Shorter backswing..

[Snoogi]

Jezzzz Buzzsaw. The longer length of follow through is an Urban Myth. The cueball is gone in about 1/1000 of a second. No amount of follow through will change the energy in the cueball.

Longer shorter follow throughs, subconciously our body mechanisms create the difference. We can't distinguish the difference in the seconds but somehow we can tell from the effects on the cueball.

All SOP shots should have the same length follow through. How you get to the cueball is more important.

Thanks.

SPF=randyg

Quite true but that's only half the stroke. How we finish the cueball is equally important. JMO.

 

[kildegirl]

pool

I also underwent a change in my backswing, some time back. I have shortened my backswing & when practicing, I also concentrate on taking the cue straight back on the shot line & slower than I used to.

When practicing, I try to imagine that I am cocking my arm to stroke the cue ball a certain distance.

As mentioned before, I try to assimilate the speed needed in my warmup strokes. The one other thing, which has helped considerably, is a second setting to check my aim & a short but definite pause. check aim how ???

I do believe the Backswing is crucial component for success

and you check your aim to pocket the object ball? what aiming system do you use ???

 

[kildegirl]

pool

and you check your aim to pocket the object ball? what aiming system do you use ???

not ghost ball i hope because the ghost ball is invisible

 

[SPINDOKTOR]

In Shaq's case, since he is 7'+ tall, I think a 62" cue would work better. However, IMO he could still play with a normal cue...he'd just have to hold on to the very end of the buttcap with his thumb and forefinger. As long as he was still able to freeswing his forearm (a natural pendulum swing), and the forearm was mostly perpendicular at impact, the shorter cue shouldn't make a lot of difference. I've already worked with guys 6'5", who played with a regular length cue with no problem. They just have to hold the cue at the back end, behind the wrap.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Ok, I see, but I tend to leans towards a longer cue for the taller people, with a standard length cue you have to admitt there is a lil bit of a disadvantage there, even if that means they are holding the very end of the cue, that to me isnt ideal. Im sure the standard length makes it easy on cue makers, but in reality I think every player needs a cue fitted to thier body type and playing style. Hence, a custom cue.

I have toyed with the idea of a BIG AND TALL store for the bigger people in our pool community, where a standard length cue is 64" long with the option of up to a 70" length cue, with thicker butts, I think its time to give the big and tall people respect enough to produce a product that gives them an equal chance to become the best they can be. I mean Shaq could use a standard length cue as a tooth pick...lol


SPINDOKTOR

 

[kildegirl]

Pool

I have been noticing something about my game. The longer the backswing the more i miss. I have been watching alot of mike sigel tapes and i noticed that he doesn't go that far back. Same thing with allen hopkins. Now, allen is on the extreme end of that. However, i think i remember something to the effect that when the straightness of cue shaft deliveryto the cue ball is taken into account; allen hopkins had the straightest stroke of all of the pros. Can anyone confirm this? I think you have to have alot of natural ability to take long back swings and always come through the cue ball perfectly every time. There only so many people who can do this consistently? James walden also has short back swings. So anyway i have been experimenting with it. It seems that i'm shooting straighter, however, when you experiment with things you always think you found the missing "ingredient" to pool. Anybody have any insight to any of this?

WHAT ABOUT YOUR AIMING SYSTEM ??
Use the same aiming system that efren & bustamante use.

 

[JoeyInCali]

WHAT ABOUT YOUR AIMING SYSTEM ??
Use the same aiming system that efren & bustamante use.

Ghost ball or contact points?

Their aiming system is called " patama".

 

[birdy]

WHAT ABOUT YOUR AIMING SYSTEM ??
Use the same aiming system that efren & bustamante use.

This thread is not about aiming systems so why don't you try the search option for that ?

 

[3kushn]

I disagree that a longer backswing isn't as accurate as a short one. If your delivery process is accurate and repeatable, the cue will move in a straight line, regardless of how long your backswing is. IMO, the key phrase here is, "longer backstroke than NORMAL". The only purpose of the backswing is to create enough distance between the cuetip and CB, to provide the necessary acceleration through the CB. A "normal" backswing should deliver the tip (on the backswing), at the minimum, to the fingernail of your outstretched finger on your bridge hand. Many players prefer to bring the tip back to the knuckle. Buddy Hall almost pulls the tip out of his bridge hand. This is true for 95% of all SOP shots. Folks who shortstroke the cue will likely have difficulty varying the strokespeed of the cue, because the brain goes into 'override' mode when you shortstroke, but still want to put some speed on the CB. Then grip takes over, the shot gets muscled, and there is a complete breakdown of the normal stroke process. Hopkins is certainly an exception to this rule, but he is a freak of nature, albeit a many time champion player.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

REPEATABLE STROKE is the key. Right Scott?
There's numerous great players with very long strokes. Personally I don't know how they consistantly and accurately place the tip on the CB where they want it. But they do. The only answer is they're totally locked in (Repeatable).

A long back stroke requires more wood in front of the bridge hand. The slightest movement off line in the back or forward stroke is multiplied at the tip. Less wood = less effect from the forearm moving off line.

Could this be a check or drill for our stroke. Practice some shots with a really long stroke. If you're missing shots maybe there's a flaw somewhere?

 

[Hail Mary Shot]

it is less accurate for those who have a shaky hand or wobbly arm. another thing is there is a chance that you might hit the CB on the wrong side or put some unnecessary english on it, thus a miss. there is no need for the long backswing unless you need the extra juice on the CB. the idea is to put enough distance between the cue and the CB itself for the juice, thus the longer backswing. as to consistency on the longer backswing, takes practice and familiarity. I, myself started out with the shorter backstroke since I got some accuracy pocketing issues when I was still starting to play. when my pocketing got good, I then started to put more action on the CB by adjusting my backswing further. it felt awkward at first , but I got into it after a few sessions. I dunno if it comes natural to a player to develop it or can it be taught? imo, the accuracy is definitely not, so stick to what suits you best and get a good cue which gives a lot of action.

