Tools/practice to get the perfect stroke??

V

Venomtrickshots

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hi guys, as some of you might now i'm now hardly working on getting a better stroke and especially more pure technically and I was wondering if some of you have ideas on some points:

1) Do someone have an idea how to simulate the shaking hand you 've got in a tournament and try to practice with the same sensation of stress? i'm already trying somethings without success for now lol

2) About the speed of the stroke, i'm already practicing with a heavier cue and sometimes even weights in the arm to build this, but do someone know anything else?

3) Do someone have something to force you making the perfect elbow and shoulder movements?

4) to finish, about the loose grip, I noticed in artistic billiard (carom table) there is a guy using like a 'reverse' stroke. I'll try to explain but, usually you held your cue loose and automatically finish tighter at the end of the motion, this guy make the opposite and has a hell of a stroke (tight grip hand at the beginning and almost no grip by the end)... So basically I'm just wondering what you guys think about it and also how to work on that movement, totally new for me...

Of course if any of you have other advices or ideas it would be great :)

Thanks,
Florian 'Venom'
 
I think starting off just stroking balls in with the barest of grips on the cue is a good way to work your stroke into shape, just try to work slowly, precisely and accurately, until it starts feeling better and better. Holding the cue lightly with your thumb and one or two fingers will accentuate any flaws you may have, which will help you realize where your issues are.
As far as your shoulder/upper arm/lower arm, that should be easy to align, even if you're just looking at your stroke in the bathroom mirror, or videotaping yourself to see where the flaws are, then alter them, rinse and repeat until it's second nature to have it all in line.

And I wouldn't try to emulate someones unusual stroke thinking it will give you extra spin or draw or touch. Some people are able to incorporate extraneous movement without hurting their game, but they've also been practicing with that extra movement for years. Do what's natural, but try to keep it clean too if you can, I think you'll see more improvement, faster, by working on a more traditional stroke before you start adding in too much flair (like a slipstroke or gripping the cue firmly until the moment of release).

Just my two cents :)
 
grab a old beer bottle clean it out let it sit upside down to dry out and place it on a table close to the hieght of a pool table and practice stroking through it without touching the sides of the bottle the opening any of it. it will work on building a smooth straight stroke.
 
Practice your stroke at extremely slow speeds. Once you are happy with your timing and how your muscles are coordinating, gradually add speed. If you find you come to a point where you can't add anymore speed without losing control, go back to a slower speed and adjust your grip, bridge, stance, timing, etc. until you figure out what is wrong. Its a long process, but you tend to learn a lot of details about your stroke in that time and will be able to find what works best for you.

Lacking speed is more often a problem of timing and coordination rather than physical strength.

Also, there are no perfect elbow or shoulder movements. Everyone has a different shape and muscle structure, so it is best to find out what works for you as opposed to trying to conform to what everybody else is doing.

As far as practicing for pressure goes, there is really no substitute for simply playing in more tournaments.

I can't say much about #4 because I don't know the guy you are talking about, but he probably just found a stroke that works for him. If you can imitate it and find it has advantages, there is no reason not to use it.
 
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I can't believe that a goofy, no-pool-shooting dipsh*t like me is about to type some "advice" to one of the greatest trick-shot cueists this planet has ever witnessed, but here goes: I found my stroke improved when I got my approach to the shot/stance/feet placement in order. Stepping into the shot from the correct distance, feet placed in a proper position coupled with the correct (different for each individual) bend in the back/knees was my secret to a better stroke. When all my approach/foot placement/back and knee bends came together properly, my stroke immediately improved.

Good luck to you Florian, but if you get even better, it's going to be a crime :thumbup:!!!

Maniac
 
Maniac said:
I can't believe that a goofy, no-pool-shooting dipsh*t like me is about to type some "advice" to one of the greatest trick-shot cueists this planet has ever witnessed, but here goes: I found my stroke improved when I got my approach to the shot/stance/feet placement in order. Stepping into the shot from the correct distance, feet placed in a proper position coupled with the correct (different for each individual) bend in the back/knees was my secret to a better stroke. When all my approach/foot placement/back and knee bends came together properly, my stroke immediately improved.

Good luck to you Florian, but if you get even better, it's going to be a crime :thumbup:!!!

Maniac
Click to expand...

