Here's a graphic I posted some years ago about what I suggest calling various degrees of draw.
pj
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View attachment 39218
The Draw Drag Shot
- Thread starter 336Robin
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pj
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View attachment 39218
I was being a little facetious with that comment, but I think there's some truth in it. Every draw shot loses that draw over a distance. And every draw shot slows down more than a follow shot. Therefore every draw shot is a draw drag, whether people intend it to be or not.
Another shot I like to use it for is let's say you have an OB about a foot from the corner pocket and you want to cut it into the corner but leave the CB right where the OB was. If you need to cut it to the right you would use low left and draw drag the shot but hit the OB full. The draw has worn off by the time the CB reaches the OB and all that's left is a lot of left spin, this throws the OB to the right into the corner pocket and since you hit the OB full it also kills the CB. The angle on the OB to the pocket can't be too great or it won't work but you'd be surprised how far it can be thrown, also it appears, and I know Dr Dave will say it's not possible, that the OB is actually traveling faster than the CB that threw it....probably one of those 'time space continuum' things
What I find really interesting in this game, is that for any given straight-in shot, (say the CB and OB have 4-feet between them) there are numerous different speeds that the CB can be hit, and numerous different vertical points on the CB that the CB can be contacted (between dead center and max 6 o-clock draw without miscuing), which can all still lead to the exact same result - a stop shot.
Yes, or a stun-runthrough, or a small amount of draw, or lots of other straight-in shots too.
But as you say, different tip/ball contact points require different speeds to produce the same straight-in result, so the same principle doesn't work for cut shots because the after-collision travel distance changes.
I know you didn't suggest it works the same for cut shots; just adding the comment.
pj
chgo
I think it was Mark Wilson when he was leading the Mosconi Team, he had a drill or game where the players would execute a stop shot on the cue ball, and he would radar the speed of the object ball. Whoever could shoot the object ball the softest while maintaining the stop on the cue ball won the exercise.
I just used it in a recent game. Not needed often, but sometimes you don't want the ball rolling with too much speed so it doesn't drift too far after contact, but you don't want to feather the ball because the shot is too far away and the ball will roll at the mercy of the table. A good drag/kill shot will allow you to hit the ball with some pace to keep it from drifting, but will slow down enough to act like a feathered ball.
The stop shot may be the earliest CB control skill that most players master - we can hit them pretty early on from lots of distances and different speeds.
And we can think of these drag shots as being in the "stop shot family" - stopshot plus and stopshot minus, so to speak. So why aren't we automatically good at them too? Or are we?
pj
chgo
Is it harder to roll forward or backward exactly two inches than to stop (seems like it to me)? If so, why?
I'm guessing there's a bigger margin of error for a stop shot than for the slight adjustments. Maybe the CB slides over a relatively long distance...?
pj
chgo
Bingo. A stop shot can withstand a small amount of back or top spin with no or little CB motion; and at faster speed, the CB is close to sliding over a very large distance, resulting is stop action. With follow and draw shots, especially at faster speed, small changes in the amount of spin (top or bottom) have large effects on CB travel distance.
Regards,
Dave
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Definitely harder than a stop shot. To hit the "drag" shot correctly takes some pinpoint cue ball control. Any decent player can shoot an effective stop shot, but you have to play a lot better to have this shot in your arsenal and be able to execute it at will. Big difference between rolling an inch forward after contact and two inches. Same for two inches and four inches. It takes some practice to master this shot. :smile:
The distance the cue ball travels after an attempted stop shot is proportional to the square of the error in spin. This means that the margin of error for leaving the cue ball within an inch of stopping exactly is eight times as large as the allowed error to move the cue ball four inches within an inch.
I'm pretty sure Mike Sigel said he could tell you how many times the cueball would rotate backwards between being struck and taking up forward motion .
If I had to bet , I would say he could.
I was watching him shoot it at a tournament , probably early 80s.
If I had to bet , I would say he could.
I was watching him shoot it at a tournament , probably early 80s.