Today's Players Better At Playing 1-Hole?

[spanky79]

Thanks Freddie. I knew there was something I liked about you. :smile:
It's posts like this that indicate to me how astute a commentator you are.
The top guys today have so much game, they can execute any shot, and the smallest of openings are all they need to take charge of the game and even run out (or close). I've seen them all shoot their way out of bad situations as well with what looks like a low percentage shot.

That said, the two best One Pocket players I ever saw remain Ronnie Allen and Efren. Ronnie was running ten and out (he usually had to get to ten) 30-45 years ago on the slow cloth. Even today very few players (read that none) have his knowledge or ability to kick multiple rails with so much accuracy. He could turn a dead trap into a run out with one amazing kick. I saw him do it a hundred times. He also was the best ever at making combinations, particularly off angle ones. You know the ones everybody misses!

Ronnie NEVER missed a game ball for the cash either, cutting balls down the rail or needing to make a bank off the end rail. Two railer, no problem either. SWISH!

As for Efren, no one controls the cue ball like him, able to weave in and out of small openings and get position in super tight spaces. And if he can see it, you better believe he will make it. The only player I ever saw who would regularly run out with all the balls down table. He could run eight and out with all the balls inside the second diamond upstream. No one else does that, even today. Plus his imagination and creativity are other worldly. He finds shots that no one else sees and can turn the game around with some remarkable shot from nowhere. Seen him do that many times as well. They are still my picks for the all time greatest in my lifetime.

And we have a winner. Couldn't of said it better myself. I just wish I woud of been able to see more of Ronnie in his prime.

 

[TSW]

Any top pros who DON'T play one pocket? Like people have tried to get them into games and they flat out refuse? It seems like all the serious players at least dabble in it. Shane's the ten ball guy but wow, look at his 1-pocket. John Schmidt's supposed to be a straight pool guy but I hear he plays great 1-hole too. I'm sure johnny and earl play.

I get the impression is used to be a specialty game beloved by only certain pros, and now it's a required credit to get your billiards degree.

... and I think this is why guys like Scott Frost are having a hard time keeping up. Have you ever seen a one pocket tournament with as many world-class cueists as the Make It Happen event? Usually one pocket tournaments are filled with specialists in the discipline.

 

[Black-Balled]

Any top pros who DON'T play one pocket? ... I'm sure johnny and earl play...

I have never heard of Johnny playing 1p...not that I think he would have any problem playing any game on a pool table.

Peterson?! What say you?!

 

[CreeDo]

... and I think this is why guys like Scott Frost are having a hard time keeping up. Have you ever seen a one pocket tournament with as many world-class cueists as the Make It Happen event? Usually one pocket tournaments are filled with specialists in the discipline.

It's true. A "make it happen" nine ball event would basically just be the final 8 of the US Open. I'll buy that a dollar.

 

[Cornerman]

I have never heard of Johnny playing 1p...not that I think he would have any problem playing any game on a pool table.

Peterson?! What say you?!

I don't think this counts as him really playing one-pocket. But, the first years that he went to Derby City, he played one-pocket.

I do know that years after, he would often only show up for the 9-ball if he showed up at all.

Freddie <~~~ Just checked: he came in 16th in 2001 and 28th in 2004 in the One-Hole Division of the DCC at the Executive West

 

[pt109]

... and I think this is why guys like Scott Frost are having a hard time keeping up. Have you ever seen a one pocket tournament with as many world-class cueists as the Make It Happen event? Usually one pocket tournaments are filled with specialists in the discipline.

Scott Frost is not going to take this sitting down...if tournament 1-hole
becomes popular....he'll get his share.

I don't think he's been in enough even-up action for a while...he's been
running 14s on inferior players, where you get more shots.
And he is used to dressing casually...he didn't look comfortable wearing
a vest....he'll get used to it.

Scott has as much heart as any player I've ever seen.

 

[TSW]

Scott Frost is not going to take this sitting down...if tournament 1-hole
becomes popular....he'll get his share.

I don't think he's been in enough even-up action for a while...he's been
running 14s on inferior players, where you get more shots.
And he is used to dressing casually...he didn't look comfortable wearing
a vest....he'll get used to it.

