The Best Cue Case Period

[JB Cases]

I don't have a Ron Thomas case but I have seen a few and they look very sharp. These cases look equally nice but I would choose a Ron Thomas case over these for a couple reasons... one is that every Ron Thomas case is made by Ron Thomas, am I right in this assumption? If I can get a hand crafted case by an expert case maker such as Ron Thomas why would I be inclined to purchase one made overseas for the same price, even if the quality is identical?

What if the quality is better? If quality is the only criteria then if two things are equally priced the one with a higher quality has more value.

I would be tempted to buy one of these if they were cheaper than a Ron Thomas case, and the quality was the same. I think a lot of people would buy these if they were $200 and under. I'd personally rather spend the extra $100 to have it built here and customized to my specs and guarantee the quality.

Well as I said if the quality is better then they are in fact less expensive than a Thomas. But that will be something for those who can inspect both brands side by side to compare for themselves. Personally I have done so and am quite confident that the GTF case will do very well in head to head comparisons with all other brands in this style.

As to the customization aspect I think you will find when the GTF website goes live that you will have a plethora of customization options including some of the world's best tooling that will certainly appease most desires in this style of case.

Still though, you won't be talking to me, the case maker and I won't be the one personally making your case. So in that respect Ron Thomas would be the guy to go to since he is still the only person I know if who makes this style of case in the USA. Getting it directly from the maker is a huge plus for some people and I encourage it. Personally I hope that Ron ends up with more business than he can handle through the fact that GTF is going to make this style popular again.

From reading a lot of the comments on here it's seems most people are not in favor of the cases. Personally when I read the opening thread all I could think of was this...

"This guy is setting up a shop in China to produce cases signficantly cheaper than he can here so he can make enormous profits. The cases are being hyped up to be then next great thing but are prolly average."

I thought the same thing. I probably would not have gone with "The Best Case Period" idea myself. But I can tell you that the folks who have hired me are among the most knowledgeable and well respected in the world of collectible cues and cue making and they are the ones who judged my work to be fit for them to promote. So even if I wouldn't have gone straight to the top with the description I certainly can see where they feel this way.

I know this may not be what all people thought when they read it but that's what I thought. I'm betting by the responses though that a lot of people agree with me.

Usually when I buy products I want the best I can get with what money I can afford to spend. The simple fact is that many countries are good at making different things. China and Japan make good reliable cars and excellent electronics. That's just the plain truth. So when I shop for electronics I usually buy a product from one of the Asian countries. Cues and cases I think we all agree that the US has a monopoly on the market... because they are the best, simply put. So, that's where my money goes and will continue to go.

The USA does not have a monopoly on good billiard products. There are world class cues and cases and tables and cloth and balls made in Germany, Italy, Spain, Belgium, Japan, Taiwan, Korea, China, Brazil, and well all over the world. How many of you play with a Predator shaft, and a Moori tip, on Simonis cloth, with Aramith balls? Anyone own a Longoni case? How about a EuroWest cue? Good products are made by good people who happen to be located wherever they are. America did not make George Balabushka, a Russian immigrant, into a great cuemaker, he was a great maker of great products before ever setting foot on American soil. Had he never come to America then it's likely he would have been a well sought after cabinetmaker in Russia.

Anyway, this is all just stream of consciousness... Jim

Sorry to interrupt the flow

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

I think in the end the consumer will determine if the New GTF Cases are superior, inferior, or worth the price asked for the Cases.

I also am sure by the time the Allen Hopkins Show arrive that case will have pass through the hands of some connoisseurs of cases, and maybe the case will be offered for sale at the Hopkins.

After that there will be discussion by those who have actually seen, touched, and looking over the GTF Cases with a critical eye.

Than the consumer will determine if the New GTF Cases are superior, inferior, or worth the price asked for the Cases. If they are a failure the price will drop, and the GTF Cases go away. If the GTF Cases are everything John says they are they will be on backorder.

 

[JB Cases]

I think that the pictures showed so little of the case that it's not possible to make any kind of judgement. Screw the politics... but I'll join a group who promotes buying from local craftsmen especially given that it does appear that the Chinese craftsmen who make these cases might be being denied a fair percentage of the profit.

I am not real sure where this comes from. Since when do we really care who gets what percentage of the profit?

I guess the question what does this have to do with the price of tea in China? fits here.

I also promote buying from a local craftsman. When the local guy does the job you want for the price you want then he's the best choice no question. And if something is wrong you can drive over and wring his neck.

