Serious question--- how does backing players make sense financially?!?!

B

barrymuch90

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've always had this question and I'm seriously wondering and looking for an answer so please keep this proper. I'm sure there's many qualified members to chime in so here goes::: why would someone back a player over the course of more than one match? Unless they win almost every time it can't be a good investment. Just for example say both matches between Dennis n Tony were payed for 100 000$ each player each time. We know that Tony won one n Dennis won the second. So if we can assume the backers gave their horses the typical cut at 25%_75% theyre in a huge Hole. Let's just be safe and say the cut is 33.333333% or a third. So Dennis' backer loses first and is down 100k. Then round two they win which gets them back to even but after the player gets his cut the backer is still down 33k? I mean I'm seriously wondering about this I'm not being foolish or looking for clicks or any other bs that some people think others do on this site.

So again the question is what are some of the reasons people back players and how does it make sense financially(besides the situation where the horse almost always wins because in that case it's pretty obvious why) but in every other situation how does it make sense to back someone over the course of multiple matches ????

Thanks in advance and please offer legit answers!!!
 
This came up because over the weekend I was backed st 200$ a game one pocket and after the time bill which was almost 100$ for both players we won basically 300$. My "backer handed me 140$ which in my eyes was more than enough(I've only been backed a few times in my life) but after it was all said and done the backer ended up winning 160$ and had we played again the next day and lost 2 games not only would the backer be even but he would of been minus 240$. I just can't see It being profitable of time. I can see where one time spots are fine but you see guys with backers that back them every game they're in and this is the situation I'm talking about.
 
barrymuch90 said:
This came up because over the weekend I was backed st 200$ a game one pocket and after the time bill which was almost 100$ for both players we won basically 300$. My "backer handed me 140$ which in my eyes was more than enough(I've only been backed a few times in my life) but after it was all said and done the backer ended up winning 160$ and had we played again the next day and lost 2 games not only would the backer be even but he would of been minus 240$. I just can't see It being profitable of time. I can see where one time spots are fine but you see guys with backers that back them every game they're in and this is the situation I'm talking about.
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I have no first hand knowledge, but I would guess people who back players like Dennis are seeing the "long game". Meaning they are counting on Dennis coming out on top way more than he loses. So that if the player does end up losing a match here and there, due to their overall long term success, the backer is still up.

Or, maybe they have money to spare and just like seeing a good competition. Good question.
 
Alot of them do it cause they just love the action and love to watch pool and win money at same time.
 
Moet.1977 said:
Alot of them do it cause they just love the action and love to watch pool and win money at same time.
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I think this is it. I don't know that is a "serious" answer to your question. It's not usually about the money, it's about the action.
 
I know a couple of backers. From what they've told me that backing players is an art form and they make between 70 and 100k complete profit above expenses a year if they're smart. They also spend their lives in a pool room with those type people. Smart doesn't mean necessarily you keep playing the same player until one of the starts winning of you're on the losing side. If you're winner you're supposed to protect the bulk of those winnings which puts the loser on the road to find a new game. You win some and you lose some and you honor an adjustment of the spot maybe once if you want to keep the money. Not a glamorous life.

barrymuch90 said:
I've always had this question and I'm seriously wondering and looking for an answer so please keep this proper. I'm sure there's many qualified members to chime in so here goes::: why would someone back a player over the course of more than one match? Unless they win almost every time it can't be a good investment. Just for example say both matches between Dennis n Tony were payed for 100 000$ each player each time. We know that Tony won one n Dennis won the second. So if we can assume the backers gave their horses the typical cut at 25%_75% theyre in a huge Hole. Let's just be safe and say the cut is 33.333333% or a third. So Dennis' backer loses first and is down 100k. Then round two they win which gets them back to even but after the player gets his cut the backer is still down 33k? I mean I'm seriously wondering about this I'm not being foolish or looking for clicks or any other bs that some people think others do on this site.

So again the question is what are some of the reasons people back players and how does it make sense financially(besides the situation where the horse almost always wins because in that case it's pretty obvious why) but in every other situation how does it make sense to back someone over the course of multiple matches ????

Thanks in advance and please offer legit answers!!!
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Vegas Baby!!!

I think it is just like going to Vegas to win money.

All the gamblers, as a whole, will lose money because of the house advantage. All backers, as a whole, will lose money because of the horse's payout. But, just as in Vegas, everyday someone will be a winner. That's the action that keeps everyone coming back to it.

The real winners, the horses and the casinos. I believe you are correct that, as a whole, backers can't make money.
 
Thanks guys these are all good responses. What I meant by serious is not jokes n sarcasm. But yea mainly after u pay ur player ur cutting into at least 2/3 ur profit and up to half or more on some occasions so if we're talking about 100000$ matches I didn't understand how it made sense from a money making stance. I could see if a guy is super flush doesn't mind losing loves the action and being around the room and games but what I can't understand is if a guy thinks it's a good business venture so to speak unless his horse basically wins 9/10 times. Any less and after paying the player a percentage there's not much profit.

