Uv

JoeyInCali said:
Great.
Looks like they have their own sealer too.
http://www.cureuv.com/uv-cure-insulator-sealer-1-quart.html
It's zero VOC ? If it works, that'd be great.
Might have to ask Dick if epoxy base coat is ok too.
Click to expand...

They repackage the van tech stuff. I could never get the sealer to
work. I'd let it dry, then shot the first coat of uv. When I sanded it the next day, the sealer was still wet. I sent a paduak plain jane to
van tech and they were never able to get it to work to my satisfaction.
Nice people to work with, but I didn't like the product.
Koa isolator is the nuts. Just get some bloxygen and small cans for it.
Has a short shelf life if you don't protect it. Don't forget the
pore filler, on some woods, it's an important step. If you don't have a buffer, you'll probably need one. Once you get the hang of it, you will never look back.
 
" Once you get the hang of it, you will never look back. "

I don't remember such an extensive, informative thread on clear coating in a long time - thanks guys.

But it does seem like the hang time is long. :thumbup:

Gary
 
I first tried it in 08 and gave up. Wish I had stayed with it.
Started up again about 1 1/2 years ago. I'll never go back.
As a little bonus, I have not cleaned my uv spray gun since I
started up again. I have the plastic cup blacked out. Just hang it up
till you need it again. But you better clean the heck out of your
isolator gun. That stuff gets hard in a hurry.
 
Got my light and sample pack of finish!

I have cleaned my lathe like its new!
Gotta get all the flammable sawdust out :)

Now to float a coat and see what happens!!!!
Going to be a big night :)
 
Well
After 2 attempts at finishing a coco and ebony cue with my new uv, I don't know what's happening.
I started with a wipe on gel filler coat,
Hit it with the uv.
Seemed like it was dry,
Sanded lightly and applied a bonding agent.
Hit it with the light again,
Light sand
Coat of "wet look" topcoat.
Light again,
Checked it out and it isn't dry....
Seems greasy.....
Run it hard with my finger and it peels off of the coco.
Is this typical?
I'm waiting for the uv finish from unique hope that works better :(
 
cuejo said:
Well
After 2 attempts at finishing a coco and ebony cue with my new uv, I don't know what's happening.
I started with a wipe on gel filler coat,
Hit it with the uv.
Seemed like it was dry,
Sanded lightly and applied a bonding agent.
Hit it with the light again,
Light sand
Coat of "wet look" topcoat.
Light again,
Checked it out and it isn't dry....
Seems greasy.....
Run it hard with my finger and it peels off of the coco.
Is this typical?
I'm waiting for the uv finish from unique hope that works better :(
Click to expand...

This is where you need a real good sealer. Cocobolo, being an especially oily wood, is hard for any finish to cover let alone when there is 1600 deg of temperature being applied. The heat brings the oils to the surface where they mix with the finish so that it doesn't fully harden.

What kind of sealer and finish are you using?

Dick
 
rhncue said:
This is where you need a real good sealer. Cocobolo, being an especially oily wood, is hard for any finish to cover let alone when there is 1600 deg of temperature being applied. The heat brings the oils to the surface where they mix with the finish so that it doesn't fully harden.

What kind of sealer and finish are you using?

Dick
Click to expand...

I just tried the stuff that cure uv sent with the machine.
It doesn't have a name on the label,
Weird thing is, the finish doesn't seem cured. Even on the ebony?
Is the only sealer that works really well, that Koa insulater?
I would hate to have to buy that, not use much and have it go bad :(
 
I'm going to repost what I said earlier
"They repackage the van tech stuff. I could never get the sealer to
work. I'd let it dry, then shot the first coat of uv. When I sanded it the next day, the sealer was still wet. I sent a paduak plain jane to
van tech and they were never able to get it to work to my satisfaction.
Nice people to work with, but I didn't like the product.
Koa isolator is the nuts. Just get some bloxygen and small cans for it.
Has a short shelf life if you don't protect it. Don't forget the
pore filler, on some woods, it's an important step. If you don't have a buffer, you'll probably need one. Once you get the hang of it, you will never look back. "

