leave it over a hole instead.

I had some pretty intelligent league players try to set up a situation where it is better to
make the ball and call safe...yesterday at a pool hall....they all failed.

The only one I can think of is where a ball count could be an advantage.

I have called safe and made the ball...but only at straight pool...that’s an obvious edge.

 

[pt109]

How about this scenario for 8ball:
You are playing solids. You have 2 solids left. Your opponent is on the black.
The layout is you have a solid tight on the center of the short rail in the kitchen.
The cueball is also tight on the same rail, about 5" from your solid.
Your other solid is at the other end of the table on the foot spot.
The black is directly behind this solid with about a 1/2" gap between them.

So you are dead straight on the pot so unable to get the CB up table.
Would it be a good option to call safe, play a stop shot and pot your solid in the corner and leaving your opponent in a full ball snooker.

....just a thought

How about rolling off the your other solid at the other end?
...preferably putting it near a hole

pt....still waiting for a pic

 

[Black-Balled]

How about rolling off the your other solid at the other end?
...preferably putting it near a hole

pt....still waiting for a pic

What about when your opponent is on the 8 and it is tied with your ball, and you have another ball hanging in a pocket? Wouldn't it make sense then, to shoot the hanger and call safe?

 

[pt109]

What about when your opponent is on the 8 and it is tied with your ball, and you have another ball hanging in a pocket? Wouldn't it make sense then, to shoot the hanger and call safe?

You might be onto to something here....how about a pic?

 

[buckets]

nevermind xxx