shipping or traveling with a cue that has ivory inlays or components

mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv

mortuarymike-nv
Silver Member
I have not traveled out of country with a cue that has ivory in it.
But i strongly urge everyone to study up on the pre band ivory laws.
I called the San Francisco port authorities, the customs agent was very clear. But dont take my word on it find out for yourself.

Ivory poaching is at a record hi.

I wanted to post this in the wanted for sale section but because nothing is for sale it was against the rules.

In a nut shell 100 years old and you have to be able to prove it.
pre band ivory is not legal to take out of the USA or shipped in the USA.
walrus tusk has some very strick laws too .
I just dont want to see people caught up in this with out knowing.
MMike
 
Thanks for the heads up.

There was a member on here informing everyone about this in the For Sale section and got lynched for it. They said he was just trying to rain on everyone's parade. More like the sellers don't care because they want to make some $$$$. They are just as guilty as the poachers.

Anyways, thanks for the heads up and people should really follow these laws. Sooner or later we will see a dispute on why somebody didn't receive a cue.

Exercise caution.
 
ivory

I dont want to see anyone caught up in this because they didnt understand the laws. It seems that different people interpret the law differently and thats fine. I still suggest to talk to the port authorities
so you know the laws in full details.
MMike
 
mortuarymike-nv said:
I dont want to see anyone caught up in this because they didnt understand the laws. It seems that different people interpret the law differently and thats fine. I still suggest to talk to the port authorities
so you know the laws in full details.
MMike
Click to expand...

I wasn't aware and now that I am.

I don't think many dealers care...well, not the ones that sell here, after reading the response the other gentleman got.
 
dealers

I not so sure most dealers in here live by pretty stick rules when it comes to ivory and international shipping . Anyway its each persons choice to know the laws.
This thread is to educate people and it is not only for shipping cues it also pertains to traveling over seas with our cues i wouldnt want to loose my favorite cue because i was to lazy to check on the pre band law.
MMike
 
I took a cue that had Ivory in it into Canada from New York. I stopped at the US customs on my way and got a slip of paper so there would be no problem bringing it back into the USA. The US Customs do not care what you take out of this country. They only care what you bring with you when you come back.
 
Most ivory has a grain that's fairly easy to see. Different types of ivory have different patterns, so an educated inspector can tell if it's narwhal, walrus, elephant, or mastodon.

According to Canada Custom and Excise if in doubt, the object will be "disassembled" to determine the ivory content and if this is not possible the item will be confiscated.

Under CITES the US sets a quota each year of the amount of ivory that it will allow to be exported. The limit is set at 0 each year.
 
Ivory

Closely scrutinize the surface using a magnifying glass or even a microscope. Ivory, bone, and plastic have unique characteristics which differentiate them from each other.

Ask the following questions:

Is the surface lined or smooth? Absolutely smooth surfaces are a characteristic of plastic.

If the surface is lined, do the lines (on any side) crosshatch or run generally parallel? Cross hatching (roughly diamond shaped cross hatching) is a good indication that the material is ivory, as are translucent wavy lines.

Roughly parallel lines are a good indication that the material is either cut lengthwise from ivory (older ivory is cross cut) or possibly bone.

Genuine Elephant Ivory will have the grain running roughly parallel, if the lines are perfectly parallel, odds are its imitation Ivory. Genuine Mastodon Ivory will have a lot of cross hatching, especially around the outer rim when looking at a cross section. Genuine Whale Ivory will appear much whiter and smoother than most other types of Ivory. Genuine Walrus Ivory will have heavy dark spots in various areas of the surface. The center of the fossilized Ivory will have marrow that is much tougher and harder to work than the outer layer.

Genuine Ivory is seldom "smooth" in its natural form. It must be polished smooth before it can be used for scrimshaw or carving. Some Ivories such as Mastodon will have an Outer Bark Layer often exhibiting fantastic shades of blues, greens, purples, browns, etc.

When purchasing scrimshawed or carved Ivory, look for small mistakes in the workmanship such as lines that have "moved" or re cut. This is a good indication of hand carving. A lot of "fake" pieces are drawn with tattoo needles and computerized equipment and some are even simply applied designs that will wash off under running water.



