Unethical or Just Lucky?

[poolplayer2093]

Hu, you are a pretty level headed guy. Kudos man, I would have gone off on these guys, but you stayed pretty even keeled.

Funny how the guy with no ethics sees racism in your posts.

What'd i say that would have made you "go off" on me?

 

[poolplayer2093]

Sam is showing the same bias against southerners and the pickle still can't read. Sam is showing quite a bias against many of the businesses I have been in too since I have owned mechanic shops, auto body shops, auto salvages, and a wrecker service as well as a few more auto related businesses. Most people in all of these businesses are ethical and those that are take a very dim view of those that aren't.

One of my friends was a customer of mine from 1970. He traded with me when I had a service station, mechanic shop, and body shop. He is a leading business consultant in the south and very knowledgeable about vehicles since he has a small farm and built, maintained, and raced his own cars for many years. Obviously not someone that I could have cheated for decades and he not be aware of it. He was featured on the entire top half of the front page of the business section of a major newspaper complete with a full color 8x10 picture when they featured an outstanding businessman each week for black business month. I feel real slighted that in all the years that the paper has been doing that they have never once featured one of my white friends that own businesses or myself during black business month. Could it be that race matters?

Hu

i'd just like to say that i haven't said anything "against" southerners. as for the business you've been in i'm sure you may have been really honest but that doesn't come close to the majority of people in the business.

you'd be hard pressed to find someone on here that's never been overcharged by a mechanic/ cardealer. i pointed those out to make a point. the point being that there're plenty of businesses out there that are less than honest and people just understand and move on. nobody harps on them like they would this fictional character that made a little coin in a cue deal with an old woman.

i must've seen 2-3 shows (20/20..etc) showing how carsalesmen/repair men always try to overcharge women.

if you feel cheated that you weren't in a black business magazine you should write the editor. the reason there's a black business month and not a white business month is because there's such a small community of black businessmen (a guess). i guess you could relate it to "veterans day" you never hear non veterans complaining that there's no "non-veterans day". i picked veterans because it's another small group of people in the us

 

[poolplayer2093]

Hu, you are a pretty level headed guy. Kudos man, I would have gone off on these guys, but you stayed pretty even keeled.

Funny how the guy with no ethics sees racism in your posts.

ask anyone on here i've done business with on here if i've ever tried to pull one over on them. you don't even know me and you say i have no ethics?

i didn't say i saw racism in his post. i said it would have made just as much if not more sense if he would have left race out of it.

it seems like you're looking for a jerk where there isn't one

 

[JB Cases]

another example of a people that do what they can to make money. these people aren't considered despicable.

i think all the people on here that insist that what the cue dealer did was so horrible must have too much money. or maybe they've just forgot what it's like to want for things they probably won't be eve able to afford

Um no, we don't have too much money nor do we "forget" what it's like to want for things.

We just know that the way to get things is not to resort to theft and deception.

For you to generalize everyone like this just because they won't ever see that KCD did anything close to "right" or even justifiable is really not fair.

Preying on ignorant and naive people is despicable.

A guy walks into a strip club he knows that he is in for a performance and the more convincing they are the more he pays. She is doing her job and he is paying her to do it.

If the same stripper targets a mark outside of the strip club - someone who she never met and bleeds him dry with fake affection then she ripped him off. She is being an evil thief and he is an unwilling victim.

In my business I get people all the time who say - I want the best grade of leather - I will pay extra for it - just had a customer ask for that. I use the top grade leather all the time anyway - should I have taken the couple hundred extra the customer was offering?

No, I told the customer that I wouldn't take any extra money for doing something that I do anyway. If I had a better class of leather or was able to get anything better than what I already had then I would have offered that. But the thought of taking the extra money when the customer would NEVER know the difference in the first place never crossed my mind. And this was a very recent case I made and the customer can choose to speak up on this if they want to.

According to you though this would have been ok. Just making that money any way possible. Is that what you are saying? That any form of deception is ok to make money?

