Skip & Jan's Billiards is getting all the 9ft's rebuilt.

[berniep]

Just so people know for sure that Skip & Jan's is going to fix up ALL the tables in the house, these are some pictures of the second table being finished up. So, now there's TWO Simonis Tour Blue tables in da house...and still more to come:grin:

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Glen,

I believe you mentioned that all the (6) Diamond tables will be done first at a rate of 1 every 1-2 weeks.

What is the chance of Zach reworking one of the Gold Crowns next? This would allow several current Phoenix area residential gold crown table owners, especially.....me:grin:, to get a much awaited taste of the new rails.

Let's face it......DCC is getting closer by the day and it's not to often I have a chance to get "one up" on those banking monsters:wink:
Thanks.

Bernie Pettipiece.

 

[stuckart]

lets be real honest. I know one pool hall owner in Az who got all new diamonds and thought that was the answer. and in six months he was out of business...........

That's not really what happened. The owner was too focused on Poker to put too much, besides tons of money, into the pool business. Without having any liquor/beer it didn't make much sense to keep it when Stingers was pushing to buy the place so he sold it to Stingers and opened his poker room next door (which has now closed).

The clientele that was of the Old Stingers has changed tremendously when they upgraded to a 7,000 sq ft place. If they could boot the Scare-e-oke on certain nights it would be a great pool room.

But as to what others have said, I hope Skip & Jans gets their money out of it. For some reason or another the Phoenix Pool Scene is very political and players tend to stick to their home room most of the time. And if it's not politic's it's all the haters that would rather spread rumors and bash other pool rooms then to help all the rooms grow.

Too bad Skip & Jan's is super far from my house, or I'd make it my home room.

 

[BRKNRUN]

I agree. Most league and recreational players don't want to play on tables that tough. Very clean looking work, however. :thumbup:

Roger

Hey Roger.....based on the two balls in the picture that pocket opening is 4 1/2" wide...same as the pockets at my house and IMO is what the standard for all tables should be...no bigger no smaller.

You may be suprised to find that they don't play as tough as they appear......becuase the pocket angles are cut correct and are not "double" shimmed.

Granted I am not a recreational player, but I really don't think a recreational player would even notice the difference.....The better players WILL notice the difference and the end result is a win/win.... the best of both worlds...IMO

 

[Cuebuddy]

Hey Roger.....based on the two balls in the picture that pocket opening is 4 1/2" wide...same as the pockets at my house and IMO is what the standard for all tables should be...no bigger no smaller.

You may be suprised to find that they don't play as tough as they appear......becuase the pocket angles are cut correct and are not "double" shimmed.

Granted I am not a recreational player, but I really don't think a recreational player would even notice the difference.....The better players WILL notice the difference and the end result is a win/win.... the best of both worlds...IMO

Well said I have the same 4.5" on mine and you get use to it quickly. I would think learning the speed of that Simonis in the dry AZ climate will be harder to deal with. Thanks Glen for keeping us updated.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

But as to what others have said, I hope Skip & Jans gets their money out of it. For some reason or another the Phoenix Pool Scene is very political and players tend to stick to their home room most of the time. And if it's not politic's it's all the haters that would rather spread rumors and bash other pool rooms then to help all the rooms grow.

Think one of the problems I have whitened so many times in Phoenix is there is a mentality of some owners who have NARROW VISION.

They do not see the benefits of working with other owners to try and work in a single direction, verse conquer, & destroy the other owner.

This was one of the reason the Northern Lounge went under, IMHO.

 

[justadub]

Hey Roger.....based on the two balls in the picture that pocket opening is 4 1/2" wide...same as the pockets at my house and IMO is what the standard for all tables should be...no bigger no smaller.

You may be suprised to find that they don't play as tough as they appear......becuase the pocket angles are cut correct and are not "double" shimmed.

Granted I am not a recreational player, but I really don't think a recreational player would even notice the difference.....The better players WILL notice the difference and the end result is a win/win.... the best of both worlds...IMO

I'm pretty much a novice, having just learned the game a little over a year ago. The club I belong to has pockets that are almost as tight as those, and we like them just fine. (Of course our tables aren't nearly as nice as those in the pics!) We're all what you would call recreational players, and many of us play league as well.

Of course, the folks from the other rooms don't like playing on our tables as much during league play.... :grin:

 

[realkingcobra]

I'm pretty much a novice, having just learned the game a little over a year ago. The club I belong to has pockets that are almost as tight as those, and we like them just fine. (Of course our tables aren't nearly as nice as those in the pics!) We're all what you would call recreational players, and many of us play league as well.

Of course, the folks from the other rooms don't like playing on our tables as much during league play.... :grin:

I've never met a casual player yet that complained about the pockets being to tight at 4 1/2", but I've seen them disappear from a pool room that someone made them 4". And with 4 1/2" ProCut pockets, the only real complaints I've ever heard....came from someone that could stoke the ball...missed the shot...then complained...that SHOULD have gone in!!! like they were entitled to making that shot or something...I just look at it as they're just use to playing with that "Stoke" on 5" corner pockets....thinking they're good...until they get to a table with "ProCut" pockets...then reality sets in....they're not as good as they thought they were....and THAT right there is the difference between a "banger" and a "player"....the "banger" is just out having fun with their friends playing pool...while the "Player" thinks their game is so good...they should be rewarded for being "close" to making the ball...because after all...it wasn't their fault they missed....the table has tight-ass pockets afterall...right?