Does the surface have multiple darkened dots or pits? If so, this is a very good indicator of it's being bone. Ivory tends to be smoother, harder, and not pitted.

If the surface is smooth and you see no obvious lines, try heating the tip of a pin to red hot and touching it to the surface of the object in an area that is not easily visible. If the hot pin dents the surface, you've got a plastic object.


Feel around the edges, bottom, and top for a single line. If there's a line that sticks out and continues all around until it meets, it's plastic — the line is from when the two molds containing the plastic are put together, fusing the two halves together.

Keep in mind, plastic is usually very easy to tell from ivory and bone, as it is generally lighter (in color and weight) than ivory or bone. Also, the color is even and consistent all over.

MMike
 
I just posted something like this in a diffrent thread. I just flew from korea to the states with my cue with ivory in it in a checked bag there was no issue what so ever.

Port authority has to do with boats if im not mistaken not airlines the tsa deals with airlines not boats.

As far as decleaing you cues when your flying it only has to deal with foods, fruit,duty free items jewlrey and money close to or over 10k.

There is nothing there that pretains to cues so i never declear my cues becuse they do not fall in any of the catogories.
 
The CITES regulations restrict the transport of ivory and some other materials across "State" borders. They define countries as "States". It really has nothing to do with whether or not the ivory is "Pre-Ban" or not. Documentation as to the origin doesn't really matter. I have heard that if you move or travel from one country to another, you can file some paperwork that will allow you to take it with you and then return. I've also heard that the paperwork is complicated and could get you in trouble if you don't complete it correctly. As for detection, I also have been told that it can be identified with ultra violet light so they can tell fairly easily.

The whole ivory harvesting debate has gone on for a long time, and I understand both sides. I don't use ivory myself as I think there are better materials for the things I would use it for. I also don't believe that because ivory is used, that elephants were murdered to get it. Thomas Wayne wrote a very informative piece on ivory,
http://www.cuemaster.com/RSB/ivory.htm
but it was a little while ago. Of the people who I have talked to about ivory, those who are against it seem to have done less research than those who are for it. Those who are against it seem to mostly believe that all ivory is illegal, and that elephants definitely were poached or murdered to get it. I know that to not be the case.

Royce Bunnell
hoping he didn't make anybody mad with this post!
 
Buckzapper said:
I took a cue that had Ivory in it into Canada from New York. I stopped at the US customs on my way and got a slip of paper so there would be no problem bringing it back into the USA. The US Customs do not care what you take out of this country. They only care what you bring with you when you come back.
Click to expand...

Why did you do that? Sounds like just asking for a problem where there's already a solution. Leave it at home.

JC
 
RBC said:
hoping he didn't make anybody mad with this post!
Click to expand...

Royce, no matter what you say, you'll be in trouble with someone. :D Thanks for adding valuable information to the thread.

As we're all cross-posting I will repeat the CITES information:

Ghosst said:
CITES certificates are indeed hard to fill out, have approved, and understood by the agents themselves. If you absolutely MUST travel with an ivory cue, hire an import/export lawyer and have them fill out the certificate.
Click to expand...
 
pre band laws

hello Jose V
I suggest that you find out the details of the pre band Ivory law.
I have checked into this law in person. Elephant ivory crossing any boarder is illegal pre band or not, inless it was finish ivory done at least 100 year ago and you have to have the proper documemtation.................
How the law is being enforced doesnt change the the law.



The feds are setting up false businesses trying to buy preband ivory out of the USA, Atlas just got busted about 6 months ago. anything with ivory in falls under the pre band ivory act 1988.........................................
anything with ivory there are no exceptions

poaching ivory is at at record hi there is going to be a world wide crack down.

My last comment on this thread . It is everyones personal choice on which laws we break or dont break. If im going to break a law I want to at least know it. and that is why i started this thread we should be educated
on certain laws.
Be careful not to loose a cue because you dont understand the preband ivory law find out for yourself .
MMike
 
3473867313_744ababa79_m.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top