SJM – My Thoughts on WPA’s Actions

[stewie]

Pool politics! In such a fractioned industry, it's uncanny how something of this magnitude is happening. We railbirds can all have opinions, but it's the pool players on the international professional tournament trail who are the ones whose opinions matter most.

Most who have been reading my posts since 2003 are aware of my disdain for the BCA, the so-called "governing body of North American professional pool." Today it is an industry-member organization, though they are supposed to be governing professional pool.

For many years, I have also expressed how useless the WPA is, only to be told by a few that the WPA is needed for the Olympic Games, and we need them in professional pool.

Europe has good governing bodies called "federations" in professional pool. USA is nothing. For the European pros, this political quagmire of WPA v. Matchroom is major.

While the majority seem to think F the WPA and bend the knee to Matchroom, my thought is why isn't anybody hold the BCA's feet to the fire and step up to the plate and defend American professional pool? If their only interest is industry members' sales, then quit calling themselves the "Billiard Congress of America" and call themselves the "Billiard Industry Member Association of America," BIMAA fo short.

I thing BCA is partially responsible for the lack of professional-caliber players in USA today. If we had a federation like Europe supporting professional pool, things might be quite different here on American soil. I can count on one hand how many professional-caliber players live here today. It was quite different 30, 40 years ago. Is the BCA to blame? Well, in a way, yes.

So while everyone is debating how useless the WPA and/or how much it is needed, my American view is look to the BCA to stand up and do the right thing for American professional pool like their name implies.

100% agree on the bca. If other national federations are the benchmark, the bca would be the one to organize national championships, talent scouting and development as well as funding for the upcoming elite to be competing on the top level.

 

[buckshotshoey]

Oddly enough, although the Olympic push was a failure, it has borne some fruit. Ever since pool was recognized as an Olympic Sport om about 2000, numerous National Olympic Committees have supported the efforts of pool professionals. This has much to due with the globalization in pool we have and continue to see. WPA has always set guidelines for tournaments and has maintained the schedule, the rules and the worldwide rankings. Pool, it seems has outgrown the WPA model, but that's just my opinion.

Here is my issue with the Olympics...

It needs to go back to the time when the Olympic games were an amateur only competition. No pro players allowed.

 

[garczar]

Here is my issue with the Olympics...

It needs to go back to the time when the Olympic games were an amateur only competition. No pro players allowed.

I agree but that horse is never going back in the barn. The line between pro's/am's has pretty much been erased in a lot of sports.

 

[buckshotshoey]

I agree but that horse is never going back in the barn. The line between pro's/am's has pretty much been erased in a lot of sports.

The IOC has no credibility in my book. Just heard on the radio this morning that IOC talks are to begin in India to make flag football (among other games) an Olympic sport.

 

[The_JV]

It needs to go back to the time when the Olympic games were an amateur only competition. No pro players allowed.

But why...? I thought the original intent of the games was to have nations compete against each other with their best. If that's the case then why does it matter if those reps are pro or amateur...?

I next to zero interest in the games on any level. Just curious on the "amateur only" reasoning

 

[decent dennis]

But why...? I thought the original intent of the games was to have nations compete against each other with their best. If that's the case then why does it matter if those reps are pro or amateur...?

I next to zero interest in the games on any level. Just curious on the "amateur only" reasoning

Why do you think they stripped Jim Thorpe of his medals. Which was horse(&^* by the way!

 

[garczar]

When the Olympic

But why...? I thought the original intent of the games was to have nations compete against each other with their best. If that's the case then why does it matter if those reps are pro or amateur...?

I next to zero interest in the games on any level. Just curious on the "amateur only" reasoning

s re-started in 1896 it was all amateur athletes. It was the reckless abuse of amateur status by the Russians/East Germans that started the slide into letting pros in. Original intent was for athletes to compete out of love for their particular sport and not a cash payout. You asked why so this is why. What the Olympics are today is a lib political farce.

 

[garczar]

Why do you think they stripped Jim Thorpe of his medals. Which was horse(&^* by the way!