However for someone in California, buy from someone in Texas or Illinois is the same thing. If both parties have similar products and one has a better value through better quality or better service before and after the sale then one should buy from the seller who offers the best value.

As for whether the people making the cases are sharing in the profit equally? Of course they aren't. They are also not sharing in the costs equally. Why does this always turn into an economics lesson when it comes to China and Asian products. No one questions whether Aramith's factory workers are sharing in the profit equally, nor is anyone protesting Simonis' profit margins, or even questioning them for that matter.

Would you be willing to pay the full price if you knew that x-percent of the profits were going to the factory employees?

Does anyone have any idea what it "costs" to make a case? Or a cue? Is there some kind of fair profit index that case and cuemakers should adhere to? Who is the arbiter of this? Are Schon and McDermott's employees sharing in the profit? I'd be willing to bet that the medical coverage for the Chinese staff who works on the GTF cases is better than what the staff at McDermott and Schon have. And I say this having been privy to the medical coverage that some prominent companies in the billiard industry provide.

I think the idea of worrying about who along the chain is profiting equally is a red herring. We don't worry about that in our daily lives with all the things we consume and we shouldn't start now unless we are willing to walk the walk in all aspects of our lives.

 

[Craig Fales]

Although I appreciate the Buy American sentiment, I just can't imagine carrying around a case with no handles or strap.

Or a pouch for that matter....

 

[hangemhigh]

Oh boy! JB & Straight, firstly, let me say congratualtions on the new cases. They look great from the sneek peeks!

Secondly, let's get down to the nasty. JB and I had a little conversation about this on the 'supermac redone' thread. I know how to make these cases, and have, so I hope my opinion will be taken with at least a shot of saki along with that lonely grain of salt. Truth be told, most of the work involved in making these cases (Fellini's only, not addressing the Centennial's at all in this thread) is, well, mokey work. It can be taught to anyone, and performed reasonably well by anyone also. The toughest part is without a doubt, the ends. Nextly, would be hardware placing and attachment. However, I will admit your interiours may be very complicated as I have not seen them yet.

Either way, the appeal of these cases was never craftsmanship as Bob's cases were often poorly done. The appeal was I believe firstly, the sexy, simple and yet elegant design. Next was the 'custom handmade' aspect. Couple this with the fact that some of the hottest custom cuemakers of days gone by were actually pairing their cues to these cases before the customer ever took delivery, and the legend began.

Thridly, I too considered this venture. After proto's, I went as far as pricing production in foreign lands (Asia & S. America). The reason was likely the same as yours, cost. Although the numbers were attractive, I did not plan on a large operation. Thusly, that idea was out. Also, I decided these cases would be better appreciated if made by hand, and for the most part, by one man (in the spirit of Hemphil, which was my entire motivation anyway). Yet I digress, I have abandoned my point. The significantly lower production cost should be reflected in the final sales price.

Fourthly, as my cases were in similar fashion to be a tribute to our casing forefathers, I refused to proceed without the appropriate hardware. Yes, I'm talking about that damned lock. Or, sprung double hasp if you will. For me, that was the deal breaker, and to the apparent dismay of many AZers, is also the reason I've not even considered purchasing a Thomas, Engles or the likes. However, I could have gotten them custom made to exact specs, in China. Prob was minimum order was something like 5,000 units. (anybody wanna go in on some locks? ). Either way, IMHO, gotta have that lock!

Fifthly, and finally, all this BS about foreign this and that should halt. Any fool making these statements should take time to reflect on how many things you may use or own that are made in China or the likes. Really, it's quite silly to take out your issues on a small time cue case maker when you should be out picketing Wal-Mart or ANY one of the fortune 10,000 companies. And you thought your priorities were in order. And this is coming from someone so patriotic he cannot wait until the next civil war! This nation needs help, and it starts in DC, not a case maker in China.

Alright, let the onslaught begin. Everybody pile on the new guy!

Lastly, good lookin' cases, fella's!

Half Fast,
You mean a lock like these?

 

[The Beginner]

MERRY CHRISTMAS AND HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[JB Cases]

MERRY CHRISTMAS AND HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree. Merry Christmas to and Happy Everyday to all.

Here are two others that are made in China which I am very proud of.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

 

[Kevin Lindstrom]

a couple of questions

Additional information! These cases are being made in collaboration with John Barton in Xiamen, China. The center for Chinese artisans and craftsmen. These cases are not chinese knock offs. These are made by artists and are functional art made to John's high quality standards. Our artisans are paid fair wages and our expectation is that every case will be perfect. No expense has been spared. Nothing cheap about these cases. A number of AZers have had the opportunity to inspect these cases and the general opinion has be amazing. We will be posting more pictures, tops, bottoms and interiors.

