Thats a Lot of Members

[Johnnyt]

I just read on the AZ home page that the APA has 265,000 members. I don't know how many T.A.P. has, but I'm sure there are at least a quarter million more that play but don't belong to the APA or TAP. I would say pool is very much alive in all areas except at the Pro level. A half a milion or more pool players is not that small of a market to sell pool products in. I would guess that most that have a good product are doing well.

The Pro's have been told for years that they will never be a mainstream sport if they don't have one voice/one organization. Twenty years later...still none. How can you feel sorry for people that can't come together for the common good of all? Johnnyt

 

[JoeW]

Last summer I was in the Chesapeake Bay area with family and friends. I read through a homes guide that began in the one million dollar price range. Some were as high as 20 million dollars. As I remember there were 25 or more homes in the slick magazine. Every home had a "billiard room." So it would seem that there are not only a lot of players there are many people with who live a good life and have access to the game. This was the Annapolis / Washington DC area one of the seats of power in the country.

From personal experience I know several people who have high incomes and play. I conclude that contrary to some thinking, pool is played by many educated people with high incomes. Most of them do not post here for lots of obvious reasons.

For the professional or business person pool is a good sport or hobby in that it can be played at home, in privacy, at one's connivance. It is very challenging, and allows one to get away from the daily grind. These people are also the ones who “read the book,” and take up hobbies seriously.

The market is indeed large and broad, I would guess that most of these people are not found in pool halls and bars.

 

[Maniac]

The Pro?s have been told for years that they will never be a mainstream sport if they don?t have one voice/one organization. Twenty years later...still none. How can you feel sorry for people that can?t come together for the common good of all? Johnnyt

I don't feel sorry for them. Heck, they oughta feel sorry for ME ! I'm the one that can't shoot a lick of pool !

Maniac

 

[Snapshot9]

Tidbits and misc.

The latest I heard, 38% of all Americans play pool on a regular basis.
That would be close to 144 million people.

I have emailed www.fathead.com and told them they are missing out on a lot of sales by not having professional Billiard players in their product line. Think of all the people with home Poolrooms that would get a fathead or two to get that Pool room feel in their basement ...

Not only that, but lots of Pool rooms across the country, especially smaller ones, might buy a Fathead -2-3 as a draw to get people in there, or to feel like someone famous was there. Especially the women pros!!!

The efforts in the Pool world are segmented, and each little segment is concerned about only their own, without any real effort
to define a Pool structure for the whole country, that can be carried over to the International level. They might tell you they have National goals, but do you ever see any real progress towards them?

One of the biggest problems is Financial support for the sport, and always has been. Until companies are willing to step up, and offer some support, companies outside the industry, Pool will always be on the outside looking in, somewhat akin to Archery a little.

 

[Maniac]

From personal experience I know several people who have high incomes and play. I conclude that contrary to some thinking, pool is played by many educated people with high incomes. Most of them do not post here for lots of obvious reasons.

The market is indeed large and I would guess that most of these people are not found in pool halls and bars.

I hear what you're saying, JoeW. The market is indeed large, and the majority of persons playing pool in America (and probably worldwide too) are amateurs. Manufacterers/distributors of pool products would still reap benefits if professional pool ceased to exist (don't get me wrong here, I love professional pool and would NEVER want it to go away).

BTW, I have a home table, but I still frequent and spend money at many different pool halls/bars. Ya gotta feed the industry to keep it alive.

Maniac

 

[JoeW]

While I understand Snapshot9?s statement, I disagree. The problem lies with the players. It seems to me that professions emerge when the members of that profession decide to organize for the good of the profession. The WPA is a good example. They organized and the sponsors followed.

Pool players continue to have a gambler's mentality and are too self-centered to organize a professional ethical association for the good of the sport. Each player is looking out only for self interest and that will defeat the construction of an effective organization.

There are exceptions such as Allen Hopkins' efforts to provide value for service. When people like Hopkins surface others look to take advantage. I suspect that organizing the sport around some socially acceptable goals that even the gambling pro would be willing to support might stand a chance.

Rather than have Bruswick organize demonstrations that will sell tables there needs to be a national youth league or something along those line where everyone knows there is some goal other than making money.

 

[Neil]

...............

 

[Johnnyt]

Maybe the APA should be the ruling body of Pro Billiards too. It's already in place and seems to be doing a decent job from the numbers I'm reading. Johnnyt

 

[JoeW]

I agree with you Neil. You have stated the problem well. Now we need a solution that would attract the nomad / loner pro player. I don't know what it is but some creative soul will come up with something. The opportunities are limitless.

It will take some one with a big heart, lots of creativity, and a future orientation. I have read here about what they are doing in Korea with their youth academies (or whatever they are called) and that seems to be one way to go. Allen Hopkins is a good bet right now. Perhaps the women will set a precedence that will get some of the male players moving.