 

[JB Cases]

i'd just like to say that i haven't said anything "against" southerners. as for the business you've been in i'm sure you may have been really honest but that doesn't come close to the majority of people in the business.

you'd be hard pressed to find someone on here that's never been overcharged by a mechanic/ cardealer. i pointed those out to make a point. the point being that there're plenty of businesses out there that are less than honest and people just understand and move on. nobody harps on them like they would this fictional character that made a little coin in a cue deal with an old woman.

i must've seen 2-3 shows (20/20..etc) showing how carsalesmen/repair men always try to overcharge women.

if you feel cheated that you weren't in a black business magazine you should write the editor. the reason there's a black business month and not a white business month is because there's such a small community of black businessmen (a guess). i guess you could relate it to "veterans day" you never hear non veterans complaining that there's no "non-veterans day". i picked veterans because it's another small group of people in the us

You keep making statements that amount to "it's the way it is so just accept it" or "it's the status quo and no one cares". Obviously by the responses here people do care. And in many individual situations people who got cheated and found out about it attempt to get justice through the courts. Small claims court, Judge Judy??? Filing charges. Outing the cheaters through the media and websites, filing a claim with the BBB, filing a chargeback with the credit card company......and so on.

So it's not correct to say that people are apathetic about situations like this. People fight back all the time. If it's "just the way it is" and no one cares then why do all the shows like 20/20 spend time exposing the practices and educating people how to avoid getting scammed?

 

[poolplayer2093]

Um no, we don't have too much money nor do we "forget" what it's like to want for things.

We just know that the way to get things is not to resort to theft and deception.

For you to generalize everyone like this just because they won't ever see that KCD did anything close to "right" or even justifiable is really not fair.

Preying on ignorant and naive people is despicable.

A guy walks into a strip club he knows that he is in for a performance and the more convincing they are the more he pays. She is doing her job and he is paying her to do it.

If the same stripper targets a mark outside of the strip club - someone who she never met and bleeds him dry with fake affection then she ripped him off. She is being an evil thief and he is an unwilling victim.

In my business I get people all the time who say - I want the best grade of leather - I will pay extra for it - just had a customer ask for that. I use the top grade leather all the time anyway - should I have taken the couple hundred extra the customer was offering?

No, I told the customer that I wouldn't take any extra money for doing something that I do anyway. If I had a better class of leather or was able to get anything better than what I already had then I would have offered that. But the thought of taking the extra money when the customer would NEVER know the difference in the first place never crossed my mind. And this was a very recent case I made and the customer can choose to speak up on this if they want to.

According to you though this would have been ok. Just making that money any way possible. Is that what you are saying? That any form of deception is ok to make money?

strippers know that the more they get someone to believe they have a chance with them the more cash they get.

 

[poolpro]

It's not about the amount of money. It's about the assumed deception on the part of KCD.

You know exactly what this is about.

I will put in other terms for you since someone else put up a $500 Searing as an example.

If someone put up a for sale ad and said Dennis Searing $500 then EVERYONE would assume that person knew what they had and had their own reasons for selling it at far below market value.

However if someone put up a post that said HELP ME identify this cue's value and the first person who responded said, that looks a lot like a no-name import cue WHEN THEY KNEW FULL WELL THAT IT'S A SEARING and asked for a price and then got a price well below market value then they LIED to the person in order to get the cue.

If you LIE or CHEAT or DELIBERATELY MISLEAD in order to gain financially then you are being unethical. That may be "just business", it may be "legal", it may be "the way it's done", but it's still not right. That was the original question that this story asked, unethical or not? The answer is unethical - IF KCD was being asked for his HONEST opinion as to the cue's identity and value and he KNEW exactly what it was but downplayed it to get it cheap.

I am definitely not ruthless enough to ever get really rich I guess.

I am the one who mentioned the searing for $500.


I have to say that I agree with your distiction. The logic is very good. There is a difference in the two examples.

I also have to agree with the fact that in the original example it is indeed an unethical practice. Very well stated.

Jw

 

[bumpypickle]

You still don't get it.

Sam is showing the same bias against southerners and the pickle still can't read. Sam is showing quite a bias against many of the businesses I have been in too since I have owned mechanic shops, auto body shops, auto salvages, and a wrecker service as well as a few more auto related businesses. Most people in all of these businesses are ethical and those that are take a very dim view of those that aren't.

One of my friends was a customer of mine from 1970. He traded with me when I had a service station, mechanic shop, and body shop. He is a leading business consultant in the south and very knowledgeable about vehicles since he has a small farm and built, maintained, and raced his own cars for many years. Obviously not someone that I could have cheated for decades and he not be aware of it. He was featured on the entire top half of the front page of the business section of a major newspaper complete with a full color 8x10 picture when they featured an outstanding businessman each week for black business month. I feel real slighted that in all the years that the paper has been doing that they have never once featured one of my white friends that own businesses or myself during black business month. Could it be that race matters?

