SVB racking "shenanigans"

who the hell is "everyone"????


I haven't ever heard this?


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Seriously? Maybe he monkeyed around with the rack when he won the DCC 1P tournament back to back...
 
i was just wondering if thats what hes doing, does anyone on hear know how to do the same thing? i think if rack a certain way all the power to him. im not gonna be the one to call him a cheater and tell he cant rack his own haha:)
 
Patrick said:
Haters be hating.

Go ahead and hire yourself a neutral racker and my money is still on SVB.

Patrick
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I'll go a step further and say that you could have any B level player or higher break for SVB and I'd still bet on him against almost anyone.
 
JCIN said:
I heard Shane uses steroids, hates old people, kicks puppies and wipes his ass with the flag. Heard it from a guy who joined AZ this month.

No way anything could be weird there right?
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did you hear that hes a member of alqaeda?
 
zzzz. Some misunderstanding and misinformation here.

- The 10 ball break doesn't need a gap, and a gap doesn't help it.
It goes best when the balls are dead tight. A gap only makes your job harder and makes it inconsistent.
So if shane is laboring over a ten ball rack, it's to get it tight. That includes rotating balls that won't
freeze or reordering them because some small ball refuses to freeze up.

If someone thinks they know a trick to make it every time with a gap, put it on video.

- Even the best in the world only makes a ball 80% in 10b, that's the best average we saw for shane,
even with the magic rack. And a more typical session is only 70%. It's not "wired" by any means.
You need to hit them well.

- 9b is another story, a strategic gap helps the wing ball go if you're forced to break from the box.
He was accused of that too. If a player leaves a gap on purpose in 9b I'd consider it cheating.
But just as easily, you can get an accidental gap because the table has divots and the balls
settle a certain way, or small balls leave a gap you can't prevent.

What "everybody's saying" and "everybody knows" is often five guys repeating another guy's
uninformed guess because they want to sound like they know something. People shouldn't even
begin to guess at this stuff until they've watched Joe Tucker's videos and then put in some serious
time studying and practicing the break, with both the triangle and the magic rack.
 
pacman said:
Hey guys.
i keep hearing everyone talking about the way shane racks.
they say he splits certain balls so that the second ball back is wired for the side pocket.
one, is this true?
two, will someone elaborate please?
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If he isn't doing that why does his spin the one ball with his finger every time? It's pretty obvious what he is doing.

I'd like to see a rule of no touching the balls after the rack is removed.
 
When the triangle shaped rack is consistently tight, it's easy to get the second ball going towards the side. Getting it in the side with regularity takes a consistent contact and speed (ie real control) - not a gap. THAT is why Shane is successful.
 
Rubbing the head ball back to split the 2nd row balls do help them go into the side pockets easier. I wouldn't say they are necessarily wired, but it does help them. I've spent hours playing around with this without a magic rack. With the magic rack, making the 2nd row balls isn't very hard as long as you can get a consistent square hit. You just have to adjust accordingly by moving your break position in towards center or out towards the rail, and/or varying the speed of your break. With the magic rack, I've found my ideal position is breaking off the rail about a ball and a half from center hitting at around 80% power.

Breaking without a magic rack is more difficult because of the inconsistency rack to rack. Splitting those 2 balls though definitely increases your chances of dropping one of them in the side.

I'm not going to sit here and accuse one of the best players in the world of cheating, and I'm not even saying that is what he is doing. He may just be brushing the head ball tight. But before you jump up and call bullsh*t, go try it for yourself. Brush the head ball back, making sure to create a gap between the 2nd row balls, and make sure both those 2nd row balls are tight into the 10, and the 10 is tight on the 2 balls behind it. You'll increase your odds of dropping those 2 balls guaranteed.
 
SCCues said:
I watched Shane at last years US Open where he went undefeated and I saw all of his matches on the TV table where he made the corner ball on every break while his opponents were sporatic making it and I couldn't see him do anything extra while racking the balls. I was there when Alex challenged his rack saying that nobody could make the corner ball every time, but the referee checked Shane's rack and had Shane re-rack some racks and there was nothing funny done to his racks and in fact he racked the balls faster than most players did. He just pushed them up and made sure they were tight and broke the balls. I heard the commentators on Accu-stats say that nobody was hitting them with the same velocity that Shane was hitting the balls with and he was actually making the corner ball fly into the corner pocket. I've played for many years and i've studied racking for my own game and from what I witnessed sitting on the front row ring side during the US Open Shane didn't do anything wrong. He just had the superior break on that table during that tournament. I heard him say during and interview that he would work on his break for hours and it shows by how well he breaks the balls. Like some of the other posters in this thread said with his success brings the negative comments thinking he can't be that good, IMO he is that good!