How soon can we expect to see more pictures of the tops, bottoms and interiors? In addition how soon will these be available to the general public?

 

[jayman]

Some of these "patriotic" posts are trully shameful. It's just thinly vailed bigotry maskerading as patriotism. Bigotry is bigotry period. There's no justification and no excuse for it.

I understand that ppl may not want to purchase these cases from overseas because of the economics involved. That's reasonable. Some of these posts though are clearly not motivated by economics but rather just plain and simple bigotry. It's just shameful in this day and age.

No! its a shame that there is very little manufacturing being done in america anymore, because these guys would rather line their pockets with as much cash as possile, no matter where it comes from, and at what cost to the well being of our very unique oasis that is AMERICA.
the steel mills are gone, the textile industry is dead, china owns most of americas debt!
corprate greed has transferred the working class jobs from america to sweat shops over seas. only to ship it all back here, make a killing on the spread and try to put a non sweat shop american buisness, out of buisness (ala walmart) causing a further decline in american industry.
China is not our friend! they do love us though!
maybe when you'r kids graduate high school they can go to china and work in a sweat shop? i haer thers plenty of blue collar jobs there.

The biggest shame is we keep buying this stuff! That wanting to save the american middle class from extentsion, due to companys that do not care what so ever what is good or bad for this wonderful country of ours is labeled by pc. sheep, as "biggotry". no biggotry just very very sick of it!

 

[Drawman623]

My car is one thing... my case is totally another

I use foreign made products...some of the clothing I wear, the truck I drive and the GPS unit inside it. Japanese manufacturing culture puts its pride in its quality, not its profit. I feel good driving a foreign car because over the years, I have come to trust in Japanese quality. IMO, their autos are better, drive longer and cost less to own. I still regret that I have come to this belief, but nothing has changed it in the last 20 years.

Thomas makes a case to be proud of. Whitten builds a case to be proud of. If I can own comperable quality for the same or a slightly smaller investment overseas, I will not do so. It appears to me, Mr Barton, that you are offering a solution to a non-existant problem. You must IMPROVE on Mr Thomas work...then we can talk. Matching it for a little less does not woo me (or wu me) to leave my country's artisans so easily. I see the pride in their workmanship, they graciously share their passion for quality with me, and their prices are still reasonable. I would rather pay the starving artist a profit than the wealthy importer of that art. Call me a bigot if you want, but don't say my consumer loyalty is for sale to the lowest bidder. If you feel that it is, you should re-read the last 50 posts or so. One should not underestimate the American value of patriotism, or misconstrue the difference between an artisan and a manufacturer.

 

[ShootingArts]

we do care

It has been proven over and over that the US public does care about people exploiting workers, as more than one high fashion label has found out. Why should we care? For the same reasons we care when we see an animal abused or a hungry child, we have been brought up to care. In the final analysis it doesn't matter why we should care or even if we should care, it is a reality that any business must face that we, as a whole, do care.

For the record, I avoid doing business with companies that exploit their workers here in the US as much as possible too. That definitely means Wal-Mart and UPS as examples. I also try to avoid buying from US entities that have different political, moral, or ethical beliefs than I do and use my money to further their position. They have every right to their choices, I have every right to make my choice not to support them and their efforts. It is called voting with your pocketbook and I strongly recommend everyone doing it even if their views don't agree with mine. It is a very personal and effective way to make your voice heard. If you talk to other people about what you are doing you can increase the power of your pocketbook even more. Get out and vote in elections but vote every time you open your wallet too.

Hu

 

[ShootingArts]

Where was your truck made?

Where was your truck made? Most sold here are made here by US workers or perhaps here and in Canada or Mexico. Few were actually made in Japan.

A bit of silliness from years ago: Japan did something that annoyed many of us so a town canceled their order for Kubota heavy equipment and bought from John Deere instead. The Kubota equipment was made in the US, the John Deere in Japan. Things are often not what they seem.

Hu

I use foreign made products...some of the clothing I wear, the truck I drive and the GPS unit inside it. Japanese manufacturing culture puts its pride in its quality, not its profit. I feel good driving a foreign car because over the years, I have come to trust in Japanese quality. IMO, their autos are better, drive longer and cost less to own. I still regret that I have come to this belief, but nothing has changed it in the last 20 years.

