Super-glue Finishes
- Thread starter Brickman
- Start date
Proper Finish
I've doen super glue once. Came out perfect. I used a sponge and low RPM. Most people will have the problems you had do to the cue having not been preped properly. If you so much as touch that cue before you finish it you will get problems. Your hands carrie natural oils in them that will screw up and fish eye the finish. You should take a clean damp cloth before you put any finish on the cue and a dry one right behind it and clean the cue first. A little dawn dish soap will be fine with the damp cloth. Make sure you do not let it air dry as all you will do is leave the resido there. However, if you really want a real finish you should buy a 100.00 bumper mini HVLP gun. Go buy UV clear and hardner, prep the cue the same and learn to do a UV finish. I have been finishing cues for years and this is the right way. PM me if you would like me to teach you how. When it comes to finish I am a Encyclopedia of information. I used to paint cars and have been through schooling on all spray products. I have refinished probably 500 cues or more. Super Glue is ok but will not give you the real depth and clearity UV clear will. Tends to chip over time as it becomes brittle and will not last near as long as a UV clear. If you need proof of this statement. Go take a 10 year old car that has been through of course all lifes elements, compound it, buff it , wax it and it will be clear and nice again. If you choose to continue the super glue finish which is not all bad for a more prestine finish you will wet sand it every 2 coats with 600 grit to 1000 grit depending on how rough it is. You can go with 320 or 400 if its real pitty and rough. If you use a sponge it should lay real flat for you. Remember, preping is everything to a quality finish. When you think its' ready for finish do it again!! This keeps it flat through out the coats ensuring a deeper true finish. Hope this helps!!
I've doen super glue once. Came out perfect. I used a sponge and low RPM. Most people will have the problems you had do to the cue having not been preped properly. If you so much as touch that cue before you finish it you will get problems. Your hands carrie natural oils in them that will screw up and fish eye the finish. You should take a clean damp cloth before you put any finish on the cue and a dry one right behind it and clean the cue first. A little dawn dish soap will be fine with the damp cloth. Make sure you do not let it air dry as all you will do is leave the resido there. However, if you really want a real finish you should buy a 100.00 bumper mini HVLP gun. Go buy UV clear and hardner, prep the cue the same and learn to do a UV finish. I have been finishing cues for years and this is the right way. PM me if you would like me to teach you how. When it comes to finish I am a Encyclopedia of information. I used to paint cars and have been through schooling on all spray products. I have refinished probably 500 cues or more. Super Glue is ok but will not give you the real depth and clearity UV clear will. Tends to chip over time as it becomes brittle and will not last near as long as a UV clear. If you need proof of this statement. Go take a 10 year old car that has been through of course all lifes elements, compound it, buff it , wax it and it will be clear and nice again. If you choose to continue the super glue finish which is not all bad for a more prestine finish you will wet sand it every 2 coats with 600 grit to 1000 grit depending on how rough it is. You can go with 320 or 400 if its real pitty and rough. If you use a sponge it should lay real flat for you. Remember, preping is everything to a quality finish. When you think its' ready for finish do it again!! This keeps it flat through out the coats ensuring a deeper true finish. Hope this helps!!
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Ca finishes
How long does it take CA to cure, not hardened but cure? It seems that after I started letting it sit overnight before sanding and adding more coats most of the problems disappear. I'm using thin CA, 600 speed, tight knit paper towel, West system base coat.
I don't think you can expect thin Ca to fill big cavities and sand right of way... some of the white spot problems come from that or atleast that's been my experience so far.. I welcome all input.
I probably spend too much time in preparation (if that's possible), and lots of thin coats.
Mario
How long does it take CA to cure, not hardened but cure? It seems that after I started letting it sit overnight before sanding and adding more coats most of the problems disappear. I'm using thin CA, 600 speed, tight knit paper towel, West system base coat.
I don't think you can expect thin Ca to fill big cavities and sand right of way... some of the white spot problems come from that or atleast that's been my experience so far.. I welcome all input.
I probably spend too much time in preparation (if that's possible), and lots of thin coats.