James
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I too was front row for the US Open semi between Alex and SVB. Alex's statement was that it was impossible to make the wing ball from the box. Funny thing is, Alex made the wing on the break 2 - 3 times himself. :confused:
 
vapoolplayer said:
I have no sympathy for people who complain he's racking a certain way, but don't make him rerack......however, your logic is pretty bad here.

By your logic, they should be rewarded for exploiting and breaking the rules.

What if I took the time to exploit the legal system(like many criminals do) in some way? I should be rewarded because I took the time to figure out how to exploit it???

Also, breaking hard vs soft is much different than positioning the balls a certain way. One is perfectly legal(unless someone changes the rules, which they have in certain situations) and the other is simply against the rules.(pattern racking and racking in a certain way to make balls.)

By your logic, anyone who takes the time to circumvent rules should be rewarded for their time, and the people who call them on it are just lazy..........wow.
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First of all let me say that I was in no way taking a shot at your moral standards bc I posted my opinion. So, when you say my logic is off, its a little off putting.

I understand that pattern racking is a problem but thats not the issue here. ppl have seen the problem with that and corrected it. But what Shane might or might not be doing is, he's not freezing balls together in certain areas. There is no rule in place for this so therefore i feel that he is not doing anything wrong.

Bottom line is when there isn't a rule that says you can't do it then you're not wrong.

See the rack has always been a problem with certain rotational games. Its not gonna get fixed so keep coming up with new rules or just let it evolve into a higher level of play.
 
Most all the top players pattern rack IMO. They have too because everyone else is doing it. Just like jump cues. Even if you don't believe they should be legal, you still need to have if that tournament allows them or you will be at a disadvantage. AND they will keep on pattern racking until some of the promoters and TD's say enough is enough. Johnnyt
 
Not trying to start anything so I hope you don't take it the wrong way.

But are there rules against racking "the supposed fixing/rigging"? I mean I've always heard of players complaining about not getting a tight rack. But never seen anything about a loose rack being a problem.

I've seen in nine ball where guys would try to angle the rack or rack lower to wire the wing ball.

I just hope that they either come up with a solution or just let it go. Learning to rack is a skill in itself if you're forced to rack ur own. Unless there becomes a rule and method of enforcement to what is supposedly going on here I don't think anyone should discredit SVB by saying he's "cheating".

Archer said it himself that Corey destroyed the game when he figured out the soft break. All the Alfa Males hated it and said it shouldn't be allowed. Why not? It's something he worked on to make himself a better player. Now you see everyone ended up having to learn it bc it was a solution to the rack.

It helped evolve 9ball if you ask me. It was one guy finding a way to nuetralize variance. I can appreciate that. If others can't so be it. Let them wallow in their own misery.

I agree that there should be a neutral party that racks every time to temporarily end the disagreements.

Wanna really make it a sport? Just move on to full rotation with "roll out". Make the game difficult so we can see who the truely skilled are. Alternating breaks.

I think that there's a lot that needs to be worked on in this sport. It's been around forever and little has changed bc ppl won't accept change and let the game evolve. Instead they come up wih temporary changes that they themselves haven't thought through to see if there's any gaps or ways to beat it.

Just my two cents. Not trying to offend anyone.
 
vapoolplayer said:
Just found it.....BCA 10 ball rules state you must rack the balls as "tightly as possible." Therefore if someone is intentionally leaving gaps, they are breaking a rule.....

Might want to research before you state someone isn't breaking rules. Corey's soft break on the other hand wasn't against the rules(at least at the time).
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"As tightly as possible" ok but who's there to enforce it? Having a law without an enforcer is useless.

BCA must think of rules the night before they are due. As tightly as possible? How can u tell if he's doing his best? Is there a gauge to measure the pressure he applys?

My quarrel isn't with you, so I'm not sure why I feel like you're attacking me by saying I'm not doing my research.

Like I said my problems not with you. It's with the rules and ppl who come up with them and there so called solutions.
 
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