Trivial topic for discussion

3andstop

3andstop

Focus
Silver Member
Hi all, I thought I'd post a topic for discussion that really is neither here nor there, but I'd be interested in other 14.1 players point of view on it.

With straight pool being such a wonderful and pure game, I'm curious what you all think about the call your pocket rule where the player missed the shot in the corner so badly it goes 4 rails right back in, and of course counts.

Should the rule be addressed for this situation or simply left as is?
 
The only way you can address it is to play "call everything" ie. bar room rules.

I don't think it's too big an issue, it's only ever happened to me once, and I've only ever seen it once.
 
He called the "X" ball in the corner pocket and he made the "X" ball in the corner pocket. Good shot. It wasn't a break shot by any chance, was it?

If the ball goes into the called pocket, it's good.
 
Paul Dayton said:
He called the "X" ball in the corner pocket and he made the "X" ball in the corner pocket. Good shot. It wasn't a break shot by any chance, was it?

If the ball goes into the called pocket, it's good.
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Just the way it is. I've had that happen to me before on the break shot. Miss and all the way around and back again. Doesn't happen that often.
 
Like in nine ball in that sense i think the rule should be left the same it adds that luck sense to the game that makes you play that much harder to not let your opponent back to the table to make that kind of shot on you. Perhaps play that safety a little tighter or make sure you bear down on the cut shot to make sure you stay at the table.
 
Luck plays a part in every game and the breaks even out. Better players beat lucky players.

The rules in straight pool have been the same for the better part of a century and no one seems to have a problem with them.
 
Personally, I don't think it happens with enough frequency to warrant being changed. It doesn't happen even a 10th as often as someone shitting in the 9-ball. In all my years of playing I've seen luck like that play into it less than a handful of times. If it happened more often I may feel that it needs to be changed but you gotta give people a little leeway with luck somtimes and like I said, it doesn't happen enough to warrant making a change.
MULLY
 
3andstop said:
Hi all, I thought I'd post a topic for discussion that really is neither here nor there, but I'd be interested in other 14.1 players point of view on it.

With straight pool being such a wonderful and pure game, I'm curious what you all think about the call your pocket rule where the player missed the shot in the corner so badly it goes 4 rails right back in, and of course counts.

Should the rule be addressed for this situation or simply left as is?
Click to expand...

As others have said - rules are fine as they are.
One comment, I'm not in favor of rules that try to cover every
conceivable situation that could ever come up.

IMHO - the idea should be that rules are written for people who
play and understand the game well. Being unambiguous is a requirement.

As a side note 'call shot', defined as designating ball and pocket,
is plenty restrictive enough - I have never been entirely convinced
calling shots adds anything to the game as played by anyone other
than ball bangers.

Neither Snooker nor One Pocket require calling shots - I don't think
better players loose matches in those games due to luck.
FWIW - I would only hope a weaker opponent would try to luck balls in.

Dale
 
pdcue said:
As a side note 'call shot', defined as designating ball and pocket,
is plenty restrictive enough - I have never been entirely convinced
calling shots adds anything to the game as played by anyone other
than ball bangers.
Dale
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I don't know. I've had balls go in that, admittedly, I didn't see lined up that way. My opponent saw it and thought that's what I was shooting at. It happens. I'm honest enough that when something like that happens I own up to it. But let's face reality, there are some sneaky bastards out there that would continue shooting as if nothing odd had happened so I'm not against calling shots that aren't clear.

By the way, when I play straight pool we only call shots if there is any question as to what we're going to do. We also call banks. Other than that it's pretty obvious and no need for calling.
MULLY
 
My feeling is that it should be left as is also, but for another reason. Only because the fix seems more problematic than the ailment. If there was a way to state it simply without confusing jawed pocket shots, kiss shots and so on, I think I'd be for the change.

Its true, it happens so infrequently it really isn't an issue. But ... when it does happen to you, and it's from a break shot that splatters the balls all over the table, and you watch the object ball go around the table like a pinball, and your opponent continues shooting with a real chance to get out ... It has you sitting down, staring at the ceiling, looking for a place to hang the noose. :)
 
I agree that the rule shouldn't be changed. I haven't seen this mentioned yet, so here is my reasoning.

