Russian Pyramid Billiards Video - Evgeny Stalev

Double-Dave said:
While browsing through YouTube I found this nice clip with Evgeny Stalev, one of the best at this game and I believe he posts here from time to time. Talk about tight pockets!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1q0qNsYFgc&search=billiards
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Now I know why nobody wants to play Stalev some scratch pool.

I wonder how well Pyramid players would fare playing snooker in Europe? I am guessing that these guys are probably better shotmakers than snooker players.
 
Double-Dave said:
While browsing through YouTube I found this nice clip with Evgeny Stalev, one of the best at this game and I believe he posts here from time to time. Talk about tight pockets!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1q0qNsYFgc&search=billiards
Click to expand...

Double-D,
Thanks for the post. Very entertaining vid (though I believe Stalev loses the match).

It looks as if you can choose any ball as the cue ball, and score a point by making any ball or by caroming the cueball into a pocket. Does anyone know what happens if you make a ball and then follow it in with the cueball? Is it 2 points??

Also, why are they striking the shots so hard??? Is it just to prevent leaving a hanger for their opponent; or is there some characteristic of the pockets that increase pocketing percentage (not true on American pool tables)?

Is the table a standard snooker table, or is it specially made for Pyramids?
 
You can pocket either the cue- or the objectball, both are one point, don't know if you can make two points in one go. Actually this is the first time I saw pyramid pool myself, don't really know anything else of the rules. I do believe they play so hard not to leave a hanger.

Edit: Just got a response from someone that knows a little something about Pyramid. It seems that the pocket wil accept the ball easier if played hard. This is due to the weight of the balls "pushing" through the pocket opening. Kinda like when you force a ball into the center pocket that won't go if played slowly.
 
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I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

IIRC, there is a vid clip out there that shows Stalev winning a title (2004?) where he closes out the match with a multi-point shout.

Anyone who hasn't seen this guy play- buy an Accu-stats video- it'll make you remember how bad you suck!

Double-Dave said:
You can pocket either the cue- or the objectball, both are one point, don't know if you can make two points in one go. Actually this is the first time I saw pyramid pool myself, don't really know anything else of the rules. I do believe they play so hard not to leave a hanger.

Edit: Just got a response from someone that knows a little something about Pyramid. It seems that the pocket wil accept the ball easier if played hard. This is due to the weight of the balls "pushing" through the pocket opening. Kinda like when you force a ball into the center pocket that won't go if played slowly.
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great video. thanks. it looks like the table is covered with carom cloth (simonis 300 rapide). it got me interested, so i browsed around and found this:

http://www.billiard-online.com/ecpsporte/rules.html

according to these rules, you do get extra points for pocketing multiple balls (including the cue ball). also, (see rule 24) you have to do more than just hit a ball to a rail for a legal shot.

at the bottom they have table specs. i noticed that balls are 68 mm, or about 2 11/16 inches. in comparison, pool balls are 2 1/4 inches and carom balls are about 2 7/16 inches. so these balls are 1/4 inch bigger than carom balls. more amazing, the corner pocket is 74 mm, or only about a 1/4 inch bigger than the ball.

william
 
hanisch said:
...
http://www.billiard-online.com/ecpsporte/rules.html

... also, (see rule 24) you have to do more than just hit a ball to a rail for a legal shot.

... more amazing, the corner pocket is 74 mm, or only about a 1/4 inch bigger than the ball.

william
Click to expand...

I think I would lose my mind before I ever got precise enough to make shots in a pocket with a 1/4-inch margin of error. If a ball is coming in at any angle other than 45 degrees to the rails, it's effectively even smaller than that. If you're coming in sort of close to the rail (along the rail wouldn't be possible) you'd have to hit the ball hard enough to compress the pocket facing to make a large enough opening for the ball to get through, so that explains the added speed.

The other thing is rule 24 mentioned above, if you fail to pocket a ball, multiple rails need to be hit or you need to cross the centerline, or various other confusing rules, so I think in case the ball doesn't drop, you need to have some speed left over to make sure you don't foul. Here's the rule:

24. Legal shot

Any shot (except the opening break) is considered to be legal (legally completed) if none of these Rules is infringed and additionally - after a collision (a contact) of the cue ball with one of the object balls any ball on the table's playing surface (the cue ball or any object ball):
(1) is pocketed, or
(2) rebounds off any cushion and thereafter: (a) touches another cushion, or (b) drives any ball to another cushion, or (c) touches any ball frozen to another cushion, or
(3) crosses the center line and thereafter: (a) touches any cushion, or (b) drives any ball to any cushion, or
(4) rebounds off any cushion and thereafter: (a) crosses the center line, or (b) drives any ball across the center line.
Failure to meet these requirements is a foul.