Mario
bish4201 said:I've doen super glue once. Came out perfect. I used a sponge and low RPM. Most people will have the problems you had do to the cue having not been preped properly. If you so much as touch that cue before you finish it you will get problems. Your hands carrie natural oils in them that will screw up and fish eye the finish. You should take a clean damp cloth before you put any finish on the cue and a dry one right behind it and clean the cue first. A little dawn dish soap will be fine with the damp cloth. Make sure you do not let it air dry as all you will do is leave the resido there. However, if you really want a real finish you should buy a 100.00 bumper mini HVLP gun. Go buy UV clear and hardner, prep the cue the same and learn to do a UV finish. I have been finishing cues for years and this is the right way. PM me if you would like me to teach you how. When it comes to finish I am a Encyclopedia of information. I used to paint cars and have been through schooling on all spray products. I have refinished probably 500 cues or more. Super Glue is ok but will not give you the real depth and clearity UV clear will. Tends to chip over time as it becomes brittle and will not last near as long as a UV clear. If you need proof of this statement. Go take a 10 year old car that has been through of course all lifes elements, compound it, buff it , wax it and it will be clear and nice again. If you choose to continue the super glue finish which is not all bad for a more prestine finish you will wet sand it every 2 coats with 600 grit to 1000 grit depending on how rough it is. You can go with 320 or 400 if its real pitty and rough. If you use a sponge it should lay real flat for you. Remember, preping is everything to a quality finish. When you think its' ready for finish do it again!! This keeps it flat through out the coats ensuring a deeper true finish. Hope this helps!!
Are you saying that you would wipe down a car & then spray a clearcoat over that wet SOAP????? If I am right, Brickman is trying to use the super glue finish, because he lacks the money, experience & SAFE place to spray a finish...JER
dave sutton
Banned
Mcues said:
i do the enitre cue in an hour or so. i let it sit like 2 min between sanding after spray. comes out perfect
the biggest prob i had was speed. i was too fast and finish was getting too hott and bubling off
perfect now
when u guys talk about using a sponge is that wet or damp or completely dry?
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I have a big chunk of creamy colored poly foam I bought at a local hardware store. I cut it with sharp scissors into strips about 1/2" X 3/8" X 2", it doesn't react with the CA and give off those harsh nasty fumes that make your eyes water so badly like paper towels or napkins do. The foam flows on evenly spinning in a CueSmith lathe about 200-250 rpm's, and I cut off the foam area wet with CA with scissors and drop it into a coffee can so I don't have to touch it after each pass up and down to smooth out the finish. I have found this to work the best for me.
I also use hot or thin the first 5-6 coats then I do 2-3 coats of a mix of 1/2 part thin and 1/2 part medium in a 2 oz container. I wait 5-10 minutes between coats and look to see if the finish has a dull flat look to it before doing the next coat. Every time I try and rush it I end up with big valleys and high spots that take too much time to sand out and remove.
I was getting the same white spots you are getting when I used the spray Flash kicker, so I quit using it and haven't had a problem since. I also was dry sanding with 320 at this point, so that could be the culprit also!
John
I also use hot or thin the first 5-6 coats then I do 2-3 coats of a mix of 1/2 part thin and 1/2 part medium in a 2 oz container. I wait 5-10 minutes between coats and look to see if the finish has a dull flat look to it before doing the next coat. Every time I try and rush it I end up with big valleys and high spots that take too much time to sand out and remove.
I was getting the same white spots you are getting when I used the spray Flash kicker, so I quit using it and haven't had a problem since. I also was dry sanding with 320 at this point, so that could be the culprit also!
John
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Brickman said:HEY GUYS....I am having a problem with a superglue finish that I have been trying. I was wondering if maybe some of you with more exp. could help out?
1. When I put it on it isnt very smooth at all, and has ridges like mini little mountain ranges in it....how do I fix this.....I know sanding.....so how to put on to prevent this is more like what I want to know?
2. After I put it on and start to sand , or into sanding, it gets huge white splotches in it, and will not buff out......almost like white dust or plastic dust caught in it.....even though I know it doesnt have the dust in it, I still cant get it right. I can get maybe 80-90% of the cue to shine very good and then there are the white splothces.....please help me before I beat my brains out with a hammer.