Hu

Race only matters to racist people Hu. You still didn't answer my question and instead gave another story about who you know and how much you have accomplished in life. The fact that there is something called " black business month" and you had a buddy that was featured means nothing. If a newspaper does an article on a business owner because of their race it should be shut down. If they want to do an article on a business owner based on their business practices, that's different. I had an article written about my business a few years ago and nowhere in the article was it necessary to write that I was a white guy. Don't you get it? The Miss Asian USA pageant, Miss Black USA pageant, BET, Howard University, La Raza, The KKK, etc. are all racist organizations that promote one race over others and are in the business of racism, not eliminating racism. Why not say how tall or short the woman was? Because it's not relevant, just like her race.

 

[Dartman]

Wondering what strip clubs and strippers has to do with cue sales.

 

[poolplayer2093]

Race only matters to racist people Hu. You still didn't answer my question and instead gave another story about who you know and how much you have accomplished in life. The fact that there is something called " black business month" and you had a buddy that was featured means nothing. If a newspaper does an article on a business owner because of their race it should be shut down. If they want to do an article on a business owner based on their business practices, that's different. I had an article written about my business a few years ago and nowhere in the article was it necessary to write that I was a white guy. Don't you get it? The Miss Asian USA pageant, Miss Black USA pageant, BET, Howard University, La Raza, The KKK, etc. are all racist organizations that promote one race over others and are in the business of racism, not eliminating racism. Why not say how tall or short the woman was? Because it's not relevant, just like her race.

i wouldn't call the Ms. asian usa pagent and Ms. black usa pagent BET...etc (with the exception being the KKK) are racist organizations. they were started to recognize and represent smaller groups of americans that might otherwise go unrecognized.

 

[bumpypickle]

A clearer picture?

He didn't have to is pickles opinion. It's part of the story.... and it paints a clearer picture about the story to me.

So if he wrote how tall/short, fat/skinny, bad teeth/good teeth, maybe she had a bum leg or a little mole on her neck, it would have made it even more clear I guess.

 

[bumpypickle]

Wrong.

i wouldn't call the Ms. asian usa pagent and Ms. black usa pagent BET...etc (with the exception being the KKK) are racist organizations. they were started to recognize and represent smaller groups of americans that might otherwise go unrecognized.

Any organization that promotes one race over others is a racist organization plain and simple. What do you think would happen if someone tried to start a "white miss Usa pageant"? Or tried to have a bodybuilding competition and limited it to whites only? The outcry would be heard around the world and well deserved.

 

[Cuephoric]

How many people think a pool cue is worth more than a a few hundred dollars, other than people in the know like on this this message board?

As said, the real crime if any is the original owner not informing his spouse as to the value of the cue.

I've had cues in the past that I definately didn't want my wife to know how much I paid for.....
Of course, if I still had them, and something should happen to me, she knows enough of the dealers and colelctors by now to have a good enough idea. And "The Bible" sits next to my keyboard.
After the ebay incident last year, she's a bit more careful with my collectibles.

But I would have to say that in this "Hypethetical" situation, that theft by fraud would be the scenerio.
You don't rob the ignorant in situations like this.
It's our job, to inform and educate people that have less experience or knowledge about things in our expertise, if asked.
Anything else, is just looking out for number one, and Karma has her own way of repaying those debts.:wink:
The very least he could have done was to go back and give her at least half of it out of the blue, as I'm sure it would have been appreciated.
Karma takes care of those ,too.....

 

[bumpypickle]

Good job.

i think what bumpy pickle is saying is that shooting arts didn't have to bring up her race. he could just as easily said that the woman was old and close to illiterate.

i used to run into this a lot when i was around a lot of southerners (a lot of marines are from the south). instead of saying a big guy walked into the room, it's always mentioned that a big "black" guy walked into the room. if the woman in the story had been white i don't think it would have been mentioned.

i think it's subconscious

Exactly. But don't just substitute racism for "subconscious", it's a little deeper than that.

 

[Fred]

Not enough info.

"Hypothetical" scenario.

