The Best Cue Case Period
- Thread starter Straight Pool
- Start date
hangemhigh said:
I guess I added a new twist then.
Does anyone ever consider that the "Fellini" latch is what happened to be available at the time?
I think I'd be about 90% certain that Bob Hemphill did not invent this latch. I am pretty sure that he bought it from whatever luggage parts suppliers were active at the time.
We can recreate this latch for about $500 if we want to. Over here it's no big deal and not much money to do small metal parts like this. In fact, I did find a very very similar latch at a distributers place and they told me that it had been there more than 25 years on the wall. They quoted me a total price of $300 to recreate it and slightly more if I wanted better quality materials.
I don't know why you think the that the latch is magical but I can tell you that it's just a latch and just what happened to be available at the time. Perhaps autos ought to still have hand cranks in the front.
The latch I put on the GTF case is stronger and easier to replace should it break. I think - and of course my opinion is biased - that it goes bester with the form of the case since it is a pair of double ovals. I wanted the latch to have as small an impact on the case as possible.
The easiest thing would have been to have the Fellini latch duplicated. The harder thing was to spend a week going to around 50 latch suppliers looking for all different kinds to find the right one for the case.
8 friggin months later???
The Diary lock is what it is. Not the greatest lock, but the 'right' lock for this type of case. And it does have a slimmer profile than anything else. The look is just right too.
The Diary lock is what it is. Not the greatest lock, but the 'right' lock for this type of case. And it does have a slimmer profile than anything else. The look is just right too.
half fast bankr said:
Well I am slow........ in more ways than one.I just saw the thread had been revived and picked up on your comment. I think that when you made it I had already decided to go away for a while because of the USA/China debate.
I think it's an opinion that it's the right lock for this type of case. I think it just is one that works well for the application and as the original lock that was used on this case by Bob it set the standard for what the lock "ought" to be if someone wants to really copy the case or rebuild one.
With me I asked for the control to change the lock if I felt we had a better one. Maybe I am wrong, I guess when we look back in several years and see how the cases are holding up compared to it's predecessors we will know how well I did.
On future generations of the case a duplicate of the Fellini latch is easy to produce so if that indeed ends up being the latch that is the strongest for this application and it is requested by my clients then that is what will be used.
Sorry for the late reply. As to the other part of your assessment that the case isn't "all that" suitable for housing your cue collection......... how are we doing 8 months later? To date I think most of the reviews by people who own the cases have been really positive. I think that there is a lot of expensive wood being stored in GTF cases at this point. Don't know if you have had a chance to get one in your hands yet but I would be interested in your unvarnished and expert opinion after you have seen a few of the cases.
hejests said:
Bigotry would be saying that I don't want a case made in a slant eyed work shop. No one has said that. I don't think anyone is wrong in questioning a $300.00 price tag when the laborers are paid fair wages and those fair wages are less than a dollar an hour. There is no bigotry in that whatsoever.
John, dude, I'm usually in your corner, man, but these cases are a bit over priced for being made in China. Regardless of how difficult they are to make you're not paying your workers 20 bucks an hour to make them.
MULLY
just an opinion
vin said:
There is no sense to fight this fight. Some folks are just not interested in being a part of a world community. Of course it's ok if people from other countries buy goods that are made in the USA but not if people in the USA purchase goods made elsewhere.
Just a week ago one of my Chinese friends was showing off his new SouthWest. In order for him to afford it his family produces plastic parts for cell phones.
I very much doubt that all of the USA cue makers would trade their overseas sales for no imports. Maybe they would but I doubt it.
Just two days ago I had a pool table manufacturer here ask me to help him to purchase cues from the USA. He wants Joss, Schon, McDermott, and even Predator (thought of as a US brand). He wants to spend around $50,000 for his first purchase.
We live on a ball, commerce and goods doesn't just flow one direction. Americans export their lifestyle in idealism, telling the world that capitalism and democracy go hand in hand. Our movies and television shows and music is consumed voraciously and taken to heart by the rest of the world.
So the rest of the world wants what we have. Now that they are making more money they want to consume as we consume. They want to be as good as the USA. They want to buy the best, they want to build the best.
Two days ago I played with two cues that were made in Taiwan. If I were to send these cues to the USA and let some very knowledgeable collectors and players assess them and play with them then there is NO WAY that they would conclude that the cues were made in Taiwan. That is 100% guaranteed. These cues had all of the quality and hit that any top cue made in the USA has. I guess it helps that the person responsible for getting them built has a large collection of top cues.
Anyway, as always, I ramble. My shoes were made in Germany. Birkenstocks. They are what I like best. Cost me $100 for the sandals and $200 for the shoes. My other shoes are from Wal Mart with Gellin' soles built in. Probably made in China but they are very comfortable and well made. Cost me $20. My wife has dozens of pairs of shoes but the ones she likes best are her Skap sandals. Skap is a brand that is made in China and her sandals cost more than my Birks and are just as well made.
Skap sells leather bags and shoes that are out of this world in design and quality. And IN CHINA in the Skap stores their bags and shoes sell for $200-$500. The quality of this brand is better than just about any leather goods brand I have ever seen anywhere. Why does this matter? It shows that innovation and quality are present here in modern goods. It shows that there is wealth here to afford it and who want the best.