ANY OTHER ADVICE ON SUPERGLUE/ EPOXY RUB ON FINISHES WOULD BE GREAT, AND i WOULD BE VERY VERY GRATEFULL FOR THE HELP.......I know many of you do these and other types of finishes in your sleep so to speak so your exp , would be very much appreciated as I am really being held up by this, and I have a couple of cues that need more than an rubbed finsh to get done.......please help me........any advice is appreciated.
The trick to ca finnishing is lathe speed and sanding pressure. If you master these two ingreadance will will be king of ca finnishing. Follow the instructions below and you will become king.
Using CA Glue to Finish pool cues, or what ever.
Step 1: Turn pool blanks to finished size and sand to a 400 grit finish.
Step 2: Wipe all sanding dust from the blanks with a soft, lint free cloth.
Step 3: Slow the lathe to about 400 rpm and apply a cost of thin ca glue with a paper towel to pool cue and apply a small amount of accelerator to dry the ca glue.
Step 4: Using a fresh area of the paper towel, apply a second coat of the thin ca glue and accelerator as before.
Step 5: Turn off the lathe. Apply a few drops of medium ca glue to a fresh area of the paper towel and apply a lot of medium ca glue to the cue blank. This should be enough to cause it to run down the sides of the blanks. Spread the ca glue while turning the lathe by hand. Stand to one side so the glue isn't thrown in your face; turn the lathe on and quickly spread the ca glue on the blanks and apply accelerator. Allow 1 or 2 minutes for this coat to dry before proceeding.
(ALTERNATIVE) Apply the medium ca glue with the paper towel while the lathe is turning and without applying directly to the cue blanks. Apply at least 3 coats when using this alternative method. This will result in a less than thick finish but will be easier to sand out with the Micro-Mesh. On harder woods the difference will not be noticeable.
Step 6: Repeat the above steps twice thus building a significant layer of "plastic" on the cue .. You will have applied a total of 5 coats at this point.
Step 7: Sand the coated finish with 400 grit paper until any and all imperfections are gone. Look for raised stripes due the build up of ca glue. This must all be removed or they will show up in the finished cue. Turn the lathe off, inspect and sand with the grain of the wood and wipe with the clean cloth to remove sanding dust.
Step 8: Apply 2 more coats of thin ca glue as was done in steps 3 and 4. You have now applied a total of 7 coats of ca glue.
Step 9 (Final Step): Sand with Micro-Mesh abrasive paper going through all grits. Do not apply heavy pressure; it will only ruin the Micro-Mesh. Begin with 1,500 grit and finish with 12,000 grit. The finish should last a very long time if applied correctly. If, after final sanding with the 12,000 grit you find imperfections you can re-sand with the 1,500 grit to remove them. Re-apply the thin ca glue and work through all of the Micro-Mesh again.
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bubsbug said:
What do you do about getting the joint area covered with CA without building up a LIP at the edge?...JER
I wet sand the stainless steel at the same time as I sand the CA on the cue turning between 1800-2000 RPM's on an old Atlas 12" X 40" lathe. Starting with 1/4 sheets of 320, then 400, 500, 600, 800, 1000, 1500, 2000, finally 2500. I use automotive rubbing compound starting with a 1500 glaze followed by a finish hand glaze that I turn over to my Grizzly 220 volt 1725 rpm floor mount buffer. It shines like brand new and is seemless when you use a sanding arbor chucked up in your lathe. You can't feel the seam between the stainless steel and the cue forearm.
Here's a cue I finished tonight that has the stainless steel collar using CA.
John
Here's a cue I finished tonight that has the stainless steel collar using CA.
John
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dave sutton
Banned
BLACKHEARTCUES said:
i just slightly undercut at the delrin and ss joint/ perfect everytime
bubsbug said:
Hey Buggy, if 800 rpm is slowing down, how fast do you normally spin your cues? You are correct in that finding the correct speed will help. At 800 rpm for anybody else may be too fast. If the glue doesn't come flying off, the reason buggy steps back, it most likely will leave large ridges on the cue. I believe centrifical forse may cause this. This would translate into alot of sanding. Of course this is all just my opinion.
