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SVB racking "shenanigans"
- Thread starter pacman
- Start date
The reality is referees would do it for free.
Yes, it's a "catch 22" isn't it?
The reality is referees would do it for free. None of them were ever paid, they do it for the service or to promote something, or just to be part of the action. Golf tournaments have hundreds of people at their events donating their time to help......and there's charities involved so it's a great thing for the community. Some of the greatest workers do it for reasons other than direct compensation ...I think it's awesome to do something worthwhile for a worthy cause......many people do.
The money is not the issue, it's the fact that no one cares enough to actually do it. Promoting pool will not be about the money, if it was {only about the money} it would end up like......like......hmmm, like it is
.....I guess you have a point. 
Yes, it's a "catch 22" isn't it?
The reality is referees would do it for free. None of them were ever paid, they do it for the service or to promote something, or just to be part of the action. Golf tournaments have hundreds of people at their events donating their time to help......and there's charities involved so it's a great thing for the community. Some of the greatest workers do it for reasons other than direct compensation ...I think it's awesome to do something worthwhile for a worthy cause......many people do.
The money is not the issue, it's the fact that no one cares enough to actually do it. Promoting pool will not be about the money, if it was {only about the money} it would end up like......like......hmmm, like it is
.....I guess you have a point. that is a great point. kinda shallow on my end.
Would somebody tell us how to wire the second ball, make both corner balls 4 rails, make or hang the one at the breaking end, break 'just right' speed to bounce and park the cb-without cheating-or almost not cheating, or cheating and nobody sees it or calls it.
I only want to know so I can recognize whats happening, not to cheat, almost cheat or accidentally gain an advantage.
I only want to learn about racked balls touching or not, and where in the rack they are, or are not. I'm not interested in crooked racks, racks too far forward or back from the spot, or the ordering within the rack---these I will interested in not knowing at some future SVB disparaging discussion.
Maybe the guy is just that good. Maybe he just out works his peers. Nah.....that can't be.
Sorry for the rant...sorta
ps: Joe Tucker talks about some of this...but doesn't give it all up...
I only want to know so I can recognize whats happening, not to cheat, almost cheat or accidentally gain an advantage.
I only want to learn about racked balls touching or not, and where in the rack they are, or are not. I'm not interested in crooked racks, racks too far forward or back from the spot, or the ordering within the rack---these I will interested in not knowing at some future SVB disparaging discussion.
Maybe the guy is just that good. Maybe he just out works his peers. Nah.....that can't be.
Sorry for the rant...sorta
ps: Joe Tucker talks about some of this...but doesn't give it all up...
Bottom line, he worked at it! He found a way to get an edge on everyone else! Everyone should start practicing! Im a B player, I broke and ran 11 racks in a row of 9-ball! And yes, I'm only a B player! Well guess what, I used all the knowledge from Joe tuckers book on breaking and ball placement! Did I cheat, no, I used what I learned! It's all about practicing the right way! Corey dueul started it all! If there was real money in pool, Corey would still be one of, if not the best, at the game! No one is more creative as far as I'm concerned! But as far as svb, good for him! One other thing, there's more games than just 9-10-ball!!! I think how the greats play all the games is the right way to decide who's the best! Not just 1
first, im a huge fan of SVB. i think hes a tremendous player, his work ethic is absolutely the best in the biz, and i think hes just an all around good guy.
if you look at some of my other posts i try and emulate his break and even his stroke in general.
everyone thinks that by posting this thread im attacking SVB, and thats the furthest thing from the truth. if hes doing something to the rack then all the power to him. my reason for posting this thread is to try and LEARN how to rack this way so that i can have another tool in my tool box.
theres some wonderful people on this forum, but theres also some people trying to start crap and bash everybody. im new to AZB but im on the verge of never logging on again.
with my very limited knowledge, i still try and contribute as much as i can so that maybe i can help other people be better players. Im 16 years old and ive already dedicated my life to pool.
the amount of knowledge on this forum is amazing and we can all learn so much. but theres a serious issue with arrogance and it needs to be addressed.
i dont mean to condescend anyone but "be hard on yourself, and easy on others."
and thanks to everyone for all the posts.
That is BS. I watched that match live and SVB was "clearly" setting that ball to go straight into the corner at mach 10 every time. Alex knew what he was doing, he told Jay what he was doing, but Alex was told that he could only ask for 1 rerack and SVB just reracked the exact same way and Alex was then basically told to sit down and shut up and deal with it.
Alex in fact did the exact same thing on his one chance at the table and put a package on SVB making the same ball in the same pocket but he scratched on a break after some bnr's and never saw the table again.
It was all BS and it was called by the opponent but it was tolerated and the opponent had no recourse.
M0NSTERKILLER
Registered
1. The most important shot in the game is still the break.
2. If ANYONE wants to work at their break for hours at a time and puts in the labor at it and isn't breaking any rules should reap the benefits.
3. I've practiced the break for hours this week and have already seen major benefits of the differences in cue ball placement, speed, and 1 ball patterns. Seems completely logical just like practicing any other shot.
4. If TAR or other major tournaments don't put an end to this format in some way this will continue.
5. Watched another major tournament and there was clearly pattern racking going on. Until there is some type of deviation from this rule this wont change. But even if you changed it against these world class players I'm sure they would play as strong as they do.
6. Roll or get rolled over I guess. Tough subject either way you look at it.
2. If ANYONE wants to work at their break for hours at a time and puts in the labor at it and isn't breaking any rules should reap the benefits.