Well, I'll sign off from China. Watching the Olympics on four channels.
its great to have an opinion, in a free country we can all have them. but i dont think people should confuse that with patriotism (i love how you can stick the word patriotism with anything and make it seem good) or insinuate that they are a better american than someone else because they buy shoes made in the united states. theres a little thing called capitalism. there are a lot of united states citizens that couldnt afford to live if they had to buy goods only made here, what does that say??? that the damn CEOs make too much money and politicians have no incentive to make them change.
by the way if you really believe that it is better to buy only goods made in the U.S. and you follow through with that, and i seriously doubt anyone here does, i disagree but i appreciate you following through and caring about this country, better than being apathetic.
nick<--shops at walmart because i'm cheap, plays with a predator, rides a "nishiki" bicycle as transportation, owns a mazda, and am currently typing on a toshiba (this could go on forever)
also as another side note if you want to hear another opinion on problems and solutions check out Mike Gravel, that crazy old man aint so crazy.
by the way if you really believe that it is better to buy only goods made in the U.S. and you follow through with that, and i seriously doubt anyone here does, i disagree but i appreciate you following through and caring about this country, better than being apathetic.
nick<--shops at walmart because i'm cheap, plays with a predator, rides a "nishiki" bicycle as transportation, owns a mazda, and am currently typing on a toshiba (this could go on forever)
also as another side note if you want to hear another opinion on problems and solutions check out Mike Gravel, that crazy old man aint so crazy.
mullyman said:
If they were paid $20 an hour then there is no way that any normal person could ever afford to own a GTF Case.
You act as though you understand what it takes to make this case. That would be like me saying Jimmy Hendrix's riffs are child's play. I know NOTHING about guitars or how to play them.
You can't say "regardless of how difficult they are to make" because you don't know how difficult they are to make. You know I like you too but this statement is patently illogical. Labor is only one aspect of the price of goods.
How many hours do you think it takes to make one of these cases? What do you think that they should cost?
I will be more than happy to lower the price on the GTF cases if you or anyone else can come here and produce them in the volume and quality that I did them for a lower price. In fact, IF the cases are overpriced then that just leaves the door open for ALL the other companies in the billiard industry to jump in and compete with lower priced offerings.
If this case is "overpriced" as you put it then what does that say for cases which are much easier to make and also come from China and are priced in the same class?
The point is that no one knows what the production price is and no one should care. Do you ask other case makers what their production cost is to determine whether their price is "too high" or not? Do you care what Ron Thomas or Mike Roberts spends to make a case? It doesn't matter if the GTF case costs $5 or $150 to make, it doesn't matter if the GTF Case Company is making $300 profit or $50 profit per case. All that matters is whether the quality is there for the price that they are asking?
Believe me there is plenty of bigotry in these discussions. I agree that people can make their buying decisions based on their personal convictions. If they think that the wages in China are not fair then their choice can be to not purchase goods made in China, thus denying Chinese people any opportunity to achieve better living conditions, denying them opportunity to achieve more skills and be in a position to demand and get higher wages. But the truth is that most people don't even begin to understand the socio-economic impact of their purchasing decisions.
Industry will always go where labor is cheaper until there is no cheap labor to be had. Even in the USA companies move their production to different states that have lower labor, non-union labor, tax breaks, government support. All this in the name of lowering costs and raising profit.
None of us spend our time figuring out the "fair profit margin/fair wage" factor for the companies that we buy goods from. If any one says that they do this then they are lying. This only comes into play when someone wants to wrap themselves in the flag and get on the "hot button" issue of nationalism.
The fact is that fair wages are dependent on there being employment in the first place. If there is no employer then there are no wages, fair or otherwise. Since the industrial revolution the cycle has been that industry moves to low priced labor until labor develops sufficient skill and education to demand higher prices. At that point industry either mechanizes or moves on to a lower priced labor pool.
You want a fair wage?
A prominent American billiard supplier employed a single woman. This woman came in with several year's worth of experience. They paid her $22,000 a year. She revolutionized their business. She brought them millions in sales. Each year she was doing 1.2 million in sales. The same company then brought in a complete newbie who didn't have any background in billiards, no experience in sales, and paid her the same amount as the star salesperson. Then the company refused to allow the star salesperson to go on commission only. Then when the star sales person was in an auto accident and had to go to physical therapy a few days a week, they fired her for missing work. Even though she was still doing more revenue than anyone else despite missing a few days a week.
There are millions of Americans who barely get by with low wages, inadequate or non-existent insurance and zero benefits. No one goes into the gas station before they buy gas and asks the attendant if they are making a "fair" wage. Or who asks the teacher who is making $20,000 a year whether their wage is fair? Or who determined that the CEO of GE should get $20 million a year as a fair wage?
So please, let's get off this false soapbox about fair wages. None of them are fair. They are arbitrary based on supply and demand only. No one has the RIGHT to any wage at all. You have the RIGHT to seek the highest paid employment you can get and the RIGHT to move to other employment that is willing to pay more. Even in China every person has that right and if anyone denies them that right then they are doing so in violation of Chinese law, just as anyone who denies the same right to an American is in violation of US law.