Hey Jer, if buggy doesn't give you the answer you are looking for, could you please share? I know you have alot of experience and know the answer.
Jimbo.
John, @ questions,jkmarshall_cues said:
1)is this the type of foam that would be used to stuff a pillow, or couch seat?
2) With CA, is it ok to finish over the normal phenolic & plastic collars and butts?
Thanks for all the great info on this, I really appreciate it.
Dave
I've been using super glue finish for about 5 months now and have now use both super glue and an old wood finish to finish off.
The best advice that I've got from other cuemakers other than keeping air flowing is using the foam, the foam piece that I've used are made specifically for cleaning table tennis racket. I've never tried applying the superglue at slow speed...on my deluxe I think I'm using the second highest speed which would be at least over 1000 RPM.
So far, I never had the glue spin off on me, only initially when I was using folded paper towel. The foam somehow help with applying the glue on the cue. I don't use much...just a few drop everytime until the glue cover all the surface of the forearm and butt. I let the cue dry for about 5 minutes before appling another coat and in total applies about 5 coats before I start wet sanding at 400, 600. After wet sanding, I'm letting it sit for another 5-10 minutes before putting on the final coat and wet sanding with 600, 1200, 2000. Once everything is clean and dry, I start adding the old wood finish to the cue. The finish is acceptable but not the greatest and I'm still learning. One day when I have the time, maybe I will try the brushing on Dupont clear finish...Joe C seem to have really good success with applying the dupont finish by hand and then wet sanding.
Here's a pic of one of my cue with the super glue finish and wood finish added on top of it.
This cue came out really nice and still is perfectly straight (my first) on the lathe and table.
Regards,
Duc.
The best advice that I've got from other cuemakers other than keeping air flowing is using the foam, the foam piece that I've used are made specifically for cleaning table tennis racket. I've never tried applying the superglue at slow speed...on my deluxe I think I'm using the second highest speed which would be at least over 1000 RPM.
So far, I never had the glue spin off on me, only initially when I was using folded paper towel. The foam somehow help with applying the glue on the cue. I don't use much...just a few drop everytime until the glue cover all the surface of the forearm and butt. I let the cue dry for about 5 minutes before appling another coat and in total applies about 5 coats before I start wet sanding at 400, 600. After wet sanding, I'm letting it sit for another 5-10 minutes before putting on the final coat and wet sanding with 600, 1200, 2000. Once everything is clean and dry, I start adding the old wood finish to the cue. The finish is acceptable but not the greatest and I'm still learning. One day when I have the time, maybe I will try the brushing on Dupont clear finish...Joe C seem to have really good success with applying the dupont finish by hand and then wet sanding.
Here's a pic of one of my cue with the super glue finish and wood finish added on top of it.
This cue came out really nice and still is perfectly straight (my first) on the lathe and table.
Regards,
Duc.
Mc2 said:
Sorry, typ'o, I put the glue on at 400 rpm,s then give a light sand at 400 rpm, then crank up to 1550 rpms and continue using 400 grit, basically only letting the weight of the paper itself apply pressure. Remember here, too little of pressure is better than too much pressure. If I still have swirl marks (usuallu dont 80/20?) then I refill with thin ca glue ant repeat. then micro-mesch up to 12,000 grit. On pens I do slow down to 800rpms though.
Blackheart : I rap the corner (Joint edge) with ca glue and then immediatly wipe off and more kinda blend it in. Easer to do than talk about. Sometimes I come back and undercutt. but if Im carfull and pay close attention I usually dont have any problems.
Personally I dont like the ca glue finnish. I only use it for the last 4-5 inches on a shaft. I havn't made any butts yet but well on my way. I currently dont know how to finnish any other way but I have made well over 1000 pens using the ca glue method. Does anyone have any other suggestions for finnishing. Also very soon I will be aquiring information on finnishing booth. Many suggestions will be greatly appreciated