Meaning, your visual "is what it is."
I was hoping for better examples.
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Testing your system
- Thread starter duckie
- Start date
Meaning, your visual "is what it is."
I was hoping for better examples.
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2
This can be a good thread if Duck participates.
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2
Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2
Wow, I always thought duckie was a system proponent, because he has posts so many diagrams.
He believes that ghost ball is the ONLY way to play, and everything else is hogwash and a waste of time.
Here's what's funny about ghost ball when it comes to my game.
I don't get to play much actual pool (maybe 2 or 3 times a week), so in my spare time I'll play some VP3 to keep fresh on patterns. In that game, I use mostly ghost ball, and do pretty well. In real life though, I can't use ghost ball to save my life, so I tend to use SEE.
I don't get to play much actual pool (maybe 2 or 3 times a week), so in my spare time I'll play some VP3 to keep fresh on patterns. In that game, I use mostly ghost ball, and do pretty well. In real life though, I can't use ghost ball to save my life, so I tend to use SEE.
Could be. And the only one of the 4 shots that seems to me to be somewhat awkward is #3. Maybe I didn't place them exactly in accordance with Duckie's locations.
The first series only tested the one part of shot making, putting the ball in the hole.
The part not tested was getting position for the next shot. I took a few pics during my 4.5 hours of 14.1 practice yesterday in order to give so reference to what is needed to do with shot will affect your aim. Yall, do practice this much right?
The first one shows a problem cluster, 2, 1, 8 close to the side rail and the 10 is going to be the break ball. I cut the 9 into the right corner, went two rail, to get position above the 2 for the same pocket as the 9 went. The plan was to get back the 2, hit the 15 enough to bounce it out and leaving a shot on the 8 in the corner opposite corner where the 2 went.
To do this I had to use running english, in this case outside and to get the angle off the 9 I need, I had to hit off center of the pocket.
The second one the shows that you don't always have a option for the position you shoot from. Remember that every shot has to lead to another to be able to get a high run in 14.1. Because of the ball layout, the 3 ball was the right shot. So see, there are times in the real world of shooting making you have to shoot from weird positions.
Remember angles are important. The thing, the angle on the 2 was not right and the shot didn't go as planned but closer enough.
The third shows that some shots you have to reach, use a bridge or you have to lean over from the side of the table. The 5 is set up to break open the cluster to the right. This was the only position I could get on it to be able to use it to open up the cluster to the right. It either stretch, use the bridge or lean over from the left of the table, which is the way I did the shot because I had better control of my stroke than using the bridge or reaching.
This is the world real of pool, shots on the table during actual play and not set up shots to prove that something works or discussing theoretical type of shots used for the majority of the discussions about aiming.
Oh yeah, what is a medium stroke?
The part not tested was getting position for the next shot. I took a few pics during my 4.5 hours of 14.1 practice yesterday in order to give so reference to what is needed to do with shot will affect your aim. Yall, do practice this much right?
The first one shows a problem cluster, 2, 1, 8 close to the side rail and the 10 is going to be the break ball. I cut the 9 into the right corner, went two rail, to get position above the 2 for the same pocket as the 9 went. The plan was to get back the 2, hit the 15 enough to bounce it out and leaving a shot on the 8 in the corner opposite corner where the 2 went.
To do this I had to use running english, in this case outside and to get the angle off the 9 I need, I had to hit off center of the pocket.
The second one the shows that you don't always have a option for the position you shoot from. Remember that every shot has to lead to another to be able to get a high run in 14.1. Because of the ball layout, the 3 ball was the right shot. So see, there are times in the real world of shooting making you have to shoot from weird positions.
Remember angles are important. The thing, the angle on the 2 was not right and the shot didn't go as planned but closer enough.
The third shows that some shots you have to reach, use a bridge or you have to lean over from the side of the table. The 5 is set up to break open the cluster to the right. This was the only position I could get on it to be able to use it to open up the cluster to the right. It either stretch, use the bridge or lean over from the left of the table, which is the way I did the shot because I had better control of my stroke than using the bridge or reaching.