Scott has as much heart as any player I've ever seen.

I don't doubt that he can raise his game. Question is, can he raise it enough to go head to head with guys like SVB, Alex, Busty, etc when they are focused on 1P?

 

[Nick B]

I differ to Jay and Bill I. Somebody go get Billy and will get this thing settled.

Nick

Correction: Throw in Freddy the Beard to break the tie.

 

[pt109]

I agree 100%. First of all, todays pool is played on a sheet of ice with fast and perfectly woven cloth pulled so tightly you can all most see through it to the slate. This equipment requires very little stroke and the balls slide nicely into the pockets.

Second, you must have discipline to play the score by balancing your levels of aggressive play vs cautious play based on the score and based on the spot you are in. Guys like Jeremy who came up through Jersey Red knew this and so they play the game differently.

But this style is at a disadvantage with the easy equipment.

I'd like to see one pocket played on tougher equipment with very tight pockets and slower cloth. If I wanted to watch run out pool I'd watch bar box nine ball. I believe there are too many 8 and outs. If I wanted to play a mindless game of luck I'd play checkers.

Hung...I can't believe you want to take pool back to the Cro-Magnon age.
Do you think less options are going to help the game?

Maybe golfers should go back to gutta percha or even feather-filled golf balls?...
...and don't mow the greens for two weeks before a tournament?

The game has more beauty on fast cloth...even British snooker players are
discovering that.

I sentence you to 3 months...playing 3-cushion, where you may come to
appreciate the options that fast cloth gives.

 

[pt109]

I didn't mean to repeat myself...I don't feel THAT strongly about it.

 

[Put_upor_shutup]

I agree 100%. First of all, todays pool is played on a sheet of ice with fast and perfectly woven cloth pulled so tightly you can all most see through it to the slate. This equipment requires very little stroke and the balls slide nicely into the pockets.

Second, you must have discipline to play the score by balancing your levels of aggressive play vs cautious play based on the score and based on the spot you are in. Guys like Jeremy who came up through Jersey Red knew this and so they play the game differently.

But this style is at a disadvantage with the easy equipment.

I'd like to see one pocket played on tougher equipment with very tight pockets and slower cloth. If I wanted to watch run out pool I'd watch bar box nine ball. I believe there are too many 8 and outs. If I wanted to play a mindless game of luck I'd play checkers.

Even seeing as I move like a tortoise dry humping a tree stump and need to run balls to win, I agree with u.I would rather play on 4 1/8 inch pockets with 4 year old cloth..Dunno where I learned that..If u r gonna beat me prove it.

 

[naji]

I don't doubt that he can raise his game. Question is, can he raise it enough to go head to head with guys like SVB, Alex, Busty, etc when they are focused on 1P?

Even though i am not a pro, but i have ran into same situation i think Scott F is in, maybe others did too. We reach a very high confidence level in pocketing balls in practice, we quit practicing to the level where we are 100% sure we will never miss a ball, but fffffff,,,, do miss even the simplest safety shot, and hand the 1st game, and 2nd and try to fight back hard but too late opponent already free wheeling. Or do we forget that one pocket is really defensive game not offensive?

Maybe this mode happens when we watch SVB play? or not playing in competition daily or high $$ matches, or not playing good players all the time, where you win despite the bad misses.

Not sure if it the One pocket game, or pool in general, i think it is one pocket.

 

[wincardona]

My simple opinion based on attending the DCC all these years and watching the evolution is that more top players are playing one-hole. And therefore the old idea of better movers vs better shooters ends up being moot as the best shooters in the world can move. And the best shooters moving is completely integrated with their shooting. That is to say that what are normally great moves might not work against world class shotmakers anymore. And world-class shot makers can expand the definition of "the correct shot" based on their great shotmaking.

So, I don't think it's so much that the game has changed (maybe it has) but rather more of the best players are playing it and leaving behind the concept of "better movers."

I think Jay's or Freddy's take on this is going to be more insightful than most.

Freddie <~~~ not Freddy

Exactly.:thumbup:

Bill Incardona