SVB and Dennis score.

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
no chance of a filler match after this i guess

There are horses for courses and so it goes in pool. Shane in top form playing 9-Ball (or Ten Ball) would still be a good match for Filler. I'm not sure anyone is a favorite over Shane if his break is working. Let him string a couple of sixes on you and see how that affects your stroke. :rolleyes:
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
There are horses for courses and so it goes in pool. Shane in top form playing 9-Ball (or Ten Ball) would still be a good match for Filler. I'm not sure anyone is a favorite over Shane if his break is working. Let him string a couple of sixes on you and see how that affects your stroke. :rolleyes:

Nobody questions that Shane CAN beat the top two guys, Filler and Chang. As you note, when he plays in his very top form, he can beat them, but his average game won't be good enough to beat either.

By the way, it was Shane who disappeared when Filler opened with a five pack in their 2020 Derby City 9-ball match in a late round. At that level, you get plenty of chair time. Shane is not the only one that can humble an opponent.

I think the danger for Filler would be overconfidence, as he's had it so easy against Shane in both the Mosconi and the Derby City Classic of late.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
It is kind of weird that the top players don’t match up with each and/or stream it on YouTube. I guess everyone one wants a piece of the POV stream. Check out the Filipino players and the top of the ladder is always matching up and posting on YouTube. Just yesterday a match was posted between Chua and Aranas. Biado, Raga, Ignacio, Chua, Aranas, Banares, De Luna, etc. all match up all the time and post to YouTube for free.

THIS! One main reason that the Filipino players always play good when they arrive over here is that THEY ARE READY when they get here! They don't need to acclimate to the tables or the players. After the constant competition they have been facing at home, the level of play here seems a notch or two lower. Most of our so called good players would be Level 3 over there! Our best players (excluding Shane) would be Level 2. No other American player, other than Shane, would be a Level 1 player in the Philippines!

I'm not anti USA when I say this. I'm just a realist and prefer to tell the truth as I know it.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
THIS! One main reason that the Filipino players always play good when they arrive over here is that THEY ARE READY when they get here! They don't need to acclimate to the tables or the players. After the constant competition they have been facing at home, the level of play here seems a notch or two lower. Most of our so called good players would be Level 3 over there! Our best players (excluding Shane) would be Level 2. No other American player, other than Shane, would be a Level 1 player in the Philippines!

I'm not anti USA when I say this. I'm just a realist and prefer to tell the truth as I know it.

Agreed. Still, another important reason that the Filipinos are so successful is that they make better decisions than all other players, and yes that includes the obviously amazing Taiwanese players.

Filipino shot designs are just a little better and Filipinos see small extra chances that very few others see. I often feel that they don't get enough credit for this.
 

Island Drive

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Agreed. Still, another important reason that the Filipinos are so successful is that they make better decisions than all other players, and yes that includes the obviously amazing Taiwanese players.

Filipino shot designs are just a little better and Filipinos see small extra chances that very few others see. I often feel that they don't get enough credit for this.

There thinking is of similar nature to the depression era players of the Mosconi era.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Nobody questions that Shane CAN beat the top two guys, Filler and Chang. As you note, when he plays in his very top form, he can beat them, but his average game won't be good enough to beat either.

By the way, it was Shane who disappeared when Filler opened with a five pack in their 2020 Derby City 9-ball match in a late round. At that level, you get plenty of chair time. Shane is not the only one that can humble an opponent.

I think the danger for Filler would be overconfidence, as he's had it so easy against Shane in both the Mosconi and the Derby City Classic of late.

It's hard to argue with you Stu. You are so damn knowledgeable about our sport and its players. I will agree that just about anyone not named Chang is an underdog to Filler right now. Shane would have to be at his best to have any realistic chance of beating him, but playing a long match would be a real test for both players. So much more comes into play when you play a "Race" to 100 or 120. It's a marathon and not a sprint!

The great Filipino players (Orcollo, Pagulayan, Biado, Chua, De Luna, Aranas, Corteza) thrive in this environment. They are the only ones who would probably be willing to play a match like this straight thru with no time off, other than bathroom breaks. Played continuously I would bet on Dennis against anyone. I've seen him play match after match with no let up from morning to night and into the next morning and still be asking for more. :thumbup:
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Agreed. Still, another important reason that the Filipinos are so successful is that they make better decisions than all other players, and yes that includes the obviously amazing Taiwanese players.

Filipino shot designs are just a little better and Filipinos see small extra chances that very few others see. I often feel that they don't get enough credit for this.