This is the world real of pool, shots on the table during actual play and not set up shots to prove that something works or discussing theoretical type of shots used for the majority of the discussions about aiming.
Oh yeah, what is a medium stroke?
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I do not understand this at all; seeing as you can see only one ball the only thing I can figure is that it is just to make this ball; with all of these shots one could use any system at all. If it is a question of what I (or anyone) would do given this position, here is my answer.
Shot #1: Shoot the ball in; I see no body alignment problems.
Shot #2: I would just shoot this left handed (I am right handed).
Shot #3: Humm if this is a shot you have to system to make, you have bigger problems than I do as a player; you need to practice with your left hand a little, the shot is too easy; it's a diamond and a half away from the pocket. I don't think I would have had problems with this shot pretty early in my time, even before I played for 10 years against all women left handed (my opposite hand, not women that are left handed).
Shot #4: This shot I would probably system and shoot left handed if I was not in dead stroke and this is not all that easy a shot (yea I can admit that) with my non-dexterous hand. The chances are I would CTE this, I will shoot this 10 times tonight and post my %. my bet would be 70%-80% I would be surprized if I missed 4 or made 9 or 10 of these.
Shot #1: Shoot the ball in; I see no body alignment problems.
Shot #2: I would just shoot this left handed (I am right handed).
Shot #3: Humm if this is a shot you have to system to make, you have bigger problems than I do as a player; you need to practice with your left hand a little, the shot is too easy; it's a diamond and a half away from the pocket. I don't think I would have had problems with this shot pretty early in my time, even before I played for 10 years against all women left handed (my opposite hand, not women that are left handed).
Shot #4: This shot I would probably system and shoot left handed if I was not in dead stroke and this is not all that easy a shot (yea I can admit that) with my non-dexterous hand. The chances are I would CTE this, I will shoot this 10 times tonight and post my %. my bet would be 70%-80% I would be surprized if I missed 4 or made 9 or 10 of these.
And they were pretty simple except for 1 shot.
Yup
Ok I think you mean "cheat the pocket", BTW that is common lingo in most parts of the country.
So your contention is that systems cannot be used from "weird positions"? I will tell you that is entirely incorrect.
This is not specific to good 14.1 play this is how pool is generally played well, 1-Pocket is somewhat of an exception in the early stages of the rack.
Gotcha; thanks for the tip.
To help to distinguish one of the differences between theory and application, I offer up the Navy's Sea Dart as an example of looks good on paper, passing all the development testing, but fails when placed into action the the real world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convair_F2Y_Sea_Dart
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOrj2cSDO-M
Just saying......
BTW, I know what my medium hit is, and I bet to most they would consider it a soft hit, but wait, whats a soft hit?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convair_F2Y_Sea_Dart
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOrj2cSDO-M
Just saying......
BTW, I know what my medium hit is, and I bet to most they would consider it a soft hit, but wait, whats a soft hit?
Since you are putting this sort of thing in multiple threads, I'll give the same type of answer I gave in the other thread.
As you know, a soft hit is something between a very soft hit and a medium hit.:smile:
Here is the terminology Koehler used in one of his books for his controlled experiments:
Very soft -- 1 table length
Soft -- 2 table lengths
Medium -- 3 table lengths
Hard -- 4 table lengths
Very Hard -- 4+ table lengths
Soft -- 2 table lengths
Medium -- 3 table lengths
Hard -- 4 table lengths
Very Hard -- 4+ table lengths
Your analogy to the Navy's Sea Dart is both incorrectly described, as well in appropriate to the aiming systems discussion.
First, the correction. Your "looks good on paper, passing all the development testing, but fails when placed into action in the real world" is INCORRECT. Yes, the Sea Dart passed all its development testing with flying colors -- and everyone was surprised how well it performed. But it NEVER SAW ACTION IN THE REAL WORLD in the first place, nevermind "failing" it.
The project was scrapped, because it offered a solution to a problem that DIDN'T EXIST. The Navy was worried about supersonic planes being able to take off and land on the decks of aircraft carriers, a worry of which was shortly thereafter completely blown away with the introduction of the steam-piston launch and stopping wires. I'm an ex-Navy man myself, and pride myself in my "military history buff" knowledge of these things.
