Time required to be an A player

An A player ranking around here can hardly run out a rack in barbox 8 ball. I think what you mean by A player is typically called a Masters player in these parts. This is the equivalent to a BCA Advanced player.

I don't think I've seen anyone get to Masters ranking in under 10 years.

Let's say it takes 5000 hours. If you played 5 hours a day it would take you over 2.5 years to play that many hours. Each person is different though. Some require a lot more practice to get to a certain level than others. You have to develop the physical ability as well as the mental know how on what to do in all situations.
 
Black-Balled said:
Depends on how you measure 'A'.

Is it beating the 9b ghost in races to 9 in your basement, or is it finishing well is a big tournament? If it is out and about, then skill at pocketing balls isn't all it takes.

There is a mental side to the latter that you cannot replicate anywhere other than the ring.
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I was thinking along the same lines. What game and what standards are being used to determine the levels.

Being a A level 14.1 player is not the same as A level 9 ball.

You might be a A level in your town only.

All these levels are for is handicapping and really have very little to do with your true skill level.

I do not put my skills at any level. I just play better than some and worse than others and this is really all you need to know.
 
duckie said:
I was thinking along the same lines. What game and what standards are being used to determine the levels.

Being a A level 14.1 player is not the same as A level 9 ball.

You might be a A level in your town only.

All these levels are for is handicapping and really have very little to do with your true skill level.

I do not put my skills at any level. I just play better than some and worse than others and this is really all you need to know.
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That is the thing, depending on the game we are all rated differently, I am basing my current level of 9 ball at a B, my one pocket is higher than my 9 ball game. Some people can be an A level in 9 ball but in one pocket or other games they are a B player.
 
Ron F said:
Based on Malcolm Gladwell's book "Outliers", it typically takes 10,000 hours of dedicated practice to achieve world-class status in anything, provided you have the natural ability to take you to that level. It also helps if you learn the game at a young age under the tutelage of someone experienced in teaching proper fundamentals - thereby sidestepping the bad habits that most of us possess.

Ron F
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yes the 10,000 hour rule

this holds true in multiple sports, musical instrument virtuosity
etc
 
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Fast Lenny said:
I know moving from the lower speed are just learning the basics, like going from a D to a C, but a C to a B and then a B to an A really is a slower process IMO. It is kind of like when I drag raced cars, to go from a 14 second car to and 11 second car was not too tough, you would get to a certain point where to make your car a half second faster or even a couple tenths it took a good deal of money or changes.
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This is right on, IMO. I think most ppl hit a plateau around "C+" or "B". It takes a decent amount of dedication to bust past "B" level.


Eric
 
mnShooter said:
An A player ranking around here can hardly run out a rack in barbox 8 ball. I think what you mean by A player is typically called a Masters player in these parts. This is the equivalent to a BCA Advanced player.

I don't think I've seen anyone get to Masters ranking in under 10 years.
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I would say, to get everyone on the same page, that an 'A" player=

AAA or 9/10(in AZ) or a BCA Master.


Eric
 
Yes You Can Do It, but it Ain't easy

Yes, 10,000 hours of dedication is about right, playing night and day, if you are 20 years and older.

Oscar grew up around pool and his father is a Pro also. Oscar gave up the game early and decided later in his life to become a Pro Player. His will and dedication to practice pool is uncanny. He is constantly practicing and keeps getting better. If you work like Oscar then you too can be a Pro Player. The only thing that is going to hurt Oscar is his education, because like any other endeavor you must dedicate your life to it. I hope that Oscar shows us that he can be the first one to be able to do both.

Kids, learn faster in my opinion because they fall in love with the game and play every minute of every day they can. Second “They Have No Fear” they haven’t learned that yet. The day they learn about “Fear” that is he day they become mortal men.

Tiger, Mosconi, Efren, Bustamente, Davenport, Shannon, St Louie Louie, Strickland, Keith, SVB and countless others they were young……..

That’s my Two Cents, Barney
 
BarneyCalip said:
Yes, 10,000 hours of dedication is about right, playing night and day, if you are 20 years and older.

Oscar grew up around pool and his father is a Pro also. Oscar gave up the game early and decided later in his life to become a Pro Player. His will and dedication to practice pool is uncanny. He is constantly practicing and keeps getting better. If you work like Oscar then you too can be a Pro Player. The only thing that is going to hurt Oscar is his education, because like any other endeavor you must dedicate your life to it. I hope that Oscar shows us that he can be the first one to be able to do both.

Kids, learn faster in my opinion because they fall in love with the game and play every minute of every day they can. Second “They Have No Fear” they haven’t learned that yet. The day they learn about “Fear” that is he day they become mortal men.

Tiger, Mosconi, Efren, Bustamente, Davenport, Shannon, St Louie Louie, Strickland, Keith, SVB and countless others they were young……..

That’s my Two Cents, Barney
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Hi Barney, are you the gentleman who I met at California Billiard Club with that nice old car? If so it was nice to meet you.
 
Fast Lenny said:
I was lucky to catch some of my A moments on tape, my average play is B speed though. :smile:
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Thank you, Sir. May I have another?


57030_166763610007426_100000213633100_609246_3131533_o+%25281%2529.jpg

You are not getting spots anymore.
 
Masayoshi said:
I think 99% of people that start in their 30s or earlier have the hand-eye coordination required to get to an A level within 10 years or 5 if they play full time. The reason a lot of people don't get there is because they lack the time, desire, commitment, drive, knowledge, instruction, character, or a combination of those to get there.
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This is interesting - I don't know of any A players that started this late (in their 30's).