There are some shots that are arguably sloppy, but not actually lucky. For example, in bank pool you call a one rail bank, but the side rail guides the ball in. This is not slop. If you move to a "call everything" bar style, you give this type of shot. Another example, more likely for straight pool: There is a ball next to / in the pocket, making it big. I don't think you should have to call hitting that ball, especially when it would help you not to hit it.

There are shots where you might be 100% to make the shot, but have literally no idea whether you will make it clean or not. I don't think a good player should be penalized by those.

In my opinion the only logical way to eliminate the rare, 4 rail slop shot is to eliminate these other reasonable shots as well. I don't think it would be worth it.
 
3andstop said:
Hi all, I thought I'd post a topic for discussion that really is neither here nor there, but I'd be interested in other 14.1 players point of view on it.

With straight pool being such a wonderful and pure game, I'm curious what you all think about the call your pocket rule where the player missed the shot in the corner so badly it goes 4 rails right back in, and of course counts.

Should the rule be addressed for this situation or simply left as is?
Click to expand...

Stop-man,
I vote for leave it as is.

It's happened to me twice, and I've done it to my opponent once. Over 5 years playing a LOT of straight pool, that's not too bad.
 
Calling a shot gets to every nuiance of the interaction of the balls, ie. calling caroms, combos, and other non-direct opportunities. When calling dead shots out of a cluster or a full rack, who is to say what balls react first or what ball touches another? How could you ever really call a shot like that and not have it be "open to interpretation" as to what really occurred? It such cases, calling the pocket is the only sensible solution and thus the only practical way to play our game.
 
Calling a shot gets to every nuiance of the interaction of the balls, ie. calling caroms, combos, and other non-direct opportunities. When calling dead shots out of a cluster or a full rack, who is to say what balls react first or what ball touches another? How could you ever really call a shot like that and not have it be "open to interpretation" as to what really occurred? It such cases, calling the pocket is the only sensible solution and thus the only practical way to play our game.
 
mullyman said:
I don't know. I've had balls go in that, admittedly, I didn't see lined up that way. My opponent saw it and thought that's what I was shooting at. It happens. I'm honest enough that when something like that happens I own up to it. But let's face reality, there are some sneaky bastards out there that would continue shooting as if nothing odd had happened so I'm not against calling shots that aren't clear.

By the way, when I play straight pool we only call shots if there is any question as to what we're going to do. We also call banks. Other than that it's pretty obvious and no need for calling.
MULLY
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I wasn't refering to sneakin' balls you didn't call - rather, not calling
balls at all.

As I said:

you don't call balls in One pocket
you don't call balls in Snooker

If I were a hundred ball runner - I would only love to play
someone who played the speed I play now, who tried to fram into the balls
and hope to luck something in.

Dale
 
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The only shots I ever see called are bank shots,; out of a pack/rack shots,and kiss shots that depend on the kiss to change or to establish the path the object ball is travelling.

I've seen the 4 rail shot that started this thread maybe 10 times in 50 years. The rules are fine.
 
Hi Folks,

I'm for leaving the rules as they are. In all my playing years, I remember only once my opponent missed a break shot and, because the cue ball was on a path to scratch, kicked the object ball back into the correct pocket. In nine ball, I see it all the time. The dreaded four railer or worse, the across the short rail into the other corner pocket shot. Oh well. You can't make every shot. Or can you:cool: ????

Lyn
 
I am surprised the rule hasn't been changed in all these years. luck should play no part in this game.
As long it does the hard part after lucking in a ball for me is not feeling guilty and taking advantage of the situation. Like 3 and stop says it often happens on a break shot....
lucky shots happen all the time> In tennis the ball sometimes skips over the net, right over your opponents racket.
Lucky goals in hockey that riccochet of someones skate.
bad bounces off the infield grass in baseball
in snooker I believe it is called a fluke
the list goes on.
personally, I say leave it alone. I look foward to my next stroke of luck. I will give a cursory appology and get on with running out the rest of the game.
steven
 
call shot vs call pocket

I dont think it would be worth it to change from call pocket to call shot for the occasional misshapp since it would mean calling every carrom and combo,number of rails...
 
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