 

[hejests]

No! its a shame that there is very little manufacturing being done in america anymore, because these guys would rather line their pockets with as much cash as possile, no matter where it comes from, and at what cost to the well being of our very unique oasis that is AMERICA.
the steel mills are gone, the textile industry is dead, china owns most of americas debt!
corprate greed has transferred the working class jobs from america to sweat shops over seas. only to ship it all back here, make a killing on the spread and try to put a non sweat shop american buisness, out of buisness (ala walmart) causing a further decline in american industry.
China is not our friend! they do love us though!
maybe when you'r kids graduate high school they can go to china and work in a sweat shop? i haer thers plenty of blue collar jobs there.

The biggest shame is we keep buying this stuff! That wanting to save the american middle class from extentsion, due to companys that do not care what so ever what is good or bad for this wonderful country of ours is labeled by pc. sheep, as "biggotry". no biggotry just very very sick of it!

If you want to advocate a protectionist stance that's fine, you have every right to your own politicial & economic ideologies as we all do. I have no problem whatosever with that, but I do have a problem with this for obvious reasons:

Ummm,..
Why dont you and you'r cases go to china, and stay there. fuc off.

 

[DrJ]

..........

 

[jayman]

If you want to advocate a protectionist stance that's fine, you have every right to your own politicial & economic ideologies as we all do. I have no problem whatosever with that, but I do have a problem with this for obvious reasons:

Point made, and taken. I truly apolagize for that. I should not have worded my sentiment quite that way. Sorry for the poor choice of words.

Jayman.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

Last question would be when will the Cue Cases be offered for sale, by who, or what company will be retailing them, is the distributor going to have a web-site show all the variations, color combinations, etc.?

 

[cashin]

This post is right on.. The excuse they are using to make these cases in China, are the same excuses the politicians and the corporate elites are using to sell out the middle class in America. The almighty dollar.. regardless if it means selling out the American worker...

No! its a shame that there is very little manufacturing being done in america anymore, because these guys would rather line their pockets with as much cash as possile, no matter where it comes from, and at what cost to the well being of our very unique oasis that is AMERICA.
the steel mills are gone, the textile industry is dead, china owns most of americas debt!
corprate greed has transferred the working class jobs from america to sweat shops over seas. only to ship it all back here, make a killing on the spread and try to put a non sweat shop american buisness, out of buisness (ala walmart) causing a further decline in american industry.
China is not our friend! they do love us though!
maybe when you'r kids graduate high school they can go to china and work in a sweat shop? i haer thers plenty of blue collar jobs there.

The biggest shame is we keep buying this stuff! That wanting to save the american middle class from extentsion, due to companys that do not care what so ever what is good or bad for this wonderful country of ours is labeled by pc. sheep, as "biggotry". no biggotry just very very sick of it!

 

[rogerb]

These look like very fine cases indeed but if you want American Giuseppe cases are 100% made in the USA and come with a lifetime warranty against manufacturer defects. I just bought this same case from this seller from ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/Giuseppe-3-Butt...ryZ21211QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I would much rather save on the case and have more money left for what goes in it. Also don't know how much thought ya'll give to traveling , but cues are a TSA prohibited carry on (I worked for TSA for 18 months) , ever see what expensive Hartmann luggage looks like after a few flights ?

 

[ridewiththewind]

I would much rather save on the case and have more money left for what goes in it. Also don't know how much thought ya'll give to traveling , but cues are a TSA prohibited carry on (I worked for TSA for 18 months) , ever see what expensive Hartmann luggage looks like after a few flights ?

I am in no way knocking Guiseppe, or anyone else for that matter...however, if you are going to own a decent cue, that is to become your best friend at the table, it deserves to be in a decent case.

With that said...a low quality case may save you money in the short-term, but the damage that your cue can sustain in one of these types of cases could ultimately cost you much more in the long-term.

I am still of the firm belief that one of THE best high quality, high protection, reasonably priced cases available on the market is the Premier line of InStroke cases. I have two that I have now had for almost 8 years now, and they are still as good as the day I bought them...and I am not kind to these cases. One of them sits empty and unused...but I will not part with it...it's just that good a case...and my original investment in the case was under $100, including shipping. Now that is what I call a pretty darn fine case.

As to airline travel with a cue case...there is plenty that can be done to protect a case...one just needs to be creative. Myself...I never fly with cues, so no worries!

Lisa