OK, what rules for the break do you recommend for nine ball?
Safe break in 10 ball, another Duel special.
- Thread starter hang-the-9
- Start date
He doesn't have any except
"Don't try to mess with the rules"
That's the fix right there-can't you see?
As for finally fixing the nine ball break, there are at least two workable solutions proposed so far. One is Paul Schofield's "random pattern, breaker shoots the next shot regardless of wet/dry break" rules. The other is for the first shot after the break to be a pushout.
Since we can't have a radar gun on people to prevent soft breaking, I like 3 balls past the side pockets or 2 past the headstring. With 3 past the headstring there is a lot more chances for bad luck to make a good break a bad break.
No pattern racking, which is already in the rules as "random placement of balls", as I'm sure you know since you have done some work on the rules.
9 ball spots off the break, but I think most players like that rule also. I also do not mind "9 has to go last" rule that Grady used in some of his tournaments. Keeps from someone breaking to wire an early combo (again like Corey was doing LOL) or a 9 ball shooting to corner pocket, not going in, but just hanging there for an early win.
These may be too specific for general 9 ball rules to put in the WPA book, but given my own event, those are the rules I would use for breaking.
While times change, I don't think 9 ball or 10 ball, or even 8 ball, were designed with the idea of a pattern racking soft break with repeatable and identical layouts in one half of the table each break. That is what I meant about not having players mess with the rules.
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The four ways to do it are breaker pushes, seated player pushes, and the player who normally would/would not shoot after the break pushes.
I think the easiest choice is breaker pushes since he is already at the table and presumably shot the break shot with his playing cue. I think this is also good for the flow/drama of play since the breaker would be setting up the problem for the seated player to face: shoot or pass?
If these rules became the norm, and Corey found a way to soft break while complying with them, would you still have a problem?
Where's your sense of adventure? I vote for a third party push-out. Better yet, rub catnip on the cue ball and give "Whiskers" 30 seconds to bat it around.
Y'know, if we start doing a push out after every break, people might enjoy the strategy involved and want the option to push out on every shot. Oh, wait...
Well I am not sure how you would "soft break" and get 3 balls past even the middle of the table without risking an illegal break, but yes, with no pattern racking and getting the balls down-table like I think is good, I'd have no issues with how he broke.
Like porn, "soft break", I will know it when I see it.
I would also make the penalty for illegal break a re-rack and re-break by the opponent or ball in hand, or something similarly costly to prevent people to try to "game" the system. Instead of "oops I broke soft by accident but you can't see the 1 and look at all the clusters so sorry you can't do anything".
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I think soft breaking and lying about fouls are separate issues. I don’t like any situation in which a player fouls and lies about it. I have zero problems with a player soft breaking.
Oh HELL yes!!! Yes Yes Yes Yes YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And we could call it something like... ( looking up, thinking ) ummmm... pushout! :dance: :dance: :dance:
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But they go hand in hand,
If you don't inform your competition you are about to make a soft break, then disputes like the one above with Corey and Shane will arise if four balls were forced into the rail or not.
In the event that a soft break is occuring, the opposition should be notified and when possible a third party should observe the break.
Informing the opponent would only soften the lashing.....they should be paying attention I sure as hell am
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Well Shane was paying attention, and called out Corey, and Corey denied fouling.
Which is why there needs to be a nonpartisan person watching the hit(or cameras). If that isn't available, I don't think a soft break should be allowed unless both players agree beforehand.
Sure, sounds good to me. Ask someone to watch the hit like you can during any questionable call. Makes no difference to me. I like people being creative.
He probably thought the 5 hit the rail....looks like it fizzed out. Personally I love it I seen breaks like this in 9 and 10 ball years ago with one guy giving up the odd numbered balls for a thou a game......was awesome lol
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Unless both players agree before hand? No, that is why there are rules. If the rules allow for soft breaks and you must announce a soft break, then so be it. Not sure what that does to change anything, it will still be a soft break.... Players do not get to dictate the rules, they get to know them or not know them. As for the foul, total bull crap if he fouled and lied about it.
Trent
Devil's advocate here............what do you do in straight pool or one pocket when your opponent does not break them wide open to start the game?
yeah, but then you're going to start every game with a protracted safety battle, which would turn most fans away
After reading all the comments so far, I kind of like
1. the breaker gets first shot, regardless of whether a ball was pocketed
(unless they scratch)
2. Money ball pocketed early spots up and must be last ball pocketed to count as win