Thanks everyone, already... It might seems surprising, but there's no difference, any tip can help because I'm looking for the extreme stroke, but to get that, you 've got to find every little part of a good motion, se there I' am, looking for every details lol
 
Masayoshi said:
Practice your stroke at extremely slow speeds. Once you are happy with your timing and how your muscles are coordinating, gradually add speed. If you find you come to a point where you can't add anymore speed without losing control, go back to a slower speed and adjust your grip, bridge, stance, timing, etc. until you figure out what is wrong. Its a long process, but you tend to learn a lot of details about your stroke in that time and will be able to find what works best for you.

Lacking speed is more often a problem of timing and coordination rather than physical strength.

Also, there are no perfect elbow or shoulder movements. Everyone has a different shape and muscle structure, so it is best to find out what works for you as opposed to trying to conform to what everybody else is doing.

As far as practicing for pressure goes, there is really no substitute for simply playing in more tournaments.

I can't say much about #4 because I don't know the guy you are talking about, but he probably just found a stroke that works for him. If you can imitate it and find it has advantages, there is no reason not to use it.
Click to expand...

btw for the pressure, you should try drink coffee and redbull for a whole day and then go on the table, the movement of your arms are going to be a little bit closer to the one under the pressure...
 
I can only give advice on one thing that you are doing wrong. If you are using a heavier cue and weights, you are actually going to make your cue speed SLOWER. Im not sure if thats what you are trying to do or not, but that will be the result.

You are giving your muscles the wrong type of memory, so that when you pick up a lighter cue, your muscles are going to try to compensate the difference and you will end up losing speed.
 
Venomtrickshots said:
Hi guys, as some of you might now i'm now hardly working on getting a better stroke and especially more pure technically and I was wondering if some of you have ideas on some points:

1) Do someone have an idea how to simulate the shaking hand you 've got in a tournament and try to practice with the same sensation of stress? i'm already trying somethings without success for now lol

I have the same problem and it used to bother me until...I embraced it, accepted that it was going to be. Sometimes I even made fun of myself if it got bad. Funny thing though, I still made the ball.

2) About the speed of the stroke, i'm already practicing with a heavier cue and sometimes even weights in the arm to build this, but do someone know anything else?

Sounds like you are doing it right. Practice, practice practice and time is all I know

3) Do someone have something to force you making the perfect elbow and shoulder movements?

m.m.m.m...something about a noose around your nutz connected to your elbow...:)

4) to finish, about the loose grip, I noticed in artistic billiard (carom table) there is a guy using like a 'reverse' stroke. I'll try to explain but, usually you held your cue loose and automatically finish tighter at the end of the motion, this guy make the opposite and has a hell of a stroke (tight grip hand at the beginning and almost no grip by the end)... So basically I'm just wondering what you guys think about it and also how to work on that movement, totally new for me...

It sounds like the old "slip stroke" to me. A lot of the old pros used this stroke, most notably, Billy "Cornbread Red" Burgess. I would think that there is a thread on this.

Of course if any of you have other advices or ideas it would be great :)

Thanks,
Florian 'Venom'
Click to expand...

You have already shown what the quest for perfection can yield. Otherwise you couldn't do what you do. I watch your vids and keep saying, "the kid is crazy. How do you think that up? Holy shiiiiiiiiit." I am a fan of what you do.

The quest for perfection is tough. If it was easy, everyone could do it.

In a way, you remind me of bluesman, Jonny Lang. At an early age, he basically locked himself away in his room and came out as a great blues artist/musician. That's what I see in you.

You are amazing!
 
Neil,

That is some fantastic advice there.. I never thought of it that way but you are so correct..

The weakest part of my game in the past has been my mental game but it's getting better at a quick pace thanks to David Sapolis.. He turned me on to Advanced Sports Imagery.. Listening to these exercises has helped me immensely. Thanks for your advice as well..


Neil said:
The pressure is only there if YOU put it there! That comes from labeling things. Something we tend to do, but in pool, it is a bad thing. Don't label anything. There are no easy shots, and there are no hard shots. Just shots. There is no pressure if you just learn to play the table and not your opponent.

Pressure is a bad thing in pool.Many will tell you they play better under pressure. I do too.:embarrassed2: But, I do from years of bad habits. You will find you play your best when you just try and play your best. Don't put labels on anything. Just put ALL your focus into performing. Then, let the chips fall where they will. No matter the outcome, you will know for certain that you did your best.
Click to expand...
 