You must use a sealer first. I use it on every cue, oily or not. I occasionally still shoot a butt or forearm with carcoat (to match the rest of the cue on a repair), the koa isolator works great under it.
If the finish feels gummy then you didn't zap it long enough. IMO stay away from the van tech/ UV cure finish. My first batch of Koa isolator lasted 6 years.(Wasn't using it for 4 of those years.) I had it in quart cans and kept it in a refigerator. When it finally went bad, it started getting small lumps in it. One more thing, you definitely need a mask for the Koa isolator, both mixing and spraying. And just because the finish is UV, don't think you can skip the mask.
 
cutter said:
I'm going to repost what I said earlier
"They repackage the van tech stuff. I could never get the sealer to
work. I'd let it dry, then shot the first coat of uv. When I sanded it the next day, the sealer was still wet. I sent a paduak plain jane to
van tech and they were never able to get it to work to my satisfaction.
Nice people to work with, but I didn't like the product.
Koa isolator is the nuts. Just get some bloxygen and small cans for it.
Has a short shelf life if you don't protect it. Don't forget the
pore filler, on some woods, it's an important step. If you don't have a buffer, you'll probably need one. Once you get the hang of it, you will never look back. "

You must use a sealer first. I use it on every cue, oily or not. I occasionally still shoot a butt or forearm with carcoat (to match the rest of the cue on a repair), the koa isolator works great under it.
If the finish feels gummy then you didn't zap it long enough. IMO stay away from the van tech/ UV cure finish. My first batch of Koa isolator lasted 6 years.(Wasn't using it for 4 of those years.) I had it in quart cans and kept it in a refigerator. When it finally went bad, it started getting small lumps in it. One more thing, you definitely need a mask for the Koa isolator, both mixing and spraying. And just because the finish is UV, don't think you can skip the mask.
Click to expand...

Thanks Steve
Did you try the gel filler from van tech?
I'm guessing that's the stuff they sent me.
I guess I'll have to call and get some of the axon sealer. Doesn't seem like they sell online.
 
Other things to try.
Try wiping down the cue first with denatured alchohol or mek.
Warning-Keep away from thermo-plastics.
Try different distances from cue with the light.
Try using the light for longer periods and or a second time.
I don't think I've ever overcured a finish, just don't let it get to hot so speed up the travel if trying closer distances.
I had one rosewood cue that on the 3rd try after wiping down with regular rubbing alchohol multiple times, finally took a finish. Saw it recently and it still looks good after 7 years.
 
Steve has given a lot of good information. Yes. split up the koa sealer into smaller full cans and refrigerate them and also replace the air in the cans of sealer you are using, ( I have a small nitrogen tank but anything without oxygen should do.)

I have also tried wiping the offending wood down with MEK and alcohol which sometimes works but cannot be done if you have points, veneers or any lighter colored wood in the cue. The oils you wipe away with the solvent get wiped into the lighter wood and look like a neon sign to a mistake when you put on the clear coat. I've fought this messy battle twice and only a carefully used razor blade scraping saved the cues. The solvent wants to bleed a little and you can't be careful enough to avoid the problem and clean the oils away at the same time.

The real truth of the matter is that regardless of how much it might hurt to buy the koa wood sealer, it does work, it doesn't bleed, and you aren't going to screw up a completed cue at the final step. Not screwing up a cue every now and then is worth a pretty penny.

Also inasmuch as it is just a great sealer for all woods and an adhesion promoter as well, I'll just have to break down and go for another gallon set though I don't know where I'll get it again.

One more note, the UV unit pictured by Bassel on page 3 is the same one many of us are using. It cost $1200+, 10 or so years ago and American Ultraviolet is still in business. Their customer service is great and they have regional representatives all over the country. Look them up on the web.