But foregoing my "post-service military history buff" knowledge, did you even listen to the audio in the video, or did you even read the Wiki link? Or did you just skim it, thinking its full content was "Exhibit A" of the point you're trying to make?
You're supposedly a QA Tester, but you amaze me sometimes with your oversights, Greg.
-Sean
I agree and in his first picture with the three trouble balls along the rail I wonder why he waited so long in the rack to deal with them.
I'm not a Navy man nor am I a QA tester, so I need help Sean. Are you trying to say Duck's use of his exhibits is like having a dentist smile and showing off "Meth-teeth?"
I am most definitely not a Navy man.
I can still hear that Village People tune.........
I can still hear that Village People tune.........
E-X-A-C-T-L-Y-!!!
Or the cobbler, got no shoes on the feet...
(Sounds like a Steve Miller Band song...)
-Sean
This thread really is to show the weakness in making generalized statements and test results about shot making in pool.
Generalized statements such as "Thin cut shots are easier with draw", "CIT/SIT happens on all shots", "Use inside, aim for the side of the pocket" "Use xxx in order to place my left foot", " You need to use a bridge placement of xx from CB" and so on.
Never has anyone asked what the weight of the balls or what type of material they were made of when preforming these lab test. Nor if they were clean or dirty.The type and age of the cloth being used for these tests. All these things matter in how a ball reacts, in how you do things on the table during a live match, not always under ideal conditions or always under certain conditions. The test really shows what is happening for that set of balls, for that table, for that players medium hit(which is undefined).
This whole thread is to give those new players that read this stuff or those that just might not being buying that current snake oil on the market a different point of view than those that making generalized statements about shot making and offer up test results under such limited conditions that do not even become close to what is mostly experienced during real play.
How a system works under stress is just as important on how well it works under ideal conditions. I provided shots to stress whatever system you use. If you do not practice these types of shots and get real comfy with them, you will always fear them when they show up during competition. You do not always have a choice on the shot that is left you. Players will put the CB in the most awkward places place on the table because, well, because it is awkward.
Since Zen quotes are being used "The perfect way is only difficult for those who pick and chose. Do not like, do not dislike; all will be clear. Make a hairbreadth difference and heaven and hell are set apart; if you want the truth to stand clear before you, never be for or against. The struggle between "for" and "against" is the mind's worst disease."
Or how about "All vague notions must fall before a pupil can call himself master" Way too many students on here and very few masters.
Generalized statements such as "Thin cut shots are easier with draw", "CIT/SIT happens on all shots", "Use inside, aim for the side of the pocket" "Use xxx in order to place my left foot", " You need to use a bridge placement of xx from CB" and so on.
Never has anyone asked what the weight of the balls or what type of material they were made of when preforming these lab test. Nor if they were clean or dirty.The type and age of the cloth being used for these tests. All these things matter in how a ball reacts, in how you do things on the table during a live match, not always under ideal conditions or always under certain conditions. The test really shows what is happening for that set of balls, for that table, for that players medium hit(which is undefined).
This whole thread is to give those new players that read this stuff or those that just might not being buying that current snake oil on the market a different point of view than those that making generalized statements about shot making and offer up test results under such limited conditions that do not even become close to what is mostly experienced during real play.
How a system works under stress is just as important on how well it works under ideal conditions. I provided shots to stress whatever system you use. If you do not practice these types of shots and get real comfy with them, you will always fear them when they show up during competition. You do not always have a choice on the shot that is left you. Players will put the CB in the most awkward places place on the table because, well, because it is awkward.
Since Zen quotes are being used "The perfect way is only difficult for those who pick and chose. Do not like, do not dislike; all will be clear. Make a hairbreadth difference and heaven and hell are set apart; if you want the truth to stand clear before you, never be for or against. The struggle between "for" and "against" is the mind's worst disease."
Or how about "All vague notions must fall before a pupil can call himself master" Way too many students on here and very few masters.
Do you realize that your posts constantly go against the "zen" quotes you like to add at the end of them??