SBE and DIAMOND TABLES (LONG)

scrappy said:
if you have english on the cue ball it will pick up speed off the rail
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That's true for any rail. I was just assuming zero spin.

I think that normal rails are so inefficient, that everyone perceives the CB to pick-up speed, when it just "loses less."

To be completely honest so I don't sound like a know-it-all, I thought the CB picked up speed too until Greg Sullivan gave me a physics lesson when I asked him the same question.
 
SpiderWebComm said:
That's true for any rail. I was just assuming zero spin.

I think that normal rails are so inefficient, that everyone perceives the CB to pick-up speed, when it just "loses less."

To be completely honest so I don't sound like a know-it-all, I thought the CB picked up speed too until Greg Sullivan gave me a physics lesson when I asked him the same question.
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I have to agree with what you were saying about speed off the cushion. Said another way; if a table has more efficient cushions, then the loss of speed would be a much smaller percentage than a dead cushion, giving the CB a higher rebound speed, but never exceeding the speed going into the cushion.

The only time you can "speed up" off the cushion is when the CB has side spin that is spinning faster than the forward roll of the CB.


Eric >should leave this stuff to the eggheads
 
The bathrooms were deplorable . The managment of the hotel should be rounded up and replaced. There is no excuse . They should have a crew just doing bathrooms every hour or so. I 'd be willing to pay 200 a night if they would update the rooms, get some service when requested not an hour and 10 min later , also our bellhop was half in the bag and would have dumped our stuff all over the lobby if I didn't catch the cart.

I think they also need a place downstairs that serves breakfast sandwiches. Leaving the hotel to go to Dunkin Doughnuts is a pain in the A$$.

The good news is we ate dinner like kings while we we're there

Wednesday we did the Cheesecake Factory . Found the food and the service to be very good .

Thursday we tried a little place called Peppers . Basically an Italian place . The waitress was really excellent and food was quite good ,portions were large. Most reasonably priced place we ate .

Friday we did the Steak at Sullivans . The waitress had a lousy attitude from the get go. Service is what I would call poor for an establishment at this price point. Food was excellent and my steak was cooked perfectly.

Saturday we did Legal Seafood . Everyone's food was very good . The Crabcakes were exceptional. Service was OK but could have been better.
 
Ive got to agree about the inconsistency of the tables. The tables upstairs played pretty good but in the pit, the speed was all over the place. Some tables were newly refelted and others were in serius need. The rails were definitely more "springy" than usual. First off let me say that I am a fan of Diamond tables. I think they play great and are consistently fair. However that was not the experience I had @ SBE. In the pit I hit a couple slow roll shots that should have come off of the rail a couple inches, but instead bounced clear across the table. Keep in mind I am not a pro by any strech of the imaginiation, but I do think something is wrong when a really easy shot that I hit well 99% of the time goes not only an extra inch or two but how about a foot or 2!!! that is HUGE on a 7 foot table! Maybe it would not have been such a big deal if we had 9 footers(not possible in current venue) but I was definitely disappointed in the way the tables played this year
 
So anyway.
Artemis = too damn bouncy, and if you have any type of shot where you are going 2 rails or more, the cue ball picking up spin means that you are going to go too far and lose your cue ball.

Time for a different rubber.
 
One thing to note that nobody has mentioned is the climate differences between all the areas that are being discussed. I always thought the diamond bar tables played much faster if the room was warm and humid. The pit was very hot (temperature) this year and humid. I remember playing a match at 11:00 pm last year upstairs where the air cond was pumping and there were less spectators and I thought the table slowed down alot and was far less "springy". The tables in the pro area where it was very cool were slow imo compared to most diamonds I played on in the past. I think the tables are fairly consistent but the conditions can change alot.
 
Diamond tables are the truest tables out there. It takes some adjustment to start playing your best pool. The banks are a hair different but play better when studied. The shot down the rail must be made...I mean the rails on older tables have a "Ronald Mcdonald" efffect (hug the rail like the golden arches) diamonds will kick bad shots off the rail I like that...

The shots from the middle of the table are nicer to play shape on, they almost like to take balls at high speeds...Nothing I dislike more than having a made ball hop out of a hole because, I hit it too hard. There should never be a point that I hit it too hard...I am trying to remember a ball that came right back out of a diamond and sat in the hole.

