The Ballad of John and Lou, Part Three
- Thread starter lfigueroa
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Yep. Losing your money once doesn't prove anything to me. A guy at a pool hall woofed about being able to beat me for $1000. So I said "ok, let me go to the bank machine". I hauled out $1000. Came back to play. Suddenly, the number changed to $500. Then $200. He lost. So, was he "all talk"? In my mind, yes.
There was $33k mentioned by John. "Stack it up" - weren't those his words? How much ended up in play? $10k. Yeah, that's "all talk" to me. Sorry if our opinions differ.
John
This desire to constantly delve back into recollections and interpretations of the past in order to find the "first hurt" to justify poor present-day behavior is childish.
Kevin
You tell a story on the internet about once beating a guy out of $200.
John actually put up 10K of his own and bet it.
Yet, he is the one that is "all talk"
Yup, our opinions vary.
Not seeking to justify it. In all this so far I am the only one who has publicly admitted my part in the fighting and is not proud of it.
It seems to me that the only ones who appear to act as if all the hurtful things that they have said and continue to say are those on the other side. And they are enabled by the moderator.
I only want the record to be straight.
I know it takes two to fight but that doesn't mean that one side gets to rewrite the story Kevin.
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John
I think everyone on this forum would agree with one thing and that is that you have stated your side of the story in all your disputes plenty.
The thing is, nobody really cares about who thinks who hurt who first. These constant attrmpts to "set the record straight" fall on deaf ears and really just give the folks that want to bait you ammo.
Anybody who has seen any life at all knows that 2 people will remember the exact same event differently. What's the sense of constantly holding up your version of the truth as the only version? Nobody believes that, and even if they did, nobody cares.
Do you think anyone here cares who threw the first blow between you and Lou? And, if you agree that they don't, why hash it out? Who benefits?
Kevin
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Brian
I am the spokesman for AZ. There was a poll, I can't remember when, but you voted for me. Remember?
Kevin
I first started visiting AZB during The Last Great CTE War. It was a very blunt introduction to many of the regulars here, of course including John and Lou.
I had some strong opinions then, mostly based on the way many folks responded here. Some of those opinions and impressions have changed over the years, others have been reinforced.
Personally, I appreciate both John and Lou, very much. I think they both bring a wealth of experience and passion for pool to the forum. I (usually) enjoy their posts very much.
What I never enjoyed was when it got too personal. That was amplified with the help of others, of course. It still continues to this day.
It is not accurate for anyone to try and state that either guy is viewed badly by the majority of this forum. For every one of me that thinks this way, there are undoubtedly many more than don't comment.
I hope that John and Lou find at least some common ground going forward.
Yes Eric started it. Elsewhere. He knew his presence would shark me and I played into it in the dumbest way possible.
He didn't shut me up though. Not there not here not ever.
Yeah its a disease that is apparently spreading. For me, I find it quite easy to disagree with a guy's opinions on one subject without having to shore my opinion up by finding reasons to hate him personally and I don't find it necessary to disagree with him on everything in perpetuity.
But I realize that's not the same for everyone.
Sadly, many folks think of it as sport, to sit behind their keyboards and constantly fire away at others, stirring crap up, and trying to antagonize others.
I agree, we can have differences of opinion without making it a life mission to follow those with said opinions around, continually having to prove that they are right. John and Lou have both attracted many such folks. And they can obviously handle things on their own here, rather efficiently
justadub you win!
I have not said anything yet in regards to this match because I know both Lou and John. Up until now there had not been a response that put into words the way I felt.
You nailed it. The personal BS turns me off. The writing skills and debate of John and Lou are admirable.
It was cool that the match went down and both men won something, and I would hope to see a re-match in the future. These two men are part of the fabric that makes up this forum and we are lucky to have them. The fighting and back biting is un-nerving, but thats just the way it makes me feel. Some love to watch or be a part of the drama, I get that.
Lou and John thanks for the interesting match and all your contributions to the forum and the industry.
I agree. The easy targets are baitable and argumentative.
This time it just cost somebody a lot of money. Maybe next time it will be more serious.
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I guess the match wrap-up is a good enough spot for this:
I really think streamers and promoters should take heed and I know for a fact that many shared by personal experience regarding this match.
I don't think I have never watched a one-pocket match. If I were told that Efren and Shane were playing one-hole across the street I might not get up to walk over and watch it.