Glen...being a "pool player"...I've heard it all...just not from a "banger"

 

[stuckart]

Think one of the problems I have whitened so many times in Phoenix is there is a mentality of some owners who have NARROW VISION.

They do not see the benefits of working with other owners to try and work in a single direction, verse conquer, & destroy the other owner.

This was one of the reason the Northern Lounge went under, IMHO.

I agree, Metro and Northern hurt each other with their feud. Stingers, Metro and Bullshooters always worked really well together, but now that Larry jumped over to Bullshooters he has already started a feud between rooms. The fun fun part of living in Phoenix and all the stupid politics.

When I run big tournaments I checked with Metro, Northern, The AWBT and the DCT before even advertising it. Personally contacting each of the persons in charge.

 

[Cuebuddy]

I've never met a casual player yet that complained about the pockets being to tight at 4 1/2", but I've seen them disappear from a pool room that someone made them 4". And with 4 1/2" ProCut pockets, the only real complaints I've ever heard....came from someone that could stoke the ball...missed the shot...then complained...that SHOULD have gone in!!! like they were entitled to making that shot or something...I just look at it as they're just use to playing with that "Stoke" on 5" corner pockets....thinking they're good...until they get to a table with "ProCut" pockets...then reality sets in....they're not as good as they thought they were....and THAT right there is the difference between a "banger" and a "player"....the "banger" is just out having fun with their friends playing pool...while the "Player" thinks their game is so good...they should be rewarded for being "close" to making the ball...because after all...it wasn't their fault they missed....the table has tight-ass pockets afterall...right?

Glen...being a "pool player"...I've heard it all...just not from a "banger"

Well said Glen. Remember when you are done being a player I would be honored to give your shooting cue a spot to hang on my wall.

 

[grindz]

Hey Roger.....based on the two balls in the picture that pocket opening is 4 1/2" wide...same as the pockets at my house and IMO is what the standard for all tables should be...no bigger no smaller.

You may be suprised to find that they don't play as tough as they appear......becuase the pocket angles are cut correct and are not "double" shimmed.

Granted I am not a recreational player, but I really don't think a recreational player would even notice the difference.....The better players WILL notice the difference and the end result is a win/win.... the best of both worlds...IMO

From an old, blind and shakey guy.... I've got to agree... it's just the right size if not possibly just a little too big for some games.

td

 

[JZMechanix]

The way I see it, it's whatever you get used to.

I have a Diamond Pro with 4 1/2" pockets and I think it plays just right. Another friend of mine has a Diamond pro with 5" pockets and to me they are waaaaaay too big. There are some shots that I can't believe go in on the 5" pockets that wouldn't have a prayer on the 4 1/2"

Another friend has 4 1/4" pockets on a Diamond Pro. Now, those pockets play pretty tough! I'm usually cussing the first few games but after you get used to them they aren't that bad. You just can't fire balls into the hole unless you hit center cut.

So after playing on the 4 1/4" pockets for a few hours, and then going straight home and hitting balls again on my table, then the 4 1/2" pockets seem like buckets. I think we just become trained to get used to the pocket size that we play on the most.

Bottom line is, don't be afraid to play on 4 1/2" pockets. You'll get used to them and then if you go back to the 5" you'll have an even easier time pocketing balls.

 

[Roger Long]

Hey Roger.....based on the two balls in the picture that pocket opening is 4 1/2" wide...same as the pockets at my house and IMO is what the standard for all tables should be...no bigger no smaller.

You may be suprised to find that they don't play as tough as they appear......becuase the pocket angles are cut correct and are not "double" shimmed.

Granted I am not a recreational player, but I really don't think a recreational player would even notice the difference.....The better players WILL notice the difference and the end result is a win/win.... the best of both worlds...IMO

Remember, I said "most" of the league and recreational players don't want to play on tables that tough. You're not on that category, Ken. You're much too good for that.

Roger

 

[realkingcobra]

Remember, I said "most" of the league and recreational players don't want to play on tables that tough. You're not on that category, Ken. You're much too good for that.

Roger

I called you and left a message, call me when you get the chance...
702-927-5689

Glen

 

[Roger Long]

I called you and left a message, call me when you get the chance...
702-927-5689

Glen

Sorry about that, Glen. I've been very busy in making preparations for the SW Amateur Championships and Nick Varner events going on at Bull Shooters. I'll give you a call as soon as my phone finishes recharging here.