3. I've practiced the break for hours this week and have already seen major benefits of the differences in cue ball placement, speed, and 1 ball patterns. Seems completely logical just like practicing any other shot.
4. If TAR or other major tournaments don't put an end to this format in some way this will continue.
5. Watched another major tournament and there was clearly pattern racking going on. Until there is some type of deviation from this rule this wont change. But even if you changed it against these world class players I'm sure they would play as strong as they do.
6. Roll or get rolled over I guess. Tough subject either way you look at it.
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I really don't get this line of thinking, and I see it a lot on here.
If --and it is an if-- he (or any other player) is doing something to the rack then it's illegal and should absolutely not be tolerated. If there are problems with rack mechanics in American pool then it's only because it's tolerated by the majority.
There are many people who have clearly "not" watched the US open match between Alex and SVB. I suggest before posting any further you find it and watch it. That match was not a case of "oh he just breaks so much better then everyone else!" The exact same wing ball was going straight into the lower right corner every single time. It was being wired like a trick shot and that is all it was. In that event SVB was using about as much "skill" as it takes to set up and make a butterfly trick shot.
I freely admit in 10-ball or 8-ball he simply hits them great and people cannot compete and in those instances all the power to SVB but what he did in the US-open 9-ball was crap.
I freely admit in 10-ball or 8-ball he simply hits them great and people cannot compete and in those instances all the power to SVB but what he did in the US-open 9-ball was crap.
I only saw a short video of that match at the time (and haven't seen it since) but from what I remember of it I tend to agree with you here. Like I said, though, I haven't seen it for a while.
Celtic... I watched the US Open match, and yes, the ball went in like clockword, and yes it's normally not supposed to from that angle.
What I'm not entirely sold on is the idea he did it intentionally.
He was showing earl this 'magic wing ball' before the match, and was apparently really excited about it.
What do you make of that?
One interpretation is - he's leaving a gap intentionally (i.e. cheating) and blatantly showing off to earl
how he can subtly cheat to wire a ball go that isn't supposed to go. Would you show that to a guy like Earl?
And despite complaints from alex, Jay H. somehow missed it.
Another possibility (and I think this is more likely) - he discovered a certain table, when racked normally,
has a flaw that causes the ball to go. And he's excited about that and showing earl something he
accidentally discovered, not some sleazy move he worked out before the tournament.
What I'm not entirely sold on is the idea he did it intentionally.
He was showing earl this 'magic wing ball' before the match, and was apparently really excited about it.
What do you make of that?
One interpretation is - he's leaving a gap intentionally (i.e. cheating) and blatantly showing off to earl
how he can subtly cheat to wire a ball go that isn't supposed to go. Would you show that to a guy like Earl?
And despite complaints from alex, Jay H. somehow missed it.
Another possibility (and I think this is more likely) - he discovered a certain table, when racked normally,
has a flaw that causes the ball to go. And he's excited about that and showing earl something he
accidentally discovered, not some sleazy move he worked out before the tournament.
If anyone on this forum board this Shane Van Boening does not have the BEST racking mechanics in the game, then you are a blind fool. The man has spent more time breaking the balls, and IN TURN RACKING THE BALLS than probably any other human on earth.
With that being said, Shane is the best in the business, whether that is because he has the best break or the best mechanics I don't know. But either way he has earned it, because if his racking mechanics are that good that the pros can't see him doing it, then he is DAMN good.
With that being said, Shane is the best in the business, whether that is because he has the best break or the best mechanics I don't know. But either way he has earned it, because if his racking mechanics are that good that the pros can't see him doing it, then he is DAMN good.
My opinion (aka worthless)...
Was it intentional? Absolutely.
Is it cheating? I don't think so. I consider it knowledge. It's rack your own.
Was it sleazy? Absolutely not.
What can be done? Nothing. A neutral racker? Still no good. Players with either accept the inconsistent racks (highly unlikely) or they will request a re-rack until the cows come home. The sooner we accept the 9 ball rack is terribly flawed and exploited the sooner we can quit having these crap threads. Maybe if the TDs enforced the no touching of the rack more it would help things...but I don't know.
Would full rack rotation really be that boring for spectators? You'd have a scoreboard, best of 5 games? *shrug*
OK, so, if you're ok with someone making a gap on purpose to help their break,
then you should be ok with someone leaving a gap on purpose to hurt your break, right?
And it's not cheating to intentionally break a rule that says in black and white:
"The balls must be racked as tightly as possible"?
Why not? It's worked in the past. We've had racks that freeze the balls reliably for years, starting with the sardo and now the magic rack. At least a neutral racker won't intentionally leave a gap to help or hurt someone.
I don't disagree he's studied the break and rack... but you don't automatically have to rack them to practice breaking them anymore, thanks to the breakrak. That's what shane uses, for hours at a time.
When a guy gets called "the best in the world" at breaking, why are we all getting suspicious when he makes balls? Why's he gonna settle for cheating when he has all the tools necessary to win legitimately?
Because he is a pool player, and that is how me makes his living and he isn't THAT much better than the other top 10 players in the world so he will take any edge he can get cause that is how he pays his bills.
No different than a salesman having some "tricks" up his sleeve, or a computer programmer taking a shortcut. Pool is his job, and any halfwit would not judge him for wanting to feed himself.
Yes, you're a halfwit if you don't condone cheating. What nonsense.