CocoboloCowboy said:
Over here in China the Major brands are Ford, Chrysler, GMC, Buick (very big status symbol), Jeep, Hummer, Dodge.
The major brand of Heavy Equipment is Caterpillar with some John Deere as well.
The largest chain of fast food restaurants is McDonalds, followed by Pizza Hut, Taco Bell, Subway, Wendy's and Burger King.
The most popular brand of soft drink in China is Coca Cola, followed by Minute Maid Orange (owned by Coke), with Pepsi, 7-Up, Sprite, and Red Bull right up there.
Nestle and Proctor and Gamble are here selling Colgate toothpaste, Pantene shampoo, Head and Shoulders, and dozens of other American brands.
Clinique cosmetics cost 4x in China what they cost in the USA.
Black and Decker and Stanley are sought after tools with plenty of shops representing them.
The most popular candy is Hershey's Chocolates, Snickers, M&Ms.
And the list goes on......all the big companies and brands are multi-national. As we move east with our brands and products they move west with theirs. It's only fair play.
As someone said we are waging a war to promote capitalism and along with it consumerism, and America is winning it as everyone wants to be like Americans with a big house filled with lots of toys.
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How in the flip did this thread come back up?
Who bent over to resuscitate this dead horse?
And JB, are you kidding? Buicks are status symbols?????!
I smell a business venture a brewin', cuz I can get you a shitload of those, LOL!
Who bent over to resuscitate this dead horse?
And JB, are you kidding? Buicks are status symbols?????!
I smell a business venture a brewin', cuz I can get you a shitload of those, LOL!
JB, just read your response to my 8 friggin months later post. I wasn't addressing you, I was just throwing that out there like "who had something to say on a thread from 8 months ago". I believe it was grumpy that revived it, not sure why though.
JB Cases said:
You know John what I see above is sad, as (2) of my favorite shows on T.V. are No Reservations, and Bizarre Food, both on Travel Channel. When i see the foods, and Culture of Asia I want to come visit, and experience the life style, foods, and not a clone of the USA.
John,I love the GTF cases,they are simple,sleek,classy and seem like they would be very durable and when I have enough change I certainly will get one.It doesn't matter to me that its made in China,your artisans are talented and from what I know of you being a decent guy I am sure you treat your employees well.Do they come in 2 by 4 by the way? :smile:
I dont know
Personally, I think that its not bigotry but patriotism unless you add the whole racism thing...ethnocentrism maybe. I agree with Nick, I shop at walmart among other places because they are not only cheap, but the only source around. I looked into GTF and others, I would buy a Thomas before a GTF...because it is just as nice and helps out American and keep the money circulating here. I do own two Japanese cars but with a family I had to go with the best crash test ratings first, and then price / performance next and the Toyota and Nissans I own just simply outclass the American stuff. However, we a talking about cue cases here and cues...people will buy what they like and what is good...if a GTF case is the same price as a Thomas, likely buy the Thomas, if the GTF is as good and cheaper, well then it might be considered. I looked at both of those cases...and decided to go with new old stock Brunswick made by Its George from
kchighendcues
He has 100s of these in 2x4 and 1x2
I personally think the Fellini, Kelli, Engles, George, Thomas, GTF cases are the best style for protection due to the lid seal. Anyway, where is the conversation after 13 pages, nowhere really. The economy is bad, I hope it gets better for everyone's sake!
Personally, I think that its not bigotry but patriotism unless you add the whole racism thing...ethnocentrism maybe. I agree with Nick, I shop at walmart among other places because they are not only cheap, but the only source around. I looked into GTF and others, I would buy a Thomas before a GTF...because it is just as nice and helps out American and keep the money circulating here. I do own two Japanese cars but with a family I had to go with the best crash test ratings first, and then price / performance next and the Toyota and Nissans I own just simply outclass the American stuff. However, we a talking about cue cases here and cues...people will buy what they like and what is good...if a GTF case is the same price as a Thomas, likely buy the Thomas, if the GTF is as good and cheaper, well then it might be considered. I looked at both of those cases...and decided to go with new old stock Brunswick made by Its George from
kchighendcues
He has 100s of these in 2x4 and 1x2
I personally think the Fellini, Kelli, Engles, George, Thomas, GTF cases are the best style for protection due to the lid seal. Anyway, where is the conversation after 13 pages, nowhere really. The economy is bad, I hope it gets better for everyone's sake!
I have no use for a case smaller than a 2x4 and I need pockets to carry my extra items (hand towel, tip tapper, my jump cue butt, etc.).our_auctionguy said:
I don't know anyone in my area who would need a plain 1x2 case with no pockets, strap, or handle, but there must be a market for them or they wouldn't be making the cases.
James
CocoboloCowboy said:
Anthony Bordain Rocks!!! you could spend the rest of your life in China and not eat at the same place twice!!
I dont think you would have to worry about it being "Americanized" There is no problem here finding the "Mom & Pop" Restaurants in the US, It would be the same there.
I love having all the toys but I am not a fan of the American "Fast Food" culture.