The Biggest reason Lower level players can't improve ????

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
After teaching for about the last 12 years, 5 of which I stayed on the road for 5 years, I have come to a very definite conclusion. Over 3,000 documented lessons finding and correcting dominant eyes while aiming a pool shot.

Most lower level players are opposite eye dominant. The reason they struggle so much with their game is the sights on the gun are crooked.

Example: Let's say you are right handed, left eye dominant. Even though you are right handed the cue would be a little to the left of your nose somewhere to see the shot most correctly. Like lining up the sights on a gun.

Because the cue is in the right hand, the right eye is on the right side and the shot looks good in the preshot, Right or left eye dominant, the player is starting out in the right eye dominant position and never gets over to where the shot looks the best at all or hardly ever.

Once this is corrected the results are off the charts for lower level players. The difference is like night and day. I have seen this over and over, from pool hall to pool hall.

This is something that nobody has ever totally figured out ever. How the eyes actually work while aiming a pool shot.

This is the main reason that many players stay at a lower level. 3's and 4's stay 3's and 4's forever.

Once a player rated a 3 learns how to get the eyes correct it is almost impossible to stay at a 3 level. The results are usually pretty drastic and for the better.
 

drv4

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I was lucky, right handed, right eye dominant. Maybe after seeing something from you or someone posting a snooker eye dominance video when I first started playing 7 years ago, helped me to realize I needed my cue slightly to the right of my chin, as opposed to right under the middle of my chin as I thought would be best.

I do agree, sighting right is important, as wells a solid repeatable stance and stroke and bridge. However after starting as a 3 and within 2 years of playing one night a week in league moving to a 7, I think most people don’t get better because they don’t want to put in any extra work to get better. I am Uber competitive. I didn’t want to stay a 3, yet people in my league had been 3s for 10+ years because they make the same mistakes over and over. Don’t learn any basic cue ball control. Don’t understand the difference between a sliding cue ball and rolling cue ball, etc...
 

Dead Money

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
After teaching for about the last 12 years, 5 of which I stayed on the road for 5 years, I have come to a very definite conclusion. Over 3,000 documented lessons finding and correcting dominant eyes while aiming a pool shot.

Most lower level players are opposite eye dominant. The reason they struggle so much with their game is the sights on the gun are crooked.

Example: Let's say you are right handed, left eye dominant. Even though you are right handed the cue would be a little to the left of your nose somewhere to see the shot most correctly. Like lining up the sights on a gun.

Because the cue is in the right hand, the right eye is on the right side and the shot looks good in the preshot, Right or left eye dominant, the player is starting out in the right eye dominant position and never gets over to where the shot looks the best at all or hardly ever.

Once this is corrected the results are off the charts for lower level players. The difference is like night and day. I have seen this over and over, from pool hall to pool hall.

This is something that nobody has ever totally figured out ever. How the eyes actually work while aiming a pool shot.

This is the main reason that many players stay at a lower level. 3's and 4's stay 3's and 4's forever.

Once a player rated a 3 learns how to get the eyes correct it is almost impossible to stay at a 3 level. The results are usually pretty drastic and for the better.

Good to see you are still around doing your thing Geno!
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Can you imagine how many deer you would get going deer hunting with crooked sight on the gun? This is what these players are experiencing.
 

Deruki

Banned
Gold Member
After teaching for about the last 12 years, 5 of which I stayed on the road for 5 years, I have come to a very definite conclusion. Over 3,000 documented lessons finding and correcting dominant eyes while aiming a pool shot.

Most lower level players are opposite eye dominant. The reason they struggle so much with their game is the sights on the gun are crooked.

Example: Let's say you are right handed, left eye dominant. Even though you are right handed the cue would be a little to the left of your nose somewhere to see the shot most correctly. Like lining up the sights on a gun.

Because the cue is in the right hand, the right eye is on the right side and the shot looks good in the preshot, Right or left eye dominant, the player is starting out in the right eye dominant position and never gets over to where the shot looks the best at all or hardly ever.