Venomtrickshots said:
Hi guys, as some of you might now i'm now hardly working on getting a better stroke and especially more pure technically and I was wondering if some of you have ideas on some points:

1) Do someone have an idea how to simulate the shaking hand you 've got in a tournament and try to practice with the same sensation of stress? i'm already trying somethings without success for now lol

2) About the speed of the stroke, i'm already practicing with a heavier cue and sometimes even weights in the arm to build this, but do someone know anything else?

3) Do someone have something to force you making the perfect elbow and shoulder movements?

4) to finish, about the loose grip, I noticed in artistic billiard (carom table) there is a guy using like a 'reverse' stroke. I'll try to explain but, usually you held your cue loose and automatically finish tighter at the end of the motion, this guy make the opposite and has a hell of a stroke (tight grip hand at the beginning and almost no grip by the end)... So basically I'm just wondering what you guys think about it and also how to work on that movement, totally new for me...

Of course if any of you have other advices or ideas it would be great :)

Thanks,
Florian 'Venom'
Click to expand...

For every hour you practice, make sure 1/2 of that is shooting with your eyes closed on the final stroke.

If your stance is not natural for you, you will feel how uncomfortable it is when shooting blind. Then find a stance you like that promotes following through straight.

If you grip is not right, then you will feel it going off line during the shot. You will most likely find that shooting loose as a goose (with a light grip) will work well. Keep shooting until you find a grip that you feel comfortable with.

The loose as a goose and smooth acting will help you make balls shooting blind folded. Then when you switch to shooting with your eyes open, you will be amazed how smooth and straight your stroke will be.

Finally, I shortened my bridge lenth to about 8 inches max. It is so tempting to go for a long Miserack bridge as it feels so good, but for accuracy that doesn't work for me.

Good luck.
 
For the simulated stress and hand shaking, I find myself trying to imagine myself beating my arch nemesis in the pool hall and focusing really on how much I hate them. Imagine them in the room with you just watching your every move. I can't really describe it any other way, but it really gets my heart thumping and I find myself missing shots. I'm still doing this on a regular basis and working through it so I can play under stressful conditions.
 
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Neil said:
The pressure is only there if YOU put it there! That comes from labeling things. Something we tend to do, but in pool, it is a bad thing. Don't label anything. There are no easy shots, and there are no hard shots. Just shots. There is no pressure if you just learn to play the table and not your opponent.

Pressure is a bad thing in pool.Many will tell you they play better under pressure. I do too.:embarrassed2: But, I do from years of bad habits. You will find you play your best when you just try and play your best. Don't put labels on anything. Just put ALL your focus into performing. Then, let the chips fall where they will. No matter the outcome, you will know for certain that you did your best.
Click to expand...

Hello Neil,
You put it in direct perspective where it should. I like your advice. Thanks Neil.
Regards,
Lock N Load.
 
Believe it or not

Do as many pushups as your able and immediately start shooting straight shots. It will not only build a great stroke but will also get you in shape. This really works, it was told to me my an old player who shot pretty straight.
 
First learn what the "perfect" alignment is. There are differing opinions on how to align correctly.

Second read genomachino's kind of recent post on eye dominance

Third figure out how to make your arm alignment work with your eye dominance and body position. Start with the alignment of your stroke arm and figure out how to position your head to get your eyes in the right place. Build around that to figure out your legs and body. A lot of people just find a pro who has their build and copy them. Either way a video camera helps a lot with this.
 
A while back, I recall reading about some adjustable strap that fit on an extra cue stick. You adjusted the strap so that your upper arm fitted into it. It kept your shoulder up while you shot and prevented the shoulder from dropping. It supposedly improved your stroke.
 
alignment

Venomtrickshots as Trent suggested a beer bottle laid on its side provides an opening to consistently shoot for with your practice stroke. I heard this many years ago and have tried it from time to time. There is a newer device on the market that I feel is better than a bottle. Its called a "Buddy Hall cue guide". It is a plastic tube with a flat plate on either end that is adjustable for height so the opening can be angled slightly up from the table and not flat. It is handy to carry and you can check your stroke anytime. I have purchased several on Ebay for around $10 or so and they make a great gift. Try one and try 25 strokes eyes open and then work up to 25 eyes closed and see if your stroke stay as you want it. Dont stop at 25 lol. I feel they are a good investment. JJ
 
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