Finally , before you buy any unit that you aren't sure will work to cure the uv on cues, make sure that the bulb is strong enough to do the job. The American uv unit puts out 200 watts per inch so a 6 inch bulb would by 1200 watts. Too weak a bulb won't do the job. I have a friend who, while trying to save money, built himself a wonderful uv curing booth that would handle 6 butts and 12 shafts simultaneously and automatically He saved money by buying a less expensive smaller, weaker light and power supply. He could make/bake really nice cues with spirally cured (barber pole) finishes, but he couldn't do uniformly cured finishes. He's using 2 part urethane finish today and the UV machine is a memory as is the 4 weeks labor and $3,000 he spent.
 
A few things to remember about UV.

If you don't use a sealer, like the insulator from Axon, then some of the clear may soak into the wood. the clear that soaks in, won't get any light, and won't cure. The finish will feel fine, but it may all fall off in a year or two. The Insulator not only keeps the finish from soaking in, but it also gives the UV something to chemically attach to.

The insulator will keep for a long time, as long as you treat it right. I always keep the gallon cans closed until I need to use them, and as soon as I open them I transfer it all to smaller screw top cans like the ones here"

http://www.thecarycompany.com/containers/ScrewTopCans.html

You can also keep the smaller cans cold, and it will drastically lengthen it's life. Axon says it has a 6 month life span, but it really lasts longer than that if you take care of it.

I wouldn't spray UV on anything without first using the Axon insulator.
 
If anyone wants to make a list of people using the insulator to counter the minimum order cost from Axon, by dividing it up....please count me in. I am tired of wasting it myself.
 
Poor Darcy.
Now he needs Koa insulator and another gun. :eek::grin:
You're gonna have to split than insulator as you're not going to consume that gallon. I have a quart and it's a lot ( thanks Dick ).
Keep us updated.
 
GatzkeCues said:
If anyone wants to make a list of people using the insulator to counter the minimum order cost from Axon, by dividing it up....please count me in. I am tired of wasting it myself.
Click to expand...

I would be interested too.....
Maybe someone that has bloxygen will split it up?

I need some super soon too....
Got 4 to finish before Vnea!!!!

This thread is one of the main reasons I love the cues section :)
 
JoeyInCali said:
Poor Darcy.
Now he needs Koa insulator and another gun. :eek::grin:
You're gonna have to split than insulator as you're not going to consume that gallon. I have a quart and it's a lot ( thanks Dick ).
Keep us updated.
Click to expand...

Hey Darcy, you don't really have to get another gun. We use these:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Preval-9-oz-Complete-Spray-Gun-267/202533738#.UXrGb7XueSo

We normally do quite a few at a time, but you can use this for one at a time too. Just mix up a little bit, spray your cue, and empty and clean your sprayer. We just empty it out, put it a little MEK and spray it clean. Then empty the MEK out and turn the sprayer upside down and spray for a second or 2. We can use a can for a couple of weeks that way easy.

If you do want to use a gun for it, just get the cheapo's from Harbor Freight. The insulator will kill them over time, and it's easier to just throw them away when they get nasty.

Royce
 
RBC said:
Hey Darcy, you don't really have to get another gun. We use these:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Preval-9-oz-Complete-Spray-Gun-267/202533738#.UXrGb7XueSo

We normally do quite a few at a time, but you can use this for one at a time too. Just mix up a little bit, spray your cue, and empty and clean your sprayer. We just empty it out, put it a little MEK and spray it clean. Then empty the MEK out and turn the sprayer upside down and spray for a second or 2. We can use a can for a couple of weeks that way easy.

If you do want to use a gun for it, just get the cheapo's from Harbor Freight. The insulator will kill them over time, and it's easier to just throw them away when they get nasty.

Royce
Click to expand...

Thanks Royce
Does everyone spray?
I use a foam brush for everything
 
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