 

[JoeW]

Maybe the APA should be the ruling body of Pro Billiards too. It's already in place and seems to be doing a decent job from the numbers I'm reading. Johnnyt

Now there is an idea and a good bet (for the betting person)

 

[Johnnyt]

Would the APA be a good fit to organize Pro Players/Pro pool? Of course the APA would have to want to take this on. They probably are happy the way things are. Johnnyt

 

[whitewolf]

I agree with you Neil. You have stated the problem well. Now we need a solution that would attract the nomad / loner pro player.

Like I have always been saying, it is going to take one of us (AZ members) hitting the lottery big time

 

[jgpool]

Right on JohnnyT!!!

I just read on the AZ home page that the APA has 265,000 members. I don't know how many T.A.P. has, but I'm sure there are at least a quarter million more that play but don't belong to the APA or TAP. I would say pool is very much alive in all areas except at the Pro level. A half a milion or more pool players is not that small of a market to sell pool products in. I would guess that most that have a good product are doing well.

The Pro's have been told for years that they will never be a mainstream sport if they don't have one voice/one organization. Twenty years later...still none. How can you feel sorry for people that can't come together for the common good of all? Johnnyt

I have said this before too! Basketball has NBA, football the NFL, baseball has theirs and so does hockey. This is the only way pool will become mainstream. The one thing that the mythical governing body of pool must have is that pool must be the only thing that they promote. Not themselves or their pet tourney or their sponsors. It must only be pool as their priority. Then it will happen. Look what happened to boxing with all it's sanctioning bodies. You got it JohnnyT!! Somebody please step up.

 

[soulcatcher]

Membership numbers

Any time I see membership numbers, I wonder if they are looking at "active" members. 265,000 is a lot of people, but are they all current active members, or members active within the last 2 years, or members that have signed up since APA started some 30 years ago?

Last year I was looking into TAP to bring it to my area, and they were stating 50,000 membership at that time. Also they were touting their rocketship like rise in membership something like 20,000 to 50,000 in just a few years, a 150% gain in membership. However, adding 30,000 over those years, I think APA closely matched those numbers, but because they were already in the 200,000+ range, they only made a 10-15% increase in business. The bigger the business the smaller the effect of the same increase.

I also agree that we will probably never see a single governing body for pool, unless somebody TRUSTWORTHY (not IPT) steps up to the plate with the money to organize it. IPT was a great idea, but when the "guaranteed" funds dried up, Kevin just put another black eye on the game of pool.

 

[poolplayer]

265,000 is the number of active members for the year 2007. It is actually a little over 267,000 members who paid their membership in 2007. If they counted every person that has ever been a member I am sure the number is near if not over 1,000,000 in the 29 years since the APA started. In my opinion I think it would be great if the APA took an active role in promoting a professional billiard league. I would think that they definitely have the resources to pull it off.

 

[chilli66]

I don't feel sorry for them. Heck, they oughta feel sorry for ME ! I'm the one that can't shoot a lick of pool !

Maniac

OMG! You're not really expecting us to believe that are you? I haven't forgotten what happened the last time we played in a tourney!

 

[Maniac]

OMG! You're not really expecting us to believe that are you? I haven't forgotten what happened the last time we played in a tourney!

Ade, even a blind hog finds an acorn every now and then !!!

Maniac

 

[chilli66]

Ade, even a blind hog finds an acorn every now and then !!!

Maniac

In future I will be taking my army of trained squirrels to sweep the room first! Damn those acorns!

 

[oldneo]

Pool Players

If we have so many pool players in the world why are so many local pool halls closing up people aren't playing as much as you might think the only time I see the local pool hall he in Maryland full to capacity is when they have the playoffs such as now, last saturday they had 48 APA teams at 12 noon and another 42 teams came in that evening, these times and when you have your regular APA season but when the APA isn't playing the pool hall is empty.

Without the APA in the local pool halls they just don't make enough money to keep going keeping the tables up with good felt can be expensive along with paying employees and the light bill again I say yes their may be a lot of pool players but unless your local place has a big APA following they won't last long. Just they way I see it I work in a local pool hall part time and I see those days when there isn't but a couple of people in there for hours on end.

 

[Johnnyt]

If we have so many pool players in the world why are so many local pool halls closing up people aren't playing as much as you might think the only time I see the local pool hall he in Maryland full to capacity is when they have the playoffs such as now, last saturday they had 48 APA teams at 12 noon and another 42 teams came in that evening, these times and when you have your regular APA season but when the APA isn't playing the pool hall is empty.

Without the APA in the local pool halls they just don't make enough money to keep going keeping the tables up with good felt can be expensive along with paying employees and the light bill again I say yes their may be a lot of pool players but unless your local place has a big APA following they won't last long. Just they way I see it I work in a local pool hall part time and I see those days when there isn't but a couple of people in there for hours on end.

A lot of them play in bars, big sports bars with 10-25 tables, and big million dollar rooms. For the most part the little 8- 12 table just pool poolroom is history. Can you say rent too high? Johnnyt