Once this is corrected the results are off the charts for lower level players. The difference is like night and day. I have seen this over and over, from pool hall to pool hall.

This is something that nobody has ever totally figured out ever. How the eyes actually work while aiming a pool shot.

This is the main reason that many players stay at a lower level. 3's and 4's stay 3's and 4's forever.

Once a player rated a 3 learns how to get the eyes correct it is almost impossible to stay at a 3 level. The results are usually pretty drastic and for the better.

Wouldn't it be grand if it were only this simple?

Lower level players stay there for a variety of reasons. Not aiming straight is way down on the list. Particularly for 3s and 4s. They have no stance, they have no stroke, they have no pre shot routine, they have no plan. In short they have no solid fundamentals. And then they often have booze and dope to boot.

And they generally have no inclination to change any of that. The reason the people you help improve rapidly is partly because of what you show them about their eyes but mostly because they do have an inclination to get better which is why you met them to begin with.
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I did this for the first 3 months of teaching.

Make a circle with your finger and thumb and look through at an object across the room. Close each eye until the object is still visible through the circle. The open eye is dominant.

In fact it is still on my original video. Pointing and looking thru a circle to find the dominant eye.

Here's the problem. it doesn't work for everyone? And that's a problem if you are going to try and help someone play better pool.

I would do this test at the start of the lesson and the player would get down with the cue under the other eye. I would try to move them over and they would but they would shoot even worse and eventually I would go with the other eye and it would work like magic. This test just flat out doesn't work.

OK, it works for 50% of the people. Like flipping a coin.

Once I saw this i went to an eye doctor thinking they must know. The Dr told me of course it worked. Now i was confused. Why was i getting these bad results with this test if it works?

Not giving up I went to 3 more eye doctors and they all said the same thing.

Finally, I went to one more. When I asked the question he looked right at me and said it doesn't work. I asked him how he knew? He learned this a long time ago he said from an eye doctor that just knew for sure. He said eye dominance only matters when you are close enough to go cross-eyed. From a distance, it makes almost no difference. that is why we all drive cars so well because at a distance eye dominance does not really matter. If it did it would not be safe to drive a car on the road.

I then asked him why these other eye doctors told me the test worked. He replied, How many dominant eyes do they need to find to put a pair of glasses on your face so you can see good. I told him zero. He said EXACTLY. They just think it works. Just like so many other people.

Then he told me that I was more of an expert than they are because you can actually figure out which eye is dominant by getting them in position and moving back and forth. One way looks better and the other looks a little cock-eyed.

Since then, 9 years ago, I have extremely perfected this process. I have to find which eye is dominant or there is absolutely no chance of improvement. Once the sights are correct the stance gets in the right place along with the stroke. Everything just falls into place. Then I just have to show them how to stand a little different so the stance and stroke are matched up with the dominant eye position.

I couldn't tell you the number of times over the past 10 years that I have asked the player which eye is the dominant eye and they tell me the wrong one. I ask them why they think that? They hold out their finger or look thru a circle and tell me how this works. 15 minutes later they know that the test didn't work for them and the other eye is the dominant eye for sure.

I have even had players that would swear that they are right eye dominant and they only shoot under the left eye just like John Morra.
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Main rerason, the sights are crooked.

Wouldn't it be grand if it were only this simple?

Lower level players stay there for a variety of reasons. Not aiming straight is way down on the list. Particularly for 3s and 4s. They have no stance, they have no stroke, they have no pre shot routine, they have no plan. In short they have no solid fundamentals. And then they often have booze and dope to boot.

And they generally have no inclination to change any of that. The reason the people you help improve rapidly is partly because of what you show them about their eyes but mostly because they do have an inclination to get better which is why you met them to begin with.

You are so totally wrong on this. Nothing works if you can't hit the ball correctly. Whichever eye is your dominant eye, just move the stick under the other one and tell me this again. That this is way down on the list. Don't just think it but do it. You will see that you have trouble making the ball and the shape or english is just rediculous to try and control. Fundamentals are totally out of the question when the shot looks so bad.

