The value of "going home"...aka finishing your stroke!

Scott Lee

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
After watching the WPBA matches on tv this afternoon, I thought I might offer a short treatise on the value having a 'finish point' for your stroke. This refers to a pendulum swing, and having your stroke end at the same place, every time (in a normal SOP shot situation). By having a place to take your grip hand to (usually either the bicep closing on the forearm, or the grip hand hitting the chest near the armpit)...which we SPF instructors call the "home position"...there are several benefits. First, your cuetip will finish the same distance past the CB every time, which is a visual aid to reinforce your stroke (once you understand and have measured your shooting template). Second, by having a home position for your grip hand, it is easily discerned whether or not you exerted too much grip pressure (seen by the flatness, turned under, rolled out wrist, or upwards slanted orientation of the knuckles). This can allow someone to self correct twisting the cue, at the last second (an unecessary and often fatal flaw in the accuracy of your stroke). Allison demonstrated this concept extremely well in her "tip of the day" today.

However, those benefits pale, imo, with the value of being able to master speed control on any table. When the brain has trained the arm to move in a range of motion that is the same every time (with the exception of tip position and swing speed), and that range of motion is based on how each player's arm works with their own body, the brain has a "static" movement to draw from, as a baseline. By training the bicep to repeat this baseline movement, the brain can then train the bicep to do this movement at virtually any speed...from a lag to a break (the two extremes in our normal stroke speed repertoire). Better yet, the brain can also, after training, decipher and subconsciously "call up" any of these speeds (we number them 1-10, because the human brain is already hardwired to use numerical scales and systems), at will, under pressure, in ONE try.

In watching the WPBA matches today, I noticed several positional errors that were, imo, due to not having a finish point for the player's stroke. I'm not saying you cannot develop this "feel" without the kind of swing process I'm describing...but I am saying that if you struggle with over or underrunning position, this kind of process could well help you learn to better control it...especially under pressure. Speed control is continually mentioned as something very difficult to learn...and I would agree that if you move your cue different ways, it would be much more difficult to train yourself. As Allison accurately stated, the stroke is all about letting the cue do the work!

So...this isn't directed at the expert players, who have, through whatever method, developed a consistent "feel" for speed control...but rather at the players who may struggle with inconsistent stroke speed, or who have a hard time when they put their stroke under pressure. Just a little 'food for thought'...:grin:

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
I'm still working on this as per our lesson together. In my opinion, "going home" is excellent advice for players of all levels.
 
I'm still working on this as per our lesson together. In my opinion, "going home" is excellent advice for players of all levels.

Its the truth....and there are similar techniques in a large number of sports.

In baseball when you pitch you learn to use the mound to direct your throws...you stand on the mound where you want the ball to land over the plate....you don't cross your frigging arm to do it.

Same exact concept.....builds major repeatability.


as always Scott it was a pleasure reading your post....

take care guys,
Keebie
 
This refers to a pendulum swing, and having your stroke end at the same place, every time (in a normal SOP shot situation). By having a place to take your grip hand to (usually either the bicep closing on the forearm, or the grip hand hitting the chest near the armpit)...which we SPF instructors call the "home position"...there are several benefits.
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com


Great advice Scott....Even though you refer to the pendulum swing.....I would guess that a home position would add consistency to ANY type of stroke......even an elbow dropper.
 
I have to say, I have watched myself on video more than a few times when having problems. By far the easiest way to cure many problems is to end up in the correct finish position. I have made it a major focus of practice, then you end up right the rest of your stroke kinda has to fall in place, sort of automatic.
 
After watching the WPBA matches on tv this afternoon, I thought I might offer a short treatise on the value having a 'finish point' for your stroke. This refers to a pendulum swing, and having your stroke end at the same place, every time (in a normal SOP shot situation). By having a place to take your grip hand to (usually either the bicep closing on the forearm, or the grip hand hitting the chest near the armpit)...which we SPF instructors call the "home position"...there are several benefits. First, your cuetip will finish the same distance past the CB every time, which is a visual aid to reinforce your stroke (once you understand and have measured your shooting template). Second, by having a home position for your grip hand, it is easily discerned whether or not you exerted too much grip pressure (seen by the flatness, turned under, rolled out wrist, or upwards slanted orientation of the knuckles). This can allow someone to self correct twisting the cue, at the last second (an unecessary and often fatal flaw in the accuracy of your stroke). Allison demonstrated this concept extremely well in her "tip of the day" today.

