VISION CENTER vs DOMINANT EYE

english! said:
i too do not like the term 'vision center'

vision center would seem to imply the center of one's vision. To most that would mean directly betwen the eyes, in the center.

What needs to be done is for one to get what ever their 'aiming vision' is, right eye, left eye, somewhere between the eyes, centered along the cue line so they can aim & direct the cue where they want to aim it, which naturally is along the shot line.

So, one needs to get one's 'aiming vision' or 'alignment vision' what ever that is as described above 'centered' over the cue so as to allow one to 'see' where the cue is actually aligned.

I think the terms 'aiming vision' or 'alignment vision' is a more appropriately description.

We are simply discussing vernacular & what would be 'better' for a layman.

If one knows what is meant by 'vision center' then it's a moot point.

But i think fran's point is appropriate. How many in the general pool playing population know what is actually meant by the term 'vision center'?

Tell them to get their 'vision center' over the cue & see how many put the cue centered between their eyes. Do that in the text format of azb where you can not see what they are doing & how much actual damage is being done to people's game.

If one is right eye dominant & sees a straight line aim with their right eye then that is their "vision center' by dr. Dave's definition. I would think most people would do an aiming process by using their dominant eye, whether it be right or left & then some are somewhere in bewteen. So to say get your dominant eye over the cue could be incorrect.

Get your 'aiming vision' or your 'alignment' vision' over the center of the cue, seems more readily communicative. At least to me.
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hello. I think that this way you always have to aim through cb center and you can't use the edges. So, you always have to perceive a straight line (shot line) as you stand above the shot. But imo it is pretty tough to keep this line as you go down to shoot.

If someone uses cb edges for aiming, he has to use his eyes in another way. I use both my eyes for aiming. For me, it has to do with both the cut direction and the angle of the shot.

Thanks for reading
 
"Vision center pool" and "vision center billiards" are okay for searches. I dunno--optimal head position? Maximum sight line? Some new term could be great because this could be used to describe 1) where the cue stick moves beneath/the sagittal plane of the face 2) the optimal head distance from the cue ball/optimal spot above the cue stick 3) best possible degree of neck rotation.

For example, a 1/4 inch closer to the nose than the right eye, head rotated 20 degrees, chin above the stick joint or what-have-you.

"Head post" sounds too creepy... :)
 
FranCrimi said:
Well, then 'vision center' will only be limited to the people who have access to that particular information provided by limited sources. Anyone who does a search online will be directed to their nearest Vision Center store.
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although more accurate nomenclature is always better
but look at low DEFLECTION shaft phrase
we all know it really is low SQUIRT shaft but its become "common knowledge" what LD means

so among the people that understand and use "vision center" as a teaching tool
if that number of people increases and the concept becomes more well known it wont be limited
btw if you google vision center pool
dr.daves stuff comes up
http://search.aol.com/aol/search?query=vision+center+pool&s_it=client91_searchbox

so i agree better nomenclature is always better if everyone understands the concept we are all on the same page:smile:
 
Here's the thing: It's not a new invention. It exists in many other sports. No need to rename it. It's the line of sight that works for the player. Very straight-forward, and something anyone can relate to.
 
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Lately I have learned that eye dominance shifts based on location of an object in the visual field. This was discussed in a prior thread. Based on this research I have revised my procedure for establishing visual sighting.

Place the cue ball on the foot spot and an object ball on the head spot. Attempt to hit the object ball into the rail and have it return to the cue ball. This is a difficult shot.

When the balls are perfectly lined up and the OB returns to the cue ball from the rail on three consecutive shots, notice where the nose is relative to the cue stick. This is the visual sighting position.

Because there are shifts in eye dominance based on distance to the object ball it would be best to repeat this procedure with the object ball in the center of the table and the cue ball on the foot spot. For some people the different distance to the OB may require a different eye placement. I doubt that this is true for many people but it may affect some people some of the time.

In general, the brain has long ago learned to compensate for the differences in the left and right eye and for differences in the visual field (distance, orientation, etc.). The most important thing is a single reference point from which the brain makes its calculations.

Setting aside all the ideas about eye dominance, there is nothing like a little reality testing to determine what is best for a particular person.

BTW Fran in pool we have visual sighting, cue stick sighting, sighting with the cue ball, and similar concepts. To some extent sighting and aiming are used interchangeably. I like "visual sighting" because it is related to the eyes and how we use them rather than other objects such as cue ball, cue stick, etc.
 
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I kind of agree with you thought here........

FranCrimi said:
Well, then 'vision center' will only be limited to the people who have access to that particular information provided by limited sources. Anyone who does a search online will be directed to their nearest Vision Center store.
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The very center of your vision would be a better term but first you need to know how to find it.

Each shot it can be difficult to find but at the same time the way to find it is the same. Knowing how to find it is the secret.

I can take anyone from zero to 90 in 15 minutes and they will know without a shadow of a doubt that they are at the very center of their vision. They see the shot perfectly.

Now that's power when your aiming.

Don't know what to name it but I know how to find it. And I sure know how to help anyone find it and I'm doing so everyday out here on the road.

Dead Center, Perfect Center. There is only on spot though for each shot that is Perfect. Finding it yourself quickly is really important when your shooting any shot as we all know.

If it doesn't look right it usually isn't. The eyes are not quite there..................
 
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JoeW said:
Lately I have learned that eye dominance shifts based on location of an object in the visual field. This was discussed in a prior thread. Based on this research I have revised my procedure for establishing visual sighting.

Place the cue ball on the foot spot and an object ball on the head spot. Attempt to hit the object ball into the rail and have it return to the cue ball. This is a difficult shot.

When the balls are perfectly lined up and the OB returns to the cue ball from the rail on three consecutive shots, notice where the nose is relative to the cue stick. This is the visual sighting position.

Because there are shifts in eye dominance based on distance to the object ball it would be best to repeat this procedure with the object ball in the center of the table and the cue ball on the foot spot. For some people the different distance to the OB may require a different eye placement. I doubt that this is true for many people but it may affect some people some of the time.

In general, the brain has long ago learned to compensate for the differences in the left and right eye and for differences in the visual field (distance, orientation, etc.). The most important thing is a single reference point from which the brain makes its calculations.

Setting aside all the ideas about eye dominance, there is nothing like a little reality testing to determine what is best for a particular person.

BTW Fran in pool we have visual sighting, cue stick sighting, sighting with the cue ball, and similar concepts. To some extent sighting and aiming are used interchangeably. I like "visual sighting" because it is related to the eyes and how we use them rather than other objects such as cue ball, cue stick, etc.
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Hey Joe, thanks