That was a pretty shitty move. I live in Okla. and know people that were related to JT.

 

[jay helfert]

Let me preface my remarks by saying that I may not have all the facts, but I have enough of them to assess the current situation. Let me add that I know another thread on this subject exists already, but I feel I am taking analysis of the subject matter in a very different direction and that is why I have begun this thread.

It is a sad day for free enterprise in pro pool.

WPA has flexed its muscle and has basically said to the players “while you are doing business with our biggest competitor, you’ll be barred from doing business with us.” It is as if Pepsi said “You can’t buy Coca Cola and if you do, you can’t buy Pepsi any longer.” Most of us believe in free enterprise, but it seems pro pool has been forced by the WPA to go in a different direction.

Most us feel that there is room on pool’s landscape for both Matchroom and the WPA, but this turf war will have some consequences. Will there be a winner in this scuffle? It is tough to say.

I think it would be foolish to presume that Matchroom Pool has the entire financial weight of Matchroom Multi-sport behind it. Nor, for that matter, would it be wise to assume that the profits from long established brands like the World Cup of Pool, the World Pool Masters and the Mosconi Cup are available for reinvestment into major new tournament productions. It is entirely up to Matchroom.

Let history be our guide. I was among very few on this forum that understood that the IPT was not backed by all the assets of Kevin Trudeau and was not surprised in the least when the IPT business venture folded in its first year, collapsing under its own weight. Good business people know when to pull the plug on any business venture, large or small and, while many were repulsed by his character, Trudeau was a good businessman. The “too big to fail” concept does not apply to professional pool.

That is how business ventures work, and Matchroom's venture into major tournament pool is a venture begun in the fairly recent past. Like any other venture, it has its own set of financial books and records, and those records will, to a great extent, dictate its business strategies.

Matchroom Pool is growing our sport in ways we have not seen in decades, and most of the fans love their new events. Matchroom has delivered fields having a quality that is unsurpassed in the game’s history. They are offering the best professional pool product we have ever seen. They are globalizing our sport in ways not previously seen, creating pro tours in new corners of the world. We hope they are here to stay.

The real question of pertinence here is “will WPA’s actions impact Matchroom Pool’s ability to turn a profit going forward?” That is to be determined. Certainly, WPA is going to reduce Matchroom’s access to some of the world’s most elite players. How that translates to the bottom line is far from clear, and if Matchroom retains a sufficient nucleus of superstar players to keep their product elite, maybe the impact will be minimal.

The worst-case scenario, it would seem, is that reduced access to the most elite players will make it harder for Matchroom to make the best TV and sponsorship deals, which could possibly make their events less profitable, or even unprofitable. In that scenario, it is at least possible that Matchroom would exit the world of major tournament production and restrict its pool business to the World Pool Masters, the World Cup of Pool and the Mosconi. We would all like to think this unlikely because of Matchroom’s superb management team, but that would be to live in denial.

This is not a battle between good and evil, just a business turf war between competitors. Pool needs both WPA and Matchroom, and players need full access to all events.

For those of us who believe in free enterprise and that competition in the marketplace tends to result in a better product, however, it seems that WPA is playing what many of us call “dirty pool.”

The result might possibly be more money in pro pool. Maybe the long game is that the players make more money, but maybe WPA one day regains the monopoly it once enjoyed and returns to those times in which it had a lesser sense of urgency in growing the pro game. Time will tell.

Most of my sympathies lie with the players, who are, as a group, being abused here, but I feel sad for Matchroom, too, for they have invested heavily to bring the professional pool product to a level I haven’t seen in my 47 years as a pool fan and they must now overcome obstacles unnecessarily placed in their way.

Finally, I’d like to make a request of my AZB brethren. Let’s not ever view any players as defectors or traitors, for whatever choices they make, they remain victims denied a chance to maximize earnings in their chosen profession.