All that Rotation Pool is a good training ground for exactly what you're talking about.
 

jburkm002

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I watch pool matches here and there. Usually with the sound off. Commentators can be annoying. I would listen to Sky and Billy every match. They were hilarious and kept it fun. Its pool at a very high level that few can even understand. Sure I can listen to two guys argue about how they would have shot a shot.
"He is playing like he has to poop"
"One hundred and zero"
My wife and I were laughing. They made it fun. Which pool needs.

I liked the story from the team match. Where I guy lost a bet. Betting on CJ Wiley in a match on EDPN. Only to find out it was a replay. That was funny.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

justnum

TesticularCancer Survivor
Silver Member
I watch pool matches here and there. Usually with the sound off. Commentators can be annoying. I would listen to Sky and Billy every match. They were hilarious and kept it fun. Its pool at a very high level that few can even understand. Sure I can listen to two guys argue about how they would have shot a shot.
"He is playing like he has to poop"
"One hundred and zero"
My wife and I were laughing. They made it fun. Which pool needs.

I liked the story from the team match. Where I guy lost a bet. Betting on CJ Wiley in a match on EDPN. Only to find out it was a replay. That was funny.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

todays pool pros and friendly and personable with a scoial media presence.

unlike the older pros with reputations for other things.
 

skogstokig

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There are horses for courses and so it goes in pool. Shane in top form playing 9-Ball (or Ten Ball) would still be a good match for Filler. I'm not sure anyone is a favorite over Shane if his break is working. Let him string a couple of sixes on you and see how that affects your stroke. :rolleyes:

i wasn't talking about his chances but rather about the likelyhood of him agreeing to play filler after this
 

Black-Balled

He Rides the Skies
Silver Member
Certainly looks under the influence to me...lol
 

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sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
All that Rotation Pool is a good training ground for exactly what you're talking about.

Thanks for that. Full rack rotation is rarely played in America, so it's not so easy for many of us to understand exactly which skills it builds and how, but watching the Filipinos play, their conceptualization skills and their skillful use of billiard knowledge are so superior that it boggles the mind.
 

Island Drive

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Thanks for that. Full rack rotation is rarely played in America, so it's not so easy for many of us to understand exactly which skills it builds and how, but watching the Filipinos play, their conceptualization skills and their skillful use of billiard knowledge are so superior that it boggles the mind.

When you learn to play, in your youth, in 3rd world countries, or during the depression era in the USA. It often comes down to two things. Are you gonna eat tonight and are you going to have a place to shower, shave and sleep. This thinking builds ones character and mindset, completely different.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
When you learn to play, in your youth, in 3rd world countries, or during the depression era in the USA. It often comes down to two things. Are you gonna eat tonight and are you going to have a place to shower, shave and sleep. This thinking builds ones character and mindset, completely different.

Yes, reminds me of an old Johnny Ervolino quote: "Desperation is a key ingredient in playing good pool."
 

Get_A_Grip

Truth Will Set You Free
Silver Member
Yes, reminds me of an old Johnny Ervolino quote: "Desperation is a key ingredient in playing good pool."

Good quote. I've been working hard on my grip, aiming, and stroke to improve -- but I suppose if I was desperate, I would find the best way to play great much faster. Do or die.


_______
 

pwd72s

recreational banger
Silver Member
Good quote. I've been working hard on my grip, aiming, and stroke to improve -- but I suppose if I was desperate, I would find the best way to play great much faster. Do or die.


_______

Reminds me of an old story I read about Annie Oakley. After winning a shooting contest over a British Royal, she explained to him that when he missed, he didn't win.
That there was a time that when she missed, she didn't eat.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Thanks for that. Full rack rotation is rarely played in America, so it's not so easy for many of us to understand exactly which skills it builds and how, but watching the Filipinos play, their conceptualization skills and their skillful use of billiard knowledge are so superior that it boggles the mind.

I played a lot of it during my first ten years visiting the Philippines. The best players are very creative, finding and shooting off angle combinations and billiards that are two way shots, and can lead to a winning outcome or a good safety. If they can find a way to make a high numbered ball, they will go for it, with a high rate of success. I'd been playing pool for over forty years when I began to venture over there and I learned new shots and concepts that had never crossed my mind playing 9-Ball.

Their foundation is built on cue ball control and they are the world masters at finding ways to stick "whitey" up your ass. My apologies to those who are easily offended. :rolleyes:
Plus, they are equally adept at escaping the best laid traps.

Put another way, Rotation is the "One Pocket" of all rotation games. Many people may not be aware that Efren is considered the all time best Rotation player in the Philippines. I guess that's no surprise. Learning to play One Pocket was right up his alley! :D
 
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