Notes:
1. All the elementary playing acts (collisions of the balls, rebounds off the cushions, crossings the center line, etc.) must occur only in the above-mentioned order. Otherwise it is a foul.
2. If the cue ball strikes the object ball that is frozen to the cushion, and this object ball rebounds off the cushion, strikes the cue ball in return and drives it to any cushion or across the center line, the shot is considered to be legal only if there were two separate collisions - cue ball/object ball and object ball/cue ball. Otherwise it is a foul.
3. A ball crosses the center line only if the center of the ball crosses the center line.
4. If a ball rebounds off a jaw ("a nose") of a side pocket and returns back to its half of the table, its center has crossed the center line at least once.
 
I'm not sure that it's such a great game to develop accurate potting. They tend to only attempt pots that are nearly straight on or when the OB is close to the pocket. The huge range of other pots would receive little attention.

It would also seem a lot of the scoring would come from scratching, which is most effectively played with heavy english to help the CB into the pocket.

English billiards players are experts at this and they are also notorious for being relatively week potters because they are so focused on stroking the CB as required to direct it. Their potting stroke tends to go off.

In Australia many associations play a snooker season followed by a billiard season. At the end of each snooker season the player's potting has improved but scratching (in-offs) and caroms (cannons) have weakened. After the billiard season, the opposite is true.

That is basically why I think pyramid may not increase one's overall potting abilities, though it would help with a few shots.
 
Yep, it's true that the shots are usually high-speed, because the pocket accepts the ball easier, the jaws are a little bit elastic and the pocket gets bigger if you force a ball between them. Thus, cut shots are hardly ever used, almost all shots are straight in shots when trying to make the object ball. If there's a good angle, the cueball (used for that shot, could be any ball) will be caromed in, usually using inside english.

You get 1 point from scoring, first to 8 points wins the rack.
 
mjantti said:
Yep, it's true that the shots are usually high-speed, because the pocket accepts the ball easier, the jaws are a little bit elastic and the pocket gets bigger if you force a ball between them. Thus, cut shots are hardly ever used, almost all shots are straight in shots when trying to make the object ball. If there's a good angle, the cueball (used for that shot, could be any ball) will be caromed in, usually using inside english.

You get 1 point from scoring, first to 8 points wins the rack.
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What do the numbers on the white balls & the yellow ball mean?
 
lewdo26 said:
What do the numbers on the white balls & the yellow ball mean?
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The old version of russian pyramid included the numbers on those balls in gameplay. The cueball was always the red one and you get the points on the ball when you make one and you cannot score by caroming the cueball in. First one to 61 wins. Can't remember the exact name of the game, but I guess it's still played there. You know, there are at least 4-5 different games you can play on those russian pyramid equipment.
 
mjantti said:
The old version of russian pyramid included the numbers on those balls in gameplay. The cueball was always the red one and you get the points on the ball when you make one and you cannot score by caroming the cueball in. First one to 61 wins. Can't remember the exact name of the game, but I guess it's still played there. You know, there are at least 4-5 different games you can play on those russian pyramid equipment.
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MJ,
No one has answered yet, but is it a regulation snooker table; or is it a special table just for pyramid games.

Enquiring minds want to know.
 
Williebetmore said:
MJ,
No one has answered yet, but is it a regulation snooker table; or is it a special table just for pyramid games.

Enquiring minds want to know.
Click to expand...

Good question Willie. The base of the table and the slate is from a snooker table, but the rails, cushions and pockets are specially made only for this game (all made in Russia). Too bad I couldn't find a picture of the pocket itself, but the main difference between is that snooker jaws are rounded and pyramid jaws are straight, like in pool. And of course, 'cause the balls are bigger, the cushion and rails are higher. And pyramid pocket are even narrower than snooker pockets. Tough sport, I say.
 
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Williebetmore said:
MJ,
No one has answered yet, but is it a regulation snooker table; or is it a special table just for pyramid games.

Enquiring minds want to know.
Click to expand...

I was told that it was a 6x12 snooker table.

There is a snooker table at my university and in the mornings when nobody is around, I would go and round up all of monster cue balls from the bar tables and play some russian billiards. Of course when some one came in to play on the bar boxes I would go over to them and give back a cue ball, in case you were wondering :D.

It was alot of fun but I don't think it did a whole lot for my potting skills. Since I could choose any ball as the cue ball, the range of possibilities opened up so i can't remember having to shoot too many hard shots. Nevertheless I never played the game with anyone else so I never got to experience safety play or strategy, so I'm sure I'm missing something.

I still think snooker is the most challenging test of ones potting ability.
 
I heard that the reason why they hit the balls so hard in Pyramids is because at some angles the ball will not fit in the pocket. They hit it hard to 'bend' the cushion out of the way. Again, does anyone know if any Pyramids players have been successful at snooker?
 
yeah whether they're any good at snooker would be interesting to know. also, what's with all those strange billiard shots they play. say theres a ball on the rail near a pocket, then they hit another ball into it at 200mph and it caroms off it an heads straight for the pocket. what's the reasoning behind these shots?
 
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