This match the pool wasn't so good, certainly not high level one-pocket by any means, regardless of the reasons. However, I watched it almost in its entirety and would have paid to see it.
For all the talk about where pool fails in audience appeal, perhaps some of the positive answers lie in matches like this.
I guarantee you I could take a few weeks to promote Schmidt/Harriman and double the numbers of paid viewers over the most popular TAR match ever. In my eyes, OMGWTF vs CubC put TAR on the map.
Not so say it would be worth it to anybody. I guess what I'm saying is that a possible key to increasing the popularity or viewership of pool matches might lie in the Epic Battle of John vs Lou.
I really think streamers and promoters should take heed and I know for a fact that many shared by personal experience regarding this match.
I don't think I have never watched a one-pocket match. If I were told that Efren and Shane were playing one-hole across the street I might not get up to walk over and watch it.
This match the pool wasn't so good, certainly not high level one-pocket by any means, regardless of the reasons. However, I watched it almost in its entirety and would have paid to see it.
For all the talk about where pool fails in audience appeal, perhaps some of the positive answers lie in matches like this.
I guarantee you I could take a few weeks to promote Schmidt/Harriman and double the numbers of paid viewers over the most popular TAR match ever. In my eyes, OMGWTF vs CubC put TAR on the map.
Not so say it would be worth it to anybody. I guess what I'm saying is that a possible key to increasing the popularity or viewership of pool matches might lie in the Epic Battle of John vs Lou.
John, really.
If 15 years ago on RSB I said, "CTE is ca-ca and everyone who believes in it wears tin foil hats and think they can bend spoons with their minds" what does it matter today, 15 years later? As I told you after the match, I would not say things today I said 10, 15 years ago. I would like to think I have become older and hopefully a little bit wiser.
After the match I pointed out to you how I had, by-and-large, abandoned the Aiming Forum -- not because I was told to stay away, I was not -- but because I'm a little bit wiser now.
I also told you that months ago I had been sent a copy of Stan's 2nd DVD and had people *begging me* to review it, as I did his first DVD, and I have not. I would like to think I am a little bit wiser now.
Thorough out the last five months I did not bark back at you, through all the insults ("louser," "fluffier corporation,") the taunts ("Lou won't show," "Lou has no heart") and the lies ("I will take all side bets and stack it at the event"). I would like to think I'm a little wiser now.
And now, after the match, I have struggled to keep it all classy and to give you your due because, I would like to think I am a little wiser now.
But you still want to argue about things long in the past and use them to justify your actions, words, and feelings in the here and now. John, I don't know about you, but I have learned much in recent years. Our match has taught me things about myself and I have taken many good things away from that experience. What has happened in the past is gone or I have let it go. It's too bad you appear to not be able to do the same.
Lou Figueroa
Lou its simple. The blisters you put on Bartons are still sore if he cant let it go. Its simple if Barton is still not happy then when he comes back through St.Louis then just flip a coin for another set for 10k and make him post the cash.
A few things would have to happen though. First you both would have to have 10k and both of you would have to have the heart to play. Im sure one of you has both.
Would it be possible to just jump up and play the same day Barton stops into your town without 5 months of BS. Maybe Barton can find a backer????
I never said much about your match but I will say Lou you and everybody else were very wrong about something.
Lou you were not backed in your match. A backer is a person who puts up all the money and then gives the player a % of the winnings usually half of the bet. Lou you did not have a backer you had a partner. A person who took part of your bet with you having the other part yourself.
Classy response, Lou. This is the best way to deal with it -- take the high road, and only lightly parry any blows sent your way (mostly to redirect their energies; not go at them head-on). I learned a while ago on these boards -- with a couple run-ins -- that it's not worth the headache and stress.
Like Bruce (justadub) and kvinbrwr state above -- it's not worth "root cause analysis" or "inception inspection" that some people want to engage in to force someone to "own up to who caused the first hurt." At this point -- 15 years later -- it's not only no longer applicable, but just not worth it.
We can all say confidently that what we did 5/10/15/..etc. years ago is not something we'd do today. It's called life experience. I look back on some of the things I wrote in forums that far back, and I cringe. Not so much "I can't believe I thought that way" (because I did, and I know it), but more along the lines of "I can't believe I didn't have the restraint back then to see it's not worth it."
Anyway, just parry the energies to redirect them, and stay classy.
-Sean
TheThaiger
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Judging by the For Sale forum lately, JB Cases Ltd is doing rather well out of it.
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