Plenty of "amateur" (but with prize money) golf tournaments are decided by a "putt off" in the event of a tie because the course is already booked for other players.
Two Pro Tours/Mindsets/Rules/Formats....Again!
- Thread starter Island Drive
- Start date
Businesses should and do only work together when they feel it is in their best interest to do so. There are occasions where working together is beneficial, and when it is they do, but the vase majority of the time working cooperatively with other businesses would be detrimental to your own.
Agree - that's why I said "work alongside". It's why you open a bar near other bars - it's a win-win for everyone.
Yeah I see how successfully it worked. Pool is a main stream sport, millions are watching every weekend, players have more money than they can spend, etc. Yup, the formats of the past have been stunningly successful.
I couldn't disagree with you more. A strategy of making sure you never do anything that has ever been done in the past would have a better chance for success than trying to duplicate the past.
No, they really don't. They talk to each other to see where they can find common ground that would be good for themselves and also the game, but if it isn't good for themselves first and foremost they don't nor should they do it.
If you want to be looking out for the sport's best interest then start a charity. That is what charities do, look out for somebody else's best interests.
As far as the WPA goes specifically, they are an inept, incompetent, harmful organization with little relevance and they need to go away. In the best interest of the themselves and the sport, everybody should be refusing to work with the WPA in an effort to expedite their exit. The WPA should then be replaced with an organization that is actually competent and beneficial and that fulfills the role that the WPA should have been fulfilling.
And like I said, when they feel it is beneficial to themselves they will do it. It is rare that working with other businesses is beneficial though, and instead it is usually harmful.
So what would you recommend?
Well when a McDonalds opened, it always worked well for a Burger King to open close by.
MR and Predator should just ignore them completely like they don't exist. Who gives a crap about the do nothing organizations that only collect $$$.
I would suggest doing something different than what has already been done for decades and decades and been proven not to work. You have got to start changing all the various things there are and see which of the new changes gets desired results.
It is like that old (but very true) cliche says, "the definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over but expecting different results". Your suggestion to go back and copy the way they used to do things sounds like the absolute worst advice possible unless your goal is to guarantee continued failure.
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That isn't businesses working together. Businesses working together would be like if say all the promoters got together and agreed to use a certain game, format, rules, equipment specs, etc, that they would all use--you know, kind of like what you are suggesting they do with this thread you created.
Your McDonald's example is more like one promoter seeing that another promoter has been extremely successful with the game/rules/specs/etc that they have been using and so they decide to copy them. That isn't working together, that is just good business decision making done solely for self serving purposes. Not only was it not in any way cooperative, but it was done so you could better compete against them.
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But they never got in bed together.
Food service works good in clusters-food courts etc. However notice they are are separate businesses. Even Yum brands keep their different businesses separate over 90% of the time.
Poolplayer quote:
''copy the way they used to do things sounds like the absolute worst advice possible''
That's somewhat true....
In the Major 9 ball events, races to 11 dbl elimination has proven it's success through time.
It's created this game....It only takes a good hour/seldom 2, for two pros to chop through a set.
But maybe this is NOT the preferred format.
THEN WHAT IS?????
Why don't we get all the pros together at the major events this year and ask em?
I'd prefer that, than always having the promoter of American pool do it the samo/way and not work together
What format would work best.... for the game, for the player, and Especially for the AUDIENCE/VIEWER.
Make sure the time lines between matches is easily scheduled.
It's critical to give the audience time to stretch, use the facilities, and too get a snack before play resumes, when the best are playing.
Even if you don't like 9 ball, or 10 or???
That's not the point.
We need to EVOLVE this turtle
We still HAVE to get to first base....
We have to crawl first... like we've been doing for my entire lifetime.
''copy the way they used to do things sounds like the absolute worst advice possible''
That's somewhat true....
In the Major 9 ball events, races to 11 dbl elimination has proven it's success through time.
It's created this game....It only takes a good hour/seldom 2, for two pros to chop through a set.
But maybe this is NOT the preferred format.
THEN WHAT IS?????
Why don't we get all the pros together at the major events this year and ask em?
I'd prefer that, than always having the promoter of American pool do it the samo/way and not work together
What format would work best.... for the game, for the player, and Especially for the AUDIENCE/VIEWER.
