Shaft adjustment?

acousticsguru

player/instructor
Silver Member
Hoping for some input from cue makers. The following is from a highly respected cue maker on the subject of flat-face wood-to-wood jointed cues, and I'm trying to figure out what exactly this means:

"[…] in a few weeks the cue with shaft on will roll crooked on a table. You must then adjust the shaft some at the joint. Do not adjust the cue butt joint, only the joint end of the shaft. Any cuemaker or cue repairman can show you how to do that.

Wood compresses and it usually takes a few hundred hours to get the cue broke in where the shaft has about reached its final compression and it remains straight."


I've been playing, teaching, as well as buying, selling, collecting cues for over quarter of a century now, and must admit I'm not sure I understand. Is it that the phenolic collar ring on the shaft side is being pressed into the shaft wood and thus won't remain at a perfect 90 degrees to the shaft? If so, how does that "adjustment" work?

In my experience, the cues (custom primarily, along with production cues for students, rarely for myself) I bought have all ranged on a spectrum of relative straightness already upon arrival, that is, out of the box, and although I've sometimes seen shafts warp, and more rarely, butts warp over time, and noticed alignment problems due to grime students apparently never cleaned off the faces of their cues' joints, I do not remember noticing the aforementioned effect. In all fairness, I've also seen and owned cues that never moved one bit (= those tend to be my "keepers").

On a side note, straightness in a cue to me is paramount, and my rule of thumb is simple: since I can no longer claim the sharp-sightedness of some of the eagle-eyed young guns I teach, I'd say if I (= the customer) can see a taper roll, the cue is not straight in my book. I won't say it invariably affects play if a cue isn't visibly straight, but I will say that if I'm asked to pay top dollar for a cue, straightness figures right at the top of my requirements list.

Thanks in advance!

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 
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JoeyInCali

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don't see why the phenolic collars would compress too.
The phenolics do not press on wood.
They press against each other.
I'm assuming the shafts and the butt have the same collars.

The wood threads do wear out and/or compress/expand.
 

acousticsguru

player/instructor
Silver Member
I don't see why the phenolic collars would compress too.
The phenolics do not press on wood.
They press against each other.
I'm assuming the shafts and the butt have the same collars.

The wood threads do wear out and/or compress/expand.

I'm a bit slow sometimes, please forgive: does that mean you disagree with the premise? I can't yet tell if I agree or disagree, since I'm just trying to make sense of it.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 

DD Custom Cues

Cues by Drew
Silver Member
Do you mean a real sneaky style cue with no collars on shaft or butt just wood? If so I've had to reface a lot of that style cue for that reason. The wood compresses and the cue doesn't roll straight. A lot of makers won't build that style anymore for that reason.
 

manwon

"WARLOCK 1"
Silver Member
I don't see why the phenolic collars would compress too.
The phenolics do not press on wood.
They press against each other.
I'm assuming the shafts and the butt have the same collars.

The wood threads do wear out and/or compress/expand.


I agree with you Joey, I don't know what else they could mean.
 

rhncue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I agree somewhat with the maker. A shaft MAY need tuned after a while of use caused by a different climate, damper or drier conditions from where it was made or a tiny speck of dirt becoming embedded in the face of shaft or joint. It is a very easy fix which only takes a couple of minutes and anyone with an I.Q. over 57 should have no problem curing. I don't want to post how to do it on the open forum but if you want send me a PM and I'll explain how to make it run as true as a freight train.

Dick
 

cueman

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I agree somewhat with the maker. A shaft MAY need tuned after a while of use caused by a different climate, damper or drier conditions from where it was made or a tiny speck of dirt becoming embedded in the face of shaft or joint. It is a very easy fix which only takes a couple of minutes and anyone with an I.Q. over 57 should have no problem curing. I don't want to post how to do it on the open forum but if you want send me a PM and I'll explain how to make it run as true as a freight train.

Dick

I surprised with all the really great info you have shared through the years that you would hold back on something someone with an IQ of 58 could grasp.
If you have a top secret trick that is more than just refacing the joint please PM me. I will keep it a secret at least until I forget it was supposed to be a secret, or until the five year statute of limitations on keeping cue building secrets expires, which ever comes first. :smile:
 

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
When someone asks you if you can 'keep a secret', it's pretty obvious that they can't.

KJ
 

acousticsguru

player/instructor
Silver Member
Do you mean a real sneaky style cue with no collars on shaft or butt just wood? If so I've had to reface a lot of that style cue for that reason. The wood compresses and the cue doesn't roll straight. A lot of makers won't build that style anymore for that reason.

Collars on both butt and shafts. But thanks, makes sense!

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 

BLACKHEARTCUES

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm sorry, but I've built over 1000 Qs & I don't expect any of them to be "adjusted". I can't imagine a Q needing to be "adjusted", just because it's been played with, for a number of hours. 1st off, roll the butt & shaft separately. If they are straight & only roll bad when assembled, then the problem is at the joint. If the surfaces of the joint have been damaged, because it was dropped or dirty, that's one thing, but I've never heard of an adjustment being standard. There's a lot I don't know & this may be one of them...JER
 

scdiveteam

Rick Geschrey
Silver Member
I'm sorry, but I've built over 1000 Qs & I don't expect any of them to be "adjusted". I can't imagine a Q needing to be "adjusted", just because it's been played with, for a number of hours. 1st off, roll the butt & shaft separately. If they are straight & only roll bad when assembled, then the problem is at the joint. If the surfaces of the joint have been damaged, because it was dropped or dirty, that's one thing, but I've never heard of an adjustment being standard. There's a lot I don't know & this may be one of them...JER

Jer,

Over 1000 cue allows you to make your observation without just taking a wild guess for sure. I tend to agree with your point for sure but I don't have your kind of cue production and observation backgrond.

What I will add to this thread is that I have be told my a friend who has been in the business forever that you don't roll a cue on the table, you roll it on the rail and watch the ferrule rotation and the joint for up and down movement.

The customer will always roll it on the table and because of the length of the shaft and leverage that occurs with the contact on the table a cue that is a little problem could pass muster on the table.

Therefore before a cue leaves the shop one should observe it both ways to be circumspect.

A little finish over lap on the face can make a great shaft look like a piece of crap.

Rick
 
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