I just think that Diamond is the only table company in the commercial market that is trying to make a better table for us. Most company's are trying to build the same crappy table just cheaper than the years before.
 
Artemis rails are the absolute best rails money can buy. The ONLY Diamonds that use Artemis rails are the 9fts. The 7ft's have a Diamond Black K55 rail.

The rails themselves are not what's causing the "bouncy" reaction, it's the design of the table. Realkingcobra is working on a fix. Stay tuned.

Ray
 
Rails

I can adjust to a balls gaining speed of the 2nd and 3rd rails as many shots strangely do on Diamonds. Rolling past position for the first 30 minutes each day.

What I can't stand is how short they bank and kick. I mean 30 degrees into the rail and 10 degrees out. Nothing banks/kicks as well as brunswicks. I hate to admit it, but I'm with Earl on this one.

The bathrooms were disgusting as were the floors, but that many pool players what do you expect??
 
Bigtruck said:
Artemis rails are the absolute best rails money can buy. The ONLY Diamonds that use Artemis rails are the 9fts. The 7ft's have a Diamond Black K55 rail.

The rails themselves are not what's causing the "bouncy" reaction, it's the design of the table. Realkingcobra is working on a fix. Stay tuned.

Ray
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I like Diamonds, but would be interested in knowing the general nature of the design issue causing the rail behavior in question, if you are at liberty to disclose.

Lou Figueroa
 
lfigueroa said:
I like Diamonds, but would be interested in knowing the general nature of the design issue causing the rail behavior in question, if you are at liberty to disclose.

Lou Figueroa
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I would think it's a design issue with the actual rails, if it's that.
Only reason i say this is cause there are a couple of tables i know of where they put Diamond rails on CGs, (i don't know if it was just the rubber, or the whole rail design, or what) but regardless of how they did it, the rails play insane, and balls launch all over the place, and up and off the table with very little effort where it is no longer pool, it's pinball.
 
SUPERSTAR said:
I would think it's a design issue with the actual rails, if it's that.
Only reason i say this is cause there are a couple of tables i know of where they put Diamond rails on CGs, (i don't know if it was just the rubber, or the whole rail design, or what) but regardless of how they did it, the rails play insane, and balls launch all over the place, and up and off the table with very little effort where it is no longer pool, it's pinball.
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That problem is not with the cushions, it's with the mechanic that installed the cushions;)
 
lfigueroa said:
I like Diamonds, but would be interested in knowing the general nature of the design issue causing the rail behavior in question, if you are at liberty to disclose.

Lou Figueroa
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I will say this on Diamond's behalf, the issues that are being talked about are being addressed, and when Diamond has made a decision to make a change, Greg I'm sure will let everyone know. I can tell you however, change is close, as some of you are 100% correct...Diamond IS the only manufacture today that is always in pursuit of the perfect playing table, and when they reach that goal, I'm sure EVERYONE will share in the respect that Diamond's are the best playing pool tables on planet earth;)

Glen
 
I played in the TAP event downstairs and found the tables to play pretty much as I expected. SBE is the only place I see Diamonds, but they make the best small table by far.

One question...when did they shorten the shelf in the corner pockets? I saw more missed shots fall this year than I can remember. They played fair as far as rolls and speed go, but the pockets definitely seemed more generous.
 
Skess said:
I played in the TAP event downstairs and found the tables to play pretty much as I expected. SBE is the only place I see Diamonds, but they make the best small table by far.

One question...when did they shorten the shelf in the corner pockets? I saw more missed shots fall this year than I can remember. They played fair as far as rolls and speed go, but the pockets definitely seemed more generous.
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Skess,

There are two distinct variations on the Diamond table theme. Most smart tables are set up for league play. Same pocket dimensions but a shorter shelf. Easier to make balls. Most Pro/Am's have the deep pocket shelf making it much harder to pocket a poorly hit ball. Which would you prefer to gamble on?

Lyn
 
master9baller said:
I can adjust to a balls gaining speed of the 2nd and 3rd rails as many shots strangely do on Diamonds. Rolling past position for the first 30 minutes each day.

What I can't stand is how short they bank and kick. I mean 30 degrees into the rail and 10 degrees out. Nothing banks/kicks as well as brunswicks. I hate to admit it, but I'm with Earl on this one.

The bathrooms were disgusting as were the floors, but that many pool players what do you expect??
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Finally someone talking about how short Diamonds bank. TY
 
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