Stu, one point in reference to your post above. Matchroom began producing the World Pool Championships in the 1990's, as well as the Mosconi Cup, so they are not new to this sport by any means. True, their World Nine Ball Tour is a new enterprise that appears to be catching on and growing with more tournament promoters aligning with them over the WPA. I don't think they will be going away any time soon either. That has not been their history in any sport they have embraced. In fact I believe we will see them redouble their efforts to organize pro pool and make it more accessible to the viewing public. In the process they will build star players who can reap the benefits of their new found fame. All good imo.

As far as the WPA is concerned they are digging their own grave right now with some very poor decision making. They are in sore need of new leadership if they want to continue as a viable entity in this sport, or they will be left in the graveyard of failed sports governing bodies.

 

[BasementDweller]

I wouldn't be surprised if a couple big names (Filler, Ko Brothers) get secret deals with Matchroom to replace their federation money. They wouldn't have to pay everyone, just a few of their regular contenders. Make them sign NDA's and on with the show they go.

 

[dumisin]

Great thing about wpa watching this past weekend Qatar open was 1 ball on the spot and 5 ball orange

 

[FranCrimi]

Where's Matchroom's women's division? Anybody know? Are the women second class citizens to them?

 

[sjm]

Stu, one point in reference to your post above. Matchroom began producing the World Pool Championships in the 1990's, as well as the Mosconi Cup, so they are not new to this sport by any means.

That's my mistake, Jay. I clean forgot that the World 9-ball was in Cardiff for a few years. Thanks for the correction. What I should have said is that Matchroom's venture into having major giant-field tournaments outside of the UK is a new venture that began with their purchase of the US Open just over five years ago.

True, their World Nine Ball Tour is a new enterprise that appears to be catching on and growing with more tournament promoters aligning with them over the WPA. I don't think they will be going away any time soon either. That has not been their history in any sport they have embraced.

Agreed 100%.

In fact I believe we will see them redouble their efforts to organize pro pool and make it more accessible to the viewing public. In the process they will build star players who can reap the benefits of their new found fame. All good imo.

Yes, the vision expressed by Emily Frazer on "60 minutes" likely remains attainable, but WPA has placed an impediment in Matchroom's way and realization of that vision has just become a little tougher.

As far as the WPA is concerned they are digging their own grave right now with some very poor decision making. They are in sore need of new leadership if they want to continue as a viable entity in this sport, or they will be left in the graveyard of failed sports governing bodies.

Maybe so, but they've clearly got the support of many national federations and, of course, they are tightly allied with Predator, so their existence does not, in my eyes, seemed threatened anytime soon.

 

[sjm]

Pool politics! In such a fractioned industry, it's uncanny how something of this magnitude is happening. We railbirds can all have opinions, but it's the pool players on the international professional tournament trail who are the ones whose opinions matter most.

Most who have been reading my posts since 2003 are aware of my disdain for the BCA, the so-called "governing body of North American professional pool." Today it is an industry-member organization, though they are supposed to be governing professional pool.

For many years, I have also expressed how useless the WPA is, only to be told by a few that the WPA is needed for the Olympic Games, and we need them in professional pool.

Europe has good governing bodies called "federations" in professional pool. USA is nothing. For the European pros, this political quagmire of WPA v. Matchroom is major.

While the majority seem to think F the WPA and bend the knee to Matchroom, my thought is why isn't anybody hold the BCA's feet to the fire and step up to the plate and defend American professional pool? If their only interest is industry members' sales, then quit calling themselves the "Billiard Congress of America" and call themselves the "Billiard Industry Member Association of America," BIMAA fo short.

I thing BCA is partially responsible for the lack of professional-caliber players in USA today. If we had a federation like Europe supporting professional pool, things might be quite different here on American soil. I can count on one hand how many professional-caliber players live here today. It was quite different 30, 40 years ago. Is the BCA to blame? Well, in a way, yes.

So while everyone is debating how useless the WPA and/or how much it is needed, my American view is look to the BCA to stand up and do the right thing for American professional pool like their name implies.