However, those benefits pale, imo, with the value of being able to master speed control on any table. When the brain has trained the arm to move in a range of motion that is the same every time (with the exception of tip position and swing speed), and that range of motion is based on how each player's arm works with their own body, the brain has a "static" movement to draw from, as a baseline. By training the bicep to repeat this baseline movement, the brain can then train the bicep to do this movement at virtually any speed...from a lag to a break (the two extremes in our normal stroke speed repertoire). Better yet, the brain can also, after training, decipher and subconsciously "call up" any of these speeds (we number them 1-10, because the human brain is already hardwired to use numerical scales and systems), at will, under pressure, in ONE try.

In watching the WPBA matches today, I noticed several positional errors that were, imo, due to not having a finish point for the player's stroke. I'm not saying you cannot develop this "feel" without the kind of swing process I'm describing...but I am saying that if you struggle with over or underrunning position, this kind of process could well help you learn to better control it...especially under pressure. Speed control is continually mentioned as something very difficult to learn...and I would agree that if you move your cue different ways, it would be much more difficult to train yourself. As Allison accurately stated, the stroke is all about letting the cue do the work!

So...this isn't directed at the expert players, who have, through whatever method, developed a consistent "feel" for speed control...but rather at the players who may struggle with inconsistent stroke speed, or who have a hard time when they put their stroke under pressure. Just a little 'food for thought'...:grin:

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Tap Tap Tap,

couldn t be explained better- great posting! pay him! ^^

lg from overseas,

Ingo
 
You are showing much growth over the years Scott. Your description of the benefits of the consistent finish position is honed to a fine edge and as I continue to work on my stroke I find your conclusion to be very true and helpful.

Thanks!!
 
Along these lines, i do have a question. Scott, if you read this feel free to respond.

how is it that you determine the length of your bridge? i think the day you were at my place three years ago that we determined mine was about 8 inches. but i've noticed that sometimes i am around 6 inches, sometimes 4 inches, other times maybe as much as 10 inches.

i still struggle with those long straight draw shots. just wondering if my bridge is a possible flaw.

DCP
 
Mike...I will answer your question (although we went over this, AND it's recorded on your tapes/dvds...when's the last time you watched them?). Everyone has a 'comfortable' natural bridge length, that you will use more often than not, for normal shots (this excludes situations where you are too close to the CB, shooting over another OB, frozen on the rail, etc.). You will have a corresponding grip position on the back end of the cue, that, when the tip is touching the CB, will allow you to grip the cue where your hand falls directly under your elbow, creating the 90 degree position between the forearm and the cuestick (this does not necessarily mean that the upper arm and forearm are at 90...that changes with how high or low you stand over the cue). With this natural bridge length, and natural grip position, your normal range of motion swing will provide a distance past the CB where your tip finishes on any normal stroke. All of these things are measurable with a ruler, and do not change, regardless of tip position on the CB, or speed of stroke.

Now, to answer your specific question about changing bridge length. We will, on occasion, be required to change our bridge length...sometimes a bit closer, sometimes a bit longer. As long as you change your grip position on the cue to match how much you change your bridge length, your finish position will remain exactly the same. Remember, this is a "feel" as well as a visual aid. Work on your Mother Drills to improve your long straight shots.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Along these lines, i do have a question. Scott, if you read this feel free to respond.

how is it that you determine the length of your bridge? i think the day you were at my place three years ago that we determined mine was about 8 inches. but i've noticed that sometimes i am around 6 inches, sometimes 4 inches, other times maybe as much as 10 inches.

i still struggle with those long straight draw shots. just wondering if my bridge is a possible flaw.

DCP
 
Mike...I will answer your question (although we went over this, AND it's recorded on your tapes/dvds...when's the last time you watched them?). Everyone has a 'comfortable' natural bridge length, that you will use more often than not, for normal shots (this excludes situations where you are too close to the CB, shooting over another OB, frozen on the rail, etc.). You will have a corresponding grip position on the back end of the cue, that, when the tip is touching the CB, will allow you to grip the cue where your hand falls directly under your elbow, creating the 90 degree position between the forearm and the cuestick (this does not necessarily mean that the upper arm and forearm are at 90...that changes with how high or low you stand over the cue). With this natural bridge length, and natural grip position, your normal range of motion swing will provide a distance past the CB where your tip finishes on any normal stroke. All of these things are measurable with a ruler, and do not change, regardless of tip position on the CB, or speed of stroke.