Roger

 

[JoeyInCali]

I've never met a casual player yet that complained about the pockets being to tight at 4 1/2", but I've seen them disappear from a pool room that someone made them 4". And with 4 1/2" ProCut pockets, the only real complaints I've ever heard....came from someone that could stoke the ball...missed the shot...then complained...that SHOULD have gone in!!! like they were entitled to making that shot or something...I just look at it as they're just use to playing with that "Stoke" on 5" corner pockets....thinking they're good...until they get to a table with "ProCut" pockets...then reality sets in....they're not as good as they thought they were....and THAT right there is the difference between a "banger" and a "player"....the "banger" is just out having fun with their friends playing pool...while the "Player" thinks their game is so good...they should be rewarded for being "close" to making the ball...because after all...it wasn't their fault they missed....the table has tight-ass pockets afterall...right?

Glen...being a "pool player"...I've heard it all...just not from a "banger"

You'd be surprised but when Hard Times , Bellflower had one Diamond in the corner, people did not want to gamble on that table. They thought it was too tough.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

I've never met a casual player yet that complained about the pockets being to tight at 4 1/2", but I've seen them disappear from a pool room that someone made them 4". And with 4 1/2" ProCut pockets, the only real complaints I've ever heard....came from someone that could stoke the ball...missed the shot...then complained...that SHOULD have gone in!!! like they were entitled to making that shot or something...I just look at it as they're just use to playing with that "Stoke" on 5" corner pockets....thinking they're good...until they get to a table with "ProCut" pockets...then reality sets in....they're not as good as they thought they were....and THAT right there is the difference between a "banger" and a "player"....the "banger" is just out having fun with their friends playing pool...while the "Player" thinks their game is so good...they should be rewarded for being "close" to making the ball...because after all...it wasn't their fault they missed....the table has tight-ass pockets afterall...right?

Glen...being a "pool player"...I've heard it all...just not from a "banger"

SADLY many trash the "Banger & Recreational Players", but IMHO if these people stopped playing Pool, about 90% of the POOL ROOMS, and BARS with POOL TABLES would see a drastic impact on their monthly PROFITS!

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

but now that Larry jumped over to Bullshooters he has already started a feud between rooms. The fun fun part of living in Phoenix and all the stupid politics.

If that is true, than that is sad.

 

[realkingcobra]

You'd be surprised but when Hard Times , Bellflower had one Diamond in the corner, people did not want to gamble on that table. They thought it was too tough.

When someone cuts down a pocket to 4"...and makes the pocket facings parallel to each other...all that happens is that the target gets smaller...but the pocket gets easier over all. As a pocket decreases in size...so does the slate shelf that the ball can sit on, and when the angles of the pockets face each other...when a ball hits the inside edge of the pocket facings...it's deflected much deeper into the throat of the pocket...which is why the balls don't rattle in the jaws of the pocket....creating the "either it's in...or it's out" syndrome. The draw back to the 4" pockets...is that you have to shoot the object ball through smaller field goals so to speak, whereas with a Diamond with 4 1/2" pockets and 141 degree miters...there's more slate shelf for the ball to sit on, and when coming into contact with the facing....it's not going to deflect the object ball straight back into the throat of the pocket...so major differences.....4" either in or out.....4 1/2" correctly done...it may be in...but not all the way if not hit correctly...or it's out:grin:

Glen

 

[PUTT4DACA$$H]

Thank You REALKINGCOBRA

I just wanted to let Glen know how much I apprecciated him teaching me the ins and outs of table calibration. He really opened my eyes to many small things that are often overlooked or even unknown to most when overhauling a table and getting it to play its best. I can't believe how good the tables play at Skip & Jans, from old junk to better than new!!!My only problem know is wanting to play only on tables that have been calibrated!!! Here in Vegas, I guess its either my house or FATBOY's !!!! Thanks for the training Glen. Good luck with your dvd production.

Gordon Graham
Las Vegas
425-275-8255

PS. I think I left my leveling cards in your truck!!!

 

[realkingcobra]

I just wanted to let Glen know how much I apprecciated him teaching me the ins and outs of table calibration. He really opened my eyes to many small things that are often overlooked or even unknown to most when overhauling a table and getting it to play its best. I can't believe how good the tables play at Skip & Jans, from old junk to better than new!!!My only problem know is wanting to play only on tables that have been calibrated!!! Here in Vegas, I guess its either my house or FATBOY's !!!! Thanks for the training Glen. Good luck with your dvd production.

Gordon Graham
Las Vegas
425-275-8255

PS. I think I left my leveling cards in your truck!!!

YOUR leveling cards??? I counted them all...and think I have one missing buddy....have you SEEN it lately?:grin: Gordon, it was a pleasure working with you as you've for sure got what it takes to be a very good table mechanic...just like Zach does. It's always much easier to teach someone that already has a good understanding of how to work on pool tables...to bring them up to a level of mechanics that they never knew existed...so I had a great time working with you both....but it's still hard to stand by and watch you guys turn out the kind of work that only I could do in the past but I feel good about both of you guys now being able to work on customers tables that otherwise would be waiting on me to show up...and know that they'll get the same kind of work done:grin: I'll see you again in January buddy...and give fatboy a call about moving that GC5 out of the main house to put the Diamond ProAm in it's place when you get the chance. I think he wants to sell off the GC5 for about $3,500 or so, ask him about that too:grin:

Glen