Well said, JAM. By announcing that he will stick with Matchroom and skip WPA-sanctioned events, SVB has, for practical purposes, cut ties with the BCA completely. The impact this will have is not easily gauged, but surely Shane's an asset they'd have preferred to keep on board.

 

[CaptainBly]

I am still skeptical of Matchrooms success going forward. They have made some questionable decisions. Are they the savior? Maybe, honestly I'm not sure anyone can save the pro game. The pro game is just not enjoyable to the average person. Are there enough die hard pool fans to make an investor money? Look at the stream numbers, they are a joke. A kid playing a video game gets a thousand times the views.
In my opinion, the 2 biggest mistakes they refuse to address. The 4/5 ball and DAZN. You want to grow the game, the very few new viewers you get are not going to ever see that ball set in the wild. So they learn the game on line watching then go out and wonder why the balls are different. 2. DAZN, you just screwed the home and potentially your biggest market for the game. It's not the cost. even though it factors, it's that you put it on an obscure channel no pool player had ever heard of unless you were a fan of Euro sports or boxing. To me this is the biggest mistake they are making. You want to grow the game? The only way to grow it and make it profitable is to eyes on it. Only then will the sponsors follow. How is DAZN helping to achieve that?
I always say, that pool is a participation game not a spectator sport. And I love to watch pool.

 

[garczar]

That's my mistake, Jay. I clean forgot that the World 9-ball was in Cardiff for a few years. Thanks for the correction. What I should have said is that Matchroom's venture into having major giant-field tournaments outside of the UK is a new venture that began with their purchase of the US Open just over five years ago.

Agreed 100%.

Yes, the vision expressed by Emily Frazer on "60 minutes" likely remains attainable, but WPA has placed an impediment in Matchroom's way and realization of that vision has just become a little tougher.

Maybe so, but they've clearly got the support of many national federations and, of course, they are tightly allied with Predator, so their existence does not, in my eyes, seemed threatened anytime soon.

IIRC MR and the WPA sorta co-produced the event for yrs. Right/wrong? Qatar was a complete debacle and almost killed the event. MR took over and started calling it the 'World Pool Championship'. I totally respect your knowledge/insight but i just don't think the WPA is much more than a speedbump for MR to deal with.

 

[BasementDweller]

I am still skeptical of Matchrooms success going forward. They have made some questionable decisions. Are they the savior? Maybe, honestly I'm not sure anyone can save the pro game. The pro game is just not enjoyable to the average person. Are there enough die hard pool fans to make an investor money? Look at the stream numbers, they are a joke. A kid playing a video game gets a thousand times the views.
In my opinion, the 2 biggest mistakes they refuse to address. The 4/5 ball and DAZN. You want to grow the game, the very few new viewers you get are not going to ever see that ball set in the wild. So they learn the game on line watching then go out and wonder why the balls are different. 2. DAZN, you just screwed the home and potentially your biggest market for the game. It's not the cost. even though it factors, it's that you put it on an obscure channel no pool player had ever heard of unless you were a fan of Euro sports or boxing. To me this is the biggest mistake they are making. You want to grow the game? The only way to grow it and make it profitable is to eyes on it. Only then will the sponsors follow. How is DAZN helping to achieve that?
I always say, that pool is a participation game not a spectator sport. And I love to watch pool.

Your view is too U.S. focused. Pool may potentially be the most global of all the cue sports and Matchroom clearly understands this. The U.S. spectator is a total afterthought. Maybe they build the game up globally and then circle-back to the U.S. audience. I definitely think there's at least an audience here for the Mosconi Cup, as that's exciting viewing.

 

[VVP]

I have been trying to avoid social media because it has been taking up too much of my time, but I would like to offer an opinion here, which might have errors, so I apologize in advance and welcome any corrections.

As I see it, and as SJM correctly pointed out, this is a turf war and the players will be the losers. To be frank, I see the WPA as an incompetent organization as it stands right now. However, there needs to be an oversight organization that seeks to keep pool at a professional level as opposed to a water-downed entertainment sport as profit-oriented Matchroom Pool might make it without any oversight.