Now, to answer your specific question about changing bridge length. We will, on occasion, be required to change our bridge length...sometimes a bit closer, sometimes a bit longer. As long as you change your grip position on the cue to match how much you change your bridge length, your finish position will remain exactly the same. Remember, this is a "feel" as well as a visual aid. Work on your Mother Drills to improve your long straight shots.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com





What a great answer.....SPF=randyg
 
Mike...I will answer your question (although we went over this, AND it's recorded on your tapes/dvds...when's the last time you watched them?). Everyone has a 'comfortable' natural bridge length, that you will use more often than not, for normal shots (this excludes situations where you are too close to the CB, shooting over another OB, frozen on the rail, etc.). You will have a corresponding grip position on the back end of the cue, that, when the tip is touching the CB, will allow you to grip the cue where your hand falls directly under your elbow, creating the 90 degree position between the forearm and the cuestick (this does not necessarily mean that the upper arm and forearm are at 90...that changes with how high or low you stand over the cue). With this natural bridge length, and natural grip position, your normal range of motion swing will provide a distance past the CB where your tip finishes on any normal stroke. All of these things are measurable with a ruler, and do not change, regardless of tip position on the CB, or speed of stroke.

Now, to answer your specific question about changing bridge length. We will, on occasion, be required to change our bridge length...sometimes a bit closer, sometimes a bit longer. As long as you change your grip position on the cue to match how much you change your bridge length, your finish position will remain exactly the same. Remember, this is a "feel" as well as a visual aid. Work on your Mother Drills to improve your long straight shots.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

:grin-square:
Scott, your posts open my heart :joyful:

Really a pleasure to have such a person of that caliber on this forum,

lg
Ingo
 
"Going Home" and Controlling "Speed"

Scott,

First and foremost, thanks for this reminder! However, I do have a question. Will you remind me how to control the speed of the shot AND go "home" on the shots?

I've read this entire thread and you answered another question I had about modifying the grip and whenever changing the bridge length. Thanks for this reminder/answer.

My challenge is I find it difficult to deliver cue to its proper "finish" position on shots requiring slow and/or delicate touch shots to minimize cueball movement. When I do go home on those shots it appears that I stroked the ball too much even though the correct cue-ball tip position was used.

Will you please assist me with this?

Thanks,

Takeem



After watching the WPBA matches on tv this afternoon, I thought I might offer a short treatise on the value having a 'finish point' for your stroke. This refers to a pendulum swing, and having your stroke end at the same place, every time (in a normal SOP shot situation). By having a place to take your grip hand to (usually either the bicep closing on the forearm, or the grip hand hitting the chest near the armpit)...which we SPF instructors call the "home position"...there are several benefits. First, your cuetip will finish the same distance past the CB every time, which is a visual aid to reinforce your stroke (once you understand and have measured your shooting template). Second, by having a home position for your grip hand, it is easily discerned whether or not you exerted too much grip pressure (seen by the flatness, turned under, rolled out wrist, or upwards slanted orientation of the knuckles). This can allow someone to self correct twisting the cue, at the last second (an unecessary and often fatal flaw in the accuracy of your stroke). Allison demonstrated this concept extremely well in her "tip of the day" today.

However, those benefits pale, imo, with the value of being able to master speed control on any table. When the brain has trained the arm to move in a range of motion that is the same every time (with the exception of tip position and swing speed), and that range of motion is based on how each player's arm works with their own body, the brain has a "static" movement to draw from, as a baseline. By training the bicep to repeat this baseline movement, the brain can then train the bicep to do this movement at virtually any speed...from a lag to a break (the two extremes in our normal stroke speed repertoire). Better yet, the brain can also, after training, decipher and subconsciously "call up" any of these speeds (we number them 1-10, because the human brain is already hardwired to use numerical scales and systems), at will, under pressure, in ONE try.