Make sure the time lines between matches is easily scheduled.
It's critical to give the audience time to stretch, use the facilities, and too get a snack before play resumes, when the best are playing.
Even if you don't like 9 ball, or 10 or???
That's not the point.
We need to EVOLVE this turtle
We still HAVE to get to first base....
We have to crawl first... like we've been doing for my entire lifetime.
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I need what you're vaping! This was great!
You seem to have invented Greek Beatnik Rap. Diggit.
No such thing. Golf is one of the few sports left that clearly defines 'amateur status'. You can't be an amateur and accept prize money. https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-of-amateur-status.html#!rule-03 Can accept a prize or voucher worth no more than 750bux.
But...but...but....they maintain a calendar and sanctioning of world titles. What would the pool world do if they didn't get their cut off the top of the player's earnings?
We must have a different definition of success. Can you point to the moment in time where that format permanently brought large viewing numbers and money to the sport? Because anything less, including that it was permanent, would be hard to argue as a success.
Heck, can you point to any moment in time where that format brought large numbers of viewers and good money to the sport for any period of time at all? Simply going back to double elimination races to 11 sounds like a losing proposition to me. It is time to try something different to see if something new can get better results because doing the same things over and over and expecting different results is absolute insanity.
Asking all the pros what to do is only a good idea if your plan is to do the opposite of whatever they say. In that case it might actually be a half decent plan. Seriously, no offence, but the pros have an extensive history of being wrong about almost everything regarding how they've wanted things to be, and an extensive history of never being able to do anything right. If you want guaranteed failure, let the pros have a large say in how pool is done and run.
Well they aren't going to work together for the betterment of the sport so you need to just get that idea out of your head. Only charities do that kind of thing because that is their purpose as opposed to that being the exact opposite of their purpose as is the case with businesses. You want a charity to help pool so bad that for the life of me I can't figure out why you haven't started one yet but rest assured only a charity is going to do the things you want.
You hit the nail on the head here. Couldn't agree more. Instead of the "ask the pros" silliness you proposed above, the right answer is to see what the fans want, because that is who makes things a success or not. And not pool players or current pool fans because that is a limited base and for the most part all the pool players that would want to watch already do anyway. No, we need to know what would get the average non pool player out there to watch. Before anybody says it isn't possible, snooker did just that. The average snooker viewer is your grandma, not your league teammate. We have to find out what is going to make pool appealing to people in general and then make those changes even if they wouldn't have been our personal preferences.
We don't yet know what all of those changes will need to be which is why we have to try various things and see what works because what works isn't always obvious to people (and sometimes quite the opposite) nor do people even really know for themselves most of the time even if they think they do (what they think they would like and what they would actually end up finding most appealing are often very different) so the benefit to asking only goes so far, you have to actually try the various things.
One thing that has been proven to help 100% of the time is to let the audience get to know a bit more about the players backgrounds and their personalities. People need a reason to care, a reason to want to root for or against people. See the post below for a little bit more on the topic. This one is a no brainer that always helps (and is done by every other sport, and every other type of programming in existence) and yet almost nobody is doing it or has done it with pool.
Could Joe Rogan help with pool?
I know he has said in the past the problem with trying to have a podcast with pool as the topic would be too short or not interesting enough. I get that but with Jayson now having the top run in 14:1 and Rogan being a decent player that understands the game do you think he could make it happen...
forums.azbilliards.com
The good news is that we finally have some people who are willing to actually try some new things, so our chances of growing pool are greater than ever as a result. CSI, Predator, and FargoRate are trying very new things with the US Pro Billiard Series and seemingly having some success with those changes it would seem. Matchroom is also trying some new things in the way pool is done and presented and indications are they are having some success with some of those changes too. Time will tell if the newer things these companies and promoters are trying will prove to be long term successes or not, and while we certainly don't always have to prefer and like and want to fight for every new change they try, we should absolutely be supporting that they are trying new things even knowing that we are not going to end up liking all of them because that is what is ultimately going to benefit the sport.
Home - Matchroom Pool
matchroompool.com
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Yes I am aware of the rules surrounding golf. Hence ' "amateur" '. I hope the double quotation marks makes even more sense.