Thanks again
 
It doesn't. Take any money you would do that with and put it into some nice blue chip stocks and forget about it for a couple of decades.
My bet is on the blue chips being worth more.
 
Koop said:
It doesn't. Take any money you would do that with and put it into some nice blue chip stocks and forget about it for a couple of decades.
My bet is on the blue chips being worth more.
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Like those organic blue corn chips? Is the market trending that way?
 
Scratch85 said:
I think it is just like going to Vegas to win money.

All the gamblers, as a whole, will lose money because of the house advantage. All backers, as a whole, will lose money because of the horse's payout. But, just as in Vegas, everyday someone will be a winner. That's the action that keeps everyone coming back to it.

The real winners, the horses and the casinos. I believe you are correct that, as a whole, backers can't make money.
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Not really, Vegas gives you much better odds, and that should tell you something. I mean, backing a player, you are giving 2-1 on the money, all day long. That's some tight action to fade.

Black Jack, the house has less about a 5% advantage, give or take, based on dealer standing on all 17's, doubling down rules, etc. And the player plays the correct way. And if playing single or double deck, at some point in the game, the odds can move to 0 for the house, and actually go negative for the house in rare occasions if you are tracking "10s".

Backing is some tough action, I think someone said it's more about being in the "action" and maybe even a little "ego" thing.. you may not play like Spider Mike, but damn it, I can back him and live vicariously through him ;)
 
Rj I'm not sure about the odds but my wife was a dealer for years and now is a supervisor and she says on most people playing blackjack at some point their up and winning but they never hardly quite.

That's one of the big secrets to playing in a casino is when u finally get up on the house go cash out, most won't.
 
Moet.1977 said:
Alot of them do it cause they just love the action and love to watch pool and win money at same time.
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Bingo! As a strictly business thing, being a backer is foolish. So, I figure they enjoy that rush gamblers seem to be addicted to.
 
barrymuch90 said:
... Thanks in advance and please offer legit answers!!!
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One way that would make sense is if the deal was long-term, say for a year. The backer would take care of expenses and if there was a profit at the end of the year the player would get some cash. This makes more sense if the player doesn't play well on his own money.

But I agree with some of the posts above -- it's the action.
 
And there are occasionally a few who do it to waste some money.

I have told the tale here before, but there was a guy I used to play and he would never win. Not a blowout, but over the years, I must have beat him damn near into mid 4 figures.

We had a decent dialog- though not 'friend's, an I once asked him why he never asked to change the game..

He replied 'it ain't money that can go in th bank.'
 
The guys that backed Dennis in the 2nd match vs Tony have been the backers in several of the high stakes matches with several different players over the last few years.

They are pretty damn sharp imo and seem to put their money up in good games and have won lot of money doing it.

They are very smart guys and are well aware of the money odds in each match they are giving up.
 
Depends upon the player and the backer.

I used to work in a pool hall as a kid and all the way through high school.

Once I reached about 16, I was beating everybody in town for money. The owner of the pool hall was my backer and he would tell me to quit working if somebody came in and wanted to play for money. He told me to take as much money as I needed from the register. I could play whomever I wanted, for whatever amount. The reason he did it was because we won over 90% of our matches.

I played one-pocket with the old guys for as much as $100 a game and I played snooker for $100 a game. I actually started out playing snooker more than pool. I later concentrated on pool because that was where the money was.

When I was off work and somebody came in and wanted to play or showed up at one of the bars in town wanting to play somebody, he would call me at my house (8 miles out in the country) and tell me he was sending a taxi to pick me up to play. The taxi driver would have a bag of money with about $500 in it and he would take me to whatever place where the person was who was wanting to play.

I got 20%, and sometimes more, of everything we won. I can remember walking around with over $1,000 in my pocket at a time when I was 16. Everybody else my age was sacking groceries or working at a $2 an hour job (if that). If I was carrying $1,000 it meant he was winning a lot more than my 20%..

On weekends and holidays, when the rest of the kids were in bed, counting sheep, I was playing marathon cash games for up to 12-18 hours all day and night and counting money. We used to close the pool hall at midnight, lock the doors, and keep the gambling going until somebody ran out of money or quit.
 
Backing pool players is a losing proposition

except when you have the nuts ,playing strangers or idiots with games
that you can not lose

the average professional pool player counts on dumping his backer for a good percent of his income

lets face it,the player doesn't have any money of his own,he has failed at hiscchosen profession

the only way to make money is to get a groupie stake horse to bet on him with games
he can't win

or he makes games that appear good,but he dumps the backer to get his half

backing is for idiots
 
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