I know we weren't talking necessarily about pros but I think all the top pros are now starting out earlier and earlier and it shows. I think it used to be you could start out in your 20's and still catch up if you were loaded with natural talent. I don't know if we will see that much anymore. I'm not saying that you can't become an "A" player, I just don't think you will be able to catch up with the big dogs.
 
Hi Lenny

Lenny, yes I have the 49 Convertible and the 50 Lincoln.
It was great talking to you at California Billiards.

I just saw your Grady post and I want to thank you for your post and for your streamming. Take Care, Barney
 
BarneyCalip said:
Lenny, yes I have the 49 Convertible and the 50 Lincoln.
It was great talking to you at California Billiards.

I just saw your Grady post and I want to thank you for your post and for your streamming. Take Care, Barney
Click to expand...

Hope to run into you again Barney. :smile:
 
All depends on raw dedication, strength of spacial thinking, drive and of course natural talent. A person like Tony Watson was said to be at a solid B before he was a teenager and he was certainly a high A speed before adulthood.

As for myself I will let you know whenever I think I get there. Of course when I think I got there someone will tell me that I'm not there yet so I will probably have to retract and come back later ;)
 
Pool is a pretty simple game in some respects. I was an "A" for one glorious rack in the first year I played... I broke and ran out a rack of 8 ball.... I started playing more and more and I started playing like an "A" in more and more racks.... By year 2 The guys at the game room of the community college wanted nothing todo with me... I was making money from them every day.....

At some point in year 2 I stumbled into a real pool room... Geez those tables look a lot bigger.... Ummm what do you mean no one plays 8ball???? What do you mean it's a bar game??? 9ball??? WTF is 9ball?? OK sounds easy... You will spot me the last 3 for $5?? OK I'll try it..... Gahhhhhh I'm broke!!!!! I ask the room owner for a job, he says yes and the journey now begins......

Another year goes by and I am playing like an "A" for some racks... My break, position play and stroke are now holding up to the skill requirements of 9ball.... In 8ball I am now a solid "A" at this point. My pattern skill which was my strong suit at 8ball now has allies in the tools I have developed... I start winning local 9ball tournaments..... I start playing like an "A" for entire matches......

Year 4... I stumble into a new pool hall... Geez the tables are fast... WTF is SIMONIS??? You want to play straight pool??? Never played it... Sounds easy.... You will give me 50 going to 100? for $50???.... WTF is SIMONIS????

I lost 100-18 well 68 if you add my 50... Instead of embracing a new game with a new skill set I stick with 9ball and while I get to points where I can play for extended periods as an "A" I cannot ever seem to stay at the "A" level.....

1 pocket starts to gain popularity but I refuse to play it because I do not have the skill set for it.... Exactly the same response I had to straight pool.... Years are passing at this point and I am stuck..... I continually play 9ball... the periods of pro level play, "A" play, are more common place... I think all it will take to play solid pro speed is to stay at it.... I stick to my guns...

Year 20....... Yuppers... I have been playing 20 years and I am still stuck right on the edge teetering.... I have had entire months where I haven't missed a ball I am supposed to make but I fall back to earth for months as well... The 6 weeks before I go to my first US Open I do not miss a shot I am supposed to make....

Offensively I see nothing impressive.... I have hit my million balls... Or more accurately I have shot 1 million offensive shots.... Flyers are more common than safeties where I have learned to play even among the better 9ball players... I have played professionals and won matches where I was in high gear,,,, WHY ARE THESE GUYS NOT SHOOTING SHOTS EVEN I CAN MAKE?????

Percentages..... Takes me all week watching to digest it.... I have spent 20 years playing the game and I have never been blessed to be around a percentage player..... I know the concept.... I have read all about it... but for my whole life I have had Fast Eddie's words ringing in my ears..... "Safe players die broke too. Don't they Burt?"

I am the flyer king.... I have played my whole life on tables with buckets.... If I can see it I can make it.... I will either steamroll you or I will lose if you play me safe and somehow I don't kick or jump the ball in..... I will miss and give up the table several times a match because I will consistently shoot the low percentage shot...... I am an A+ I am not just an A at this style of play but I have a problem... No world class player will play like this.... Heck.. no true shortstop will play like this... I have a weakness..... And I have thought it was my strength......

So how long DOES it take??? It depends on who and what you are exposed to.... It depends on developing the entire skill set... To be a true A you have to master ALL OF THE GAMES...... Each game has something to teach... It's human nature to do the things we are good at and avoid the things we are not good at.... Look for your weaknesses and find your blind spots.....

22 years now.... Am I an "A" yet? Nope... I still haven't ran 100 and I am only a decent 1 pocket player. I am working on them tho... I think this is a blessing in some ways.... It would be a sad world if I had learned all the games at a young age and noone knew who Efren was.......
 
Yo

hey guys thanks for all the input.
They were pretty interesting. made me think of some things in a different way too.

what i meant initially asking the question, what is an A player, was along the lines of, some Joe tucker shit i saw,

rack 10 ball, break and ghost. count how many you can run each rack, and add them up after 10 racks.
30-35 D+
36-40 C
41-45 C+
46-50 B
51-55 B+
56-60 A
61-65 A+
66-70 A++
71-up Pro
in my eyes i was thinking A player as something around or higher than 65 ,as long as your break isn't TOO horrible.

do you guys think this is a good way to judge level?
i understand that different games value different skills, for example in one pocket you might not even have to be THAT good of a pocketer. and theres plenty of safety play that comes into games, but just speaking, general offensive skills. is this a good rating system?

I know i did this a short while back, i might run out once, have a couple of times getting close to running out, but sometimes i'll shoot the one and just completely dog the two ball. and it leaves me thinking wtf?
 
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