 

[JohnnyP]

I understand Larry Craig has a wide stance...

Sorry.

Scott Lee: Did you watch the tape of Ray Martin on the straight pool forum?

Can you comment on his stroke? Check in between time 19:00 through 20:00.

A spectator says "Mr. Martin, I notice your upper arm remains still."

Ray demonstrates that you don't want to drop the elbow, then proceeds to drop it (all the way) as he runs out.

His grip hand never arcs toward his chest. It only goes forward.

 

[buzzsaw]

Jezzzz Buzzsaw. The longer length of follow through is an Urban Myth. The cueball is gone in about 1/1000 of a second. No amount of follow through will change the energy in the cueball.

All SOP shots should have the same length follow through. How you get to the cueball is more important.

Thanks.

SPF=randyg

It may be an urban legend but it helps me to keep from slapping at the CB. If I don't concentrate on a sufficient follow through I get this choppy stroke that seldom works correctly. I understand the dynamics of the CB hit. It's not like the cue stays on the CB but mentally it makes me continue on with the stroke. Just like in golf if I stop the club head at the ball I generally don't get the hit I was expecting.

 

[3andstop]

It may be an urban legend but it helps me to keep from slapping at the CB. If I don't concentrate on a sufficient follow through I get this choppy stroke that seldom works correctly. I understand the dynamics of the CB hit. It's not like the cue stays on the CB but mentally it makes me continue on with the stroke. Just like in golf if I stop the club head at the ball I generally don't get the hit I was expecting.

Absolutely true. I don't care what any expert says about this topic. A smooth complete follow through is KEY to consistent success. It allows your delivery to be accurate because contacting the cue ball is neither the beginning or end of the event, it is merely a portion of it during the event.

 

[buzzsaw]

Absolutely true. I don't care what any expert says about this topic. A smooth complete follow through is KEY to consistent success. It allows your delivery to be accurate because contacting the cue ball is neither the beginning or end of the event, it is merely a portion of it during the event.

I couldn't agree more with you.

 

[pooltchr]

It may be an urban legend but it helps me to keep from slapping at the CB. If I don't concentrate on a sufficient follow through I get this choppy stroke that seldom works correctly. I understand the dynamics of the CB hit. It's not like the cue stays on the CB but mentally it makes me continue on with the stroke. Just like in golf if I stop the club head at the ball I generally don't get the hit I was expecting.

Follow through is simply the result of finishing your stroke. Finishing your stroke is critical, and will automatically give the desired follow through.
Steve

 

[goettlicher]

Follow through is simply the result of finishing your stroke. Finishing your stroke is critical, and will automatically give the desired follow through.
Steve

So very true.

One of the first things a good player has to know is:

Where does my cue tip stop on my Standard every day stroke? Then his job is to put it there on every Standard stroke. If a player doesn't Finish his stroke on every shot, then every delivery is different. The amount of follow through should never change on a Standard stroke.

A great stroke finishes with the proper (for you) finish position....SPF=randyg

 

[Scott Lee]

3andstop...One thing many people fail to understand is that followthrough is not something you MAKE happen. As pooltchr noted, followthrough is the RESULT of finishing your stroke. The amount of followthrough (defined as the distance the tip travels past where the CB sits) is predetermined by a person's body style. Making your cue follow past the CB a longer distance (by dropping your elbow) does not create more followthrough...nor does it have any effect on what happens with the CB!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Absolutely true. I don't care what any expert says about this topic. A smooth complete follow through is KEY to consistent success. It allows your delivery to be accurate because contacting the cue ball is neither the beginning or end of the event, it is merely a portion of it during the event.

 

[buzzsaw]

3andstop...One thing many people fail to understand is that followthrough is not something you MAKE happen. As pooltchr noted, followthrough is the RESULT of finishing your stroke. The amount of followthrough (defined as the distance the tip travels past where the CB sits) is predetermined by a person's body style. Making your cue follow past the CB a longer distance (by dropping your elbow) does not create more followthrough...nor does it have any effect on what happens with the CB!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Scott, please explain what you mean by "body style". You talk about finishing your stroke and that is exactly what I was refering to. You also say that it is something that you can not MAKE happen. I am having a hard time with this one. If you do not practice, therefore making something HAPPEN, how do you ever get to the point of success? A perfect swing with follow through doesn't just happen on it's own.

I respect your position on this matter, I am just trying to understand.

 

[mikepage]

first,

[...]followthrough (defined as the distance the tip travels past where the CB sits) [...]

And then,

Making your cue follow past the CB a longer distance ([...]) does not create more followthrough.[...]

You only get to pick one of these.

 

[JohnnyP]

Scott:

Please look at a one minute segment of the video below, and comment on Ray's follow through.

The part I'm interested in starts at 19 minutes 0 seconds.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8294808311951707336

 

[goettlicher]

Scott, please explain what you mean by "body style". You talk about finishing your stroke and that is exactly what I was refering to. You also say that it is something that you can not MAKE happen. I am having a hard time with this one. If you do not practice, therefore making something HAPPEN, how do you ever get to the point of success? A perfect swing with follow through doesn't just happen on it's own.

I respect your position on this matter, I am just trying to understand.

I'm not Scott...BUT, "A perfect swing with follow through doesn't just happen on it's own."

A perfect swing includes the follow through as part of the perfect action. Therefore a follow through is only a important part of a perfect swing. Yes you must practice a perfect stroke to have a perfect strroke....SPF=randyg