In watching the WPBA matches today, I noticed several positional errors that were, imo, due to not having a finish point for the player's stroke. I'm not saying you cannot develop this "feel" without the kind of swing process I'm describing...but I am saying that if you struggle with over or underrunning position, this kind of process could well help you learn to better control it...especially under pressure. Speed control is continually mentioned as something very difficult to learn...and I would agree that if you move your cue different ways, it would be much more difficult to train yourself. As Allison accurately stated, the stroke is all about letting the cue do the work!

So...this isn't directed at the expert players, who have, through whatever method, developed a consistent "feel" for speed control...but rather at the players who may struggle with inconsistent stroke speed, or who have a hard time when they put their stroke under pressure. Just a little 'food for thought'...:grin:

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
Great advice Scott....Even though you refer to the pendulum swing.....I would guess that a home position would add consistency to ANY type of stroke......even an elbow dropper.

I think you're right. However, I think an *inconsistent* elbow dropper might have a tough time of it. I know I drop my elbow on most shots. If I start dropping before contact, it is very likely that I may add speed to my cue. This added speed may or may not fit the *required* speed for the shot. I think Scott's advice is great. I generally would agree with the concept that the advice would be helpful for all types of strokes. I just think elbow droppers would derive the most benefit if they drop their elbow the same way on every shot.

KMRUNOUT
 
Takeem...Glad to help! :grin: I believe what you're describing are shots using what we call "finesse speed", which is less than lag, or pocket speed. On shots like those we teach a slightly different setup. Bridge up on the CB, so that your tip is no more than 2-3 inches away, at the end of your backswing (it might be much closer on some delicate shots). Now move your grip way up to the front of the wrap (with the tip at the CB, the forearm will be way ahead of perpendicular). Since you have a much shorter available backswing, and a much reduced finish (as far as your tip goes), this allows you to naturally complete your swing (at lag speed or less), and still take your grip hand home. Because of the 3-1 weight ratio between the cue and CB, even this reduced range of motion allows the cue to overcome the weight of the CB. Hope this helps. BTW, this is a 'specialty' stroke...not what you'd use most of the time. Practice this finesse speed stroke by trying to move the CB just one length of the table (call it 1/2 lag). Most people accomplish this shot with a poke, or a decellerating stroke (where there is a full backswing, but the cues slows down and stops at the CB). You can learn to be a decent poker or bunter, but I'd rather use the same technique for all shots.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Scott,

First and foremost, thanks for this reminder! However, I do have a question. Will you remind me how to control the speed of the shot AND go "home" on the shots?

I've read this entire thread and you answered another question I had about modifying the grip and whenever changing the bridge length. Thanks for this reminder/answer.

My challenge is I find it difficult to deliver cue to its proper "finish" position on shots requiring slow and/or delicate touch shots to minimize cueball movement. When I do go home on those shots it appears that I stroked the ball too much even though the correct cue-ball tip position was used.

Will you please assist me with this?

Thanks,

Takeem
 
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I think you're right. However, I think an *inconsistent* elbow dropper might have a tough time of it. I know I drop my elbow on most shots. If I start dropping before contact, it is very likely that I may add speed to my cue. This added speed may or may not fit the *required* speed for the shot. I think Scott's advice is great. I generally would agree with the concept that the advice would be helpful for all types of strokes. I just think elbow droppers would derive the most benefit if they drop their elbow the same way on every shot.

KMRUNOUT

I find that I drop my elbow on some shots, but not others judging by video, even when I make sure I get home. Anyone tried Mikas wrist glove? I am wondering if this will have no bearing on the elbow drop or not. I feel my grip is decently loose and still my knuckles never go up on my finish even though when I hit my chest correctly.
 
Spimp13...The 'wrist glove' will only help if you're twisting the cue. It has no bearing on your finish. I believe you just need a more indepth video analysis, than you can get at pool school (obviously limited due to student numbers and time). Several of us SPF instructors offer the indepth analysis for $100 (it's a huge part of every private lesson I do). However that only applies to people who have had some kind of SPF training first. If you got the video analysis, but didn't know how to use it to make corrections, it would be of limited value. Let me know if you're interested, and I'll come see you in IA.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I find that I drop my elbow on some shots, but not others judging by video, even when I make sure I get home. Anyone tried Mikas wrist glove? I am wondering if this will have no bearing on the elbow drop or not. I feel my grip is decently loose and still my knuckles never go up on my finish even though when I hit my chest correctly.
 
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