A widow is disposing of some of her recently-deceased husband's possessions, including an old pool cue. The cue-ignorant widow is advised to contact Knowledgeable Cue Dealer (KCD) to discuss the cue. KCD goes to her house, inspects the cue, and asks her how much she wants for it. She says she doesn't know, it has just been lying around in the attic for most of the past 35 years, .............., how about $250? KCD pays her the money and leaves with the cue.

The next day, KCD calls one of his cue-collecting customers and sells the highly inlaid Balabushka cue for $25,000.

Was KCD unethical, just lucky, or something else?

If the old widow is dirt poor because her alchaholic, pool playing husband, wasted every penny he could get his hands on, then KCD should burn in hell.

If the old widow is rich because her A-hole husband put the screws to anybody and eveybody he could his entire life, then KCD is my hero.



Justin Nuder

 

[poolpro]

Race only matters to racist people Hu. You still didn't answer my question and instead gave another story about who you know and how much you have accomplished in life. The fact that there is something called " black business month" and you had a buddy that was featured means nothing. If a newspaper does an article on a business owner because of their race it should be shut down. If they want to do an article on a business owner based on their business practices, that's different. I had an article written about my business a few years ago and nowhere in the article was it necessary to write that I was a white guy. Don't you get it? The Miss Asian USA pageant, Miss Black USA pageant, BET, Howard University, La Raza, The KKK, etc. are all racist organizations that promote one race over others and are in the business of racism, not eliminating racism. Why not say how tall or short the woman was? Because it's not relevant, just like her race.

Bro,,,, GET OVER IT!!


If race only matters to racist people, than you are the biggest one in here! You are the one who turned it into a huge issue, and will not let it go. Your further rant about race seems to back it up.


It was his story, he is free to tell it however he chooses with as many or as few details as he wishes. If he chose to say what color house she lived in, it does not matter.

I am white. If I tell a story, I might say " a goofy looking white guy came in wearing a pink sleeveless shirt........" So what? I am trying to paint a picture. The fact that the guy was white and wearing a pink shirt may have NOTHING to do with the actual story, but it gives a better overall picture of what is happening and to whom.

I was talking recently about something that happened many years ago. It was about driving. It was not important to the story that I was driving my 72 gold cutlass with the chrome superstock rims, but I put it in there anyway. I could have just said " I was going fast". I wanted to paint a more detailed picture. That is what storytelling is.

Do you want to read a book that says " A long time ago some things happened to some people.... The END." Or would you like a bit more details?


Get over it, move on. You are reading way too much into ot.

We get what you are trying to say, and you are looking more ridiculous everytime you say it.


Jw

 

[Jadssons]

Any organization that promotes one race over others is a racist organization plain and simple. What do you think would happen if someone tried to start a "white miss Usa pageant"? Or tried to have a bodybuilding competition and limited it to whites only? The outcry would be heard around the world and well deserved.

What about the BET tv channel? Do you consider this reverse racism?

 

[poolplayer2093]

Any organization that promotes one race over others is a racist organization plain and simple. What do you think would happen if someone tried to start a "white miss Usa pageant"? Or tried to have a bodybuilding competition and limited it to whites only? The outcry would be heard around the world and well deserved.

those organizations don't promote one race over another. they don't claim that their race is better in any way. they were started because those minority groups weren't represented in the Miss usa pagent. meaning that at one point (talking history here) it wasn't called the "white miss usa pagent" but it was whites only.

 

[JB Cases]

i wouldn't call the Ms. asian usa pagent and Ms. black usa pagent BET...etc (with the exception being the KKK) are racist organizations. they were started to recognize and represent smaller groups of americans that might otherwise go unrecognized.

I would. Because imagine what kind of uproar it would cause if there were a Miss Caucasian or Miss White USA pageant.

Any organization that exists to promote the cause of any particular race to the exclusion of other races is racist. They not be racists in a bad way like the KKK are but they are still racist.

The whole point of America is to have people be recognized as people regardless of their race. To have clubs, contests, and organzations that exclude the participation of all races goes against that principle to me.

 

[JB Cases]

Wondering what strip clubs and strippers has to do with cue sales.

Hang out with the unethical cue dealer who just made a $25K score and you will find out what strippers and cue sales have in common. I bet he -hypothetically - made a few strippers happy that night.