Matchroom trying to brand 9 ball as the best billiard sport is an insult to me as a pool player. How many other Professional sports allow for slops (not lucky rolls) to count to the extent it does in pool? I unquestionably prefer to watch 10 ball. Picking Earl last year for the Masconi Cup as opposed to many other in-form players that spent thousands of dollars trying to make the team is an insult to the sport and to those players all in the attempt to up the “entertainment” value of the Masconi Cup. Anyone trying to sell the MC as a real pool competition between Europe and USA must be out of their mind. If it’s acknowledged that it is entertainment like wrestling then I can buy that so there will be no need to keep count on how many times Europe thrashed the USA LOL.

That said, Matchroom has done wonders for the pool industry. Their TV and YouTube production qualities are unsurpassed. I absolutely like their “Table 2” with the fixed view and ball rack (helps to easier identify the next ball up), which allows me to try to predict next shots by being able to see the table all the time. It’s a great training tool for amateur pool players, in my opinion. Matchroom has also improved the quality of 9 ball by introducing its break box (which makes the table more unpredictable after the break) and tightening the pockets. As JJ mentioned the casual viewer gets the impression that the game is too easy if there is consistently multiple-pack runs.

From what I have gathered lately, I believe the current issue is more about Matchroom vs the local/country federations rather than specifically Matchroom vs the WPA. The WPA speaks for the federations and the latest ban threat was approved by the federations. I believe people, mostly “free enterprise” Americans (LOL) need to step back and try to understand the importance of federations. WPA President –Ishaun Singh did an excellent job explaining the role of federations on the “Pool Player Podcast.” Unlike in America, federations play a very important role in developing pool players in many countries. I believe Germany, Poland, Taiwan, Vietnam and possibly many more countries that I don’t know about have strong federations. Therefore, it is unfair for Matchroom to profit off the work of federations without no compensation to them. There can be much more to this issue that we don’t know about as casual observers.

I support WPA banning players that play in a Matchroom or non-sanctioned events that clash with major WPA events that were already on the calendar. I cannot see the WPA banning players for playing in non-sanctioned events that DOES NOT clash with major WPA events. If that happens, I’ll change my opinion about the WPA ban threat.

 

[sjm]

Where's Matchroom's women's division? Anybody know? Are the women second class citizens to them?

Point well taken, Fran, and thanks as always for enlightening us.

You are right to say Matchroom is not a factor in women's pool, as they don't produce women's events. I don't think they look down on women pros, but their business model is based on men's professional pool and its growth. Viewing their business approach as even slightly chauvinistic is, in my opinion, off base.

I think that for women, the choice of WPA vs Matchroom is no choice at all. The major women's events are all WPA-sanctioned and Predator, which is tightly allied with WPA, has spearheaded recent growth in the women's pro game.

Like you, I think we need WPA, although in a more modern, robust form. Still, you've raised an important point for those who question whether we need WPA. Women's pro pool needs WPA in a big way!

 

[JusticeNJ]

However, there needs to be an oversight organization that seeks to keep pool at a professional level as opposed to a water-downed entertainment sport as profit-oriented Matchroom Pool might make it without any oversight.

I can understand this point and agree with it in principle, but WPA apparently has no other way to enforce their authority over the management/oversight of the game except to use player eligibility to participate in events and receive other benefits as leverage.

How WPA put's teeth in its bite is entirely their problem to solve, and using the players as leverage is probably the worst thing possible they could have gone with IMO. It does very little to stem Matchroom's market and screws over the players while actually weakening WPA's standing. Few people see this as a legitimate, serious decision made in furtherance of the integrity of pool, and more of a desperate grab that screws over the players and overall bad for the game.

It's just a bad decision and I hope it results in a sea change and turnover at WPA. The better course, to me, would have been to simply accept the WNT rankings or cut some other deal with MR. Instead, we get this result which is totally unsustainable in the long run, and I have some doubts that anyone at WPA expects this to result in a long term state of affairs with WPA players and "the rest."