The other day I had this situation during a 9-Ball game. The 8 and cue ball are perfectly frozen on the rail. I tried to pocket the 8 and draw back for the 9. Problem is that I completely missed the 8 and after many attempts after the game, I discovered that it is virtually impossible to make the shot. The cue ball wants to leave the rail immediately no mater how "perfect" I try to shoot it. I even tried to shoot slightly away from the rail with masse to bring it back and could not do it. Any advice?
It's not virtually impossible, it's not that hard at all, in fact you could move the 9 ball down to the other end of the table frozen on the rail and you would have one of the easier proposition shots.
It's not virtually impossible, it's not that hard at all, in fact you could move the 9 ball down to the other end of the table frozen on the rail and you would have one of the easier proposition shots.
It's not virtually impossible, it's not that hard at all, in fact you could move the 9 ball down to the other end of the table frozen on the rail and you would have one of the easier proposition shots.
It's not virtually impossible, it's not that hard at all, in fact you could move the 9 ball down to the other end of the table frozen on the rail and you would have one of the easier proposition shots.
One of the main things with this shot is to get your cue as level as possible. Since the cueball is actually sitting under the nose of the cushion when it is frozen to the rail, any down force on the ball causes it to rebound off of the slate and back up into the cushion above it, which pushes it away from the rail. When the balls are a table length apart the shot is actually easier for me because I can just load it up with inside and play to miss the ball by 1/4" to 1/2". When they are real close together, a level cue is your best bet but it's a ***** to draw the ball with a level cue.
One of the main things with this shot is to get your cue as level as possible. Since the cueball is actually sitting under the nose of the cushion when it is frozen to the rail, any down force on the ball causes it to rebound off of the slate and back up into the cushion above it, which pushes it away from the rail. When the balls are a table length apart the shot is actually easier for me because I can just load it up with inside and play to miss the ball by 1/4" to 1/2". When they are real close together, a level cue is your best bet but it's a ***** to draw the ball with a level cue.
This shot is described in one of Robert Byrne's books as a possible proposition shot. Freeze a ball to the cushion a diamond from the pocket. Freeze the cue ball one diamond farther away. Freeze another object ball a diamond (or half a diamond) farther away, forcing the draw shot to be jacked up. Pocket the first ball and draw to hit the second.
Low right draw. Stroke firmly through the CB to draw CB. Do not pull stick back. Make sure stroke is parallel to cushion. CB should come off of rail and back towards 9B.
8B should stay on rail and into pocket. If you bang this shot instead of a real stroke the 8B will rattle in pocket. Keep trying it . It will start to work for you
So is there some easy bank I'm missing here? P.S. Thanks for the advice Aaron, I never thought about the fact that the cue ball is actually under the rail. Makes sense.
Yes, I will try it.
Would you want to add a few other things like a Diamond table with socks stuck in the pocket in Arizona, when humidity is at a certain % ?
It's a shot, I will shoot it, are you going to come here for me to shoot it?
Surely you don't want me to come to you.
Also, shape is relative and I'd imagine with you adding your stipulations you would argue about what shape is or is not, so are you just betting on the ball being made and the cue ball coming back or forward?
The other day I had this situation during a 9-Ball game. The 8 and cue ball are perfectly frozen on the rail. I tried to pocket the 8 and draw back for the 9. Problem is that I completely missed the 8 and after many attempts after the game, I discovered that it is virtually impossible to make the shot. The cue ball wants to leave the rail immediately no mater how "perfect" I try to shoot it. I even tried to shoot slightly away from the rail with masse to bring it back and could not do it. Any advice?
I would recommend working on your stroke, this is not that difficult of a shot. The position is slightly harder but making the ball isnt that hard.....
There's two ways to go about such a shot. One is to simply cinch the 8 with some draw, and then just make the 9 up table corner. You'll be shooting of the rail, but that's no big deal. It should be something you make more often than not.
The other way is to shoot the CB with LOW RIGHT, aiming at a spot on the object ball that is also LOW RIGHT. This will create an artificial angle off the cushion at the contact point with the 8. Allowing the CB to come off the rail and draw back at the same time. This will get you better shape on the 9 and also get you off the cushion making the 9 a bit easier to shoot.
However, that kind of a shot has big pitfalls. It's much easier to miss. It's also much easier to blow position. Harder to judge speed and action. More judging of english. Too touchy of a shot. You're risking too much in order to get marginally better on the 9.
Instead, it's better to just make the 8 straight in, draw back some and then make the 9. It's not wonderful, but I believe that to be a higher percentage two shots than taking a risky higher force, lot of english shot on the 8 ball.
For example, it's better to shoot two 60% shots, than it is to shoot one 30% shot and one 90% shot. Cause the 30% is what's going to get you. Maybe I'm wrong, but I've been successful in working patterns this way. Always better to eliminate the routes or patterns which lead to a "sucker" shot or one that is very low percentage.
A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. Same is true of pattern and position play.
Finally, people put too much effort into the study of what are known as recovery shots. It's not bad to study them or figure them out. Sometimes your opponent leaves you that way. Or if it's your fault, it's still fine to work them out since you still need to win and what already happened is water under the bridge. However, a greater amount of effort and energy and study should be placed on the REAL problem here - and that's the horrible shape on the 8.
This wouldn't be a discussion if better shape was played on the 8. I've found that in my game, attacking the root cause of problems is far more beneficial than chasing after fixing the symptoms or conditions of the problem.
As per my previous post, if you can draw back about a diamond or two, you'll get a roughly a 30 to 45 degree angle on the 9. That's not bad at all. It will be within the ideal range of angles most comfortable for most shooters. The half ball cut is the easiest to visualize. Also, the steep angle into the pocket means the pocket will be slightly more forgiving if you under cut it. You can catch some of the side cushion and still make it.
I usually make 13 out of 15. Sometimes all of them, sometimes I miss a couple more. Varies on concentration level. It's not that bad. A good drill that really makes you bear down and hit straight and smooth stroke. A real handy drill because whether your fault or not, being on the rail comes up too often, especially in 9 ball.
Need to practice shots usually associated as tough so that they become more routine. Too many lower level players simply look at a shot like that and all the negativity in their mind starts up. Oh no, long range off the rail shot. Perspective and outlook is critical. Better players view fewer shots as challenging. Seems obvious. But it's not necessarily because they are better, but because they don't attribute special attributes of difficulty or doom to a shot. Champions look at the bright side instead. It's a shot. It's not at any kind of extreme angle. It's a routine angle. The contact point is there. Hit your spot and the ball will go. That's it. Get down and make it. The bad player will look at all the reasons why it's not so makeable.
But do put more into getting better shape on the 8. Then you don't have to be faced with shots that are tougher than they are suppose to be - which leads to match fatigue and breaks you down over the course of a tournament. It's a sort of when it rains it pours thing. The better shape you get and the more you're in line keeping the CB "on a string" , the easier the game plays out, the more relaxed and less energy you burn, the more confidence you get, the better you play. One thing feeds another. Bad shape leads to recovery shots which breaks down good match flow, makes you work harder, think harder, focus more all tiring a player out. The opposite of when everything is working out.
1.) When loading the cue up to bank the object ball back up under into the corner pocket, should top or bottom be used on the cue ball or does it matter?
2.) How much of the object ball should be contacted to make this shot? 3/4, 1/2, 1/4 etc?
I've never seen this shot and am curious how it can be made.
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