I have taught it and lived it and have seen it thousands of times. I'm 100% correct on this. Not even debatable. It's a given.

I don't think 3's and 4's are all drunks and dopers. I know drunks and dopers that are 7's and 8's and 9's. They would play better if they stayed straight. Hard to get your fundamentals right when you can't hardly see the shot good enough to feel confident it's lined up correctly.
 

straightline

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm of the "it's the stroke stupid" school so I rather think most players that don't progress simply don't GAF. There's a lot of invisible refinement that goes into consistency that they'll never get to; let alone do.
 

David in FL

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I’m not a qualified pool instructor, far from it, but the same applies to firearms training, in which I am highly qualified. Only about 30% of the population is cross dominant. There’s a lot more to people who can’t/don’t improve, than that. Mostly revolving around desire and effort..
 
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jtaylor996

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I always thought I had eye dominance issues and general eyesight issues holding me back.

Then I got a lesson from CJ and he kept asking me “why are you shutting one eye to check aim?” “Why are you so visual”.

He was really on to something. What was holding me back was much simpler. My stance sucked and I needed to work on the basic techniques and do nothing but that before moving on.

I play better now in a dark room with no glasses/contacts than I ever did before because I can learn and adjust after every shot. Any everything is consistent now.

I was trying to build a skyscraper from the 10th floor up before pouring the foundation. Nothing I did worked. Random in, random out.
 

MattPoland

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think the biggest reason is because most lower level players either don’t own a table at home or don’t use it much.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

Deruki

Banned
Gold Member
You are so totally wrong on this. Nothing works if you can't hit the ball correctly. Whichever eye is your dominant eye, just move the stick under the other one and tell me this again. That this is way down on the list. Don't just think it but do it. You will see that you have trouble making the ball and the shape or english is just rediculous to try and control. Fundamentals are totally out of the question when the shot looks so bad.

I have taught it and lived it and have seen it thousands of times. I'm 100% correct on this. Not even debatable. It's a given.

I don't think 3's and 4's are all drunks and dopers. I know drunks and dopers that are 7's and 8's and 9's. They would play better if they stayed straight. Hard to get your fundamentals right when you can't hardly see the shot good enough to feel confident it's lined up correctly.

I took a lesson from you on the phone when you were laid up from the accident and subsequently purchased your DVD. I did not make a quantum leap in my game until I took some in person instruction and improved the fundamentals I mentioned in my other post. Of course confidence of potting improves other things but nothing gets far with poor fundamentals. I don't care if you can see a field mouse from a cliff a mile away if your stroke can't deliver the cue ball to it you're not eating.
 

longhorns2

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I disagree with the entire dominant eye philosophy. I agree that there is a dominant eye, but the idea that you have to have it over the cue, or in the same place every time is wrong imo. As long as you can visualize where the object ball and cue ball are gonna go, that's all that matters. I think everyone would be better off not obsessing about dominant eyes and just getting the head in a comfortable position. From there, practice and get used to what the shots look like
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It looks impossible to them.

I’m not a qualified pool instructor, far from it, but the same applies to firearms training, in which I am highly qualified. Only about 30% of the population is cross dominant. There’s a lot more to people who can’t/don’t improve, than that. Mostly revolving around desire and effort..

Hi David, If you had the experiences that I have had teaching this you would understand. They have no chance to get better because they just feel like they are pushing the cue ball in the general direction. One this is corrected they are off to the races. Now they can actually improve.
 

genomachino

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Good luck with that my friend.

I disagree with the entire dominant eye philosophy. I agree that there is a dominant eye, but the idea that you have to have it over the cue, or in the same place every time is wrong imo. As long as you can visualize where the object ball and cue ball are gonna go, that's all that matters. I think everyone would be better off not obsessing about dominant eyes and just getting the head in a comfortable position. From there, practice and get used to what the shots look like

You don't know what you don't know until you learn what you didn't know. This is the holy grail of seeing every shot correctly. 10 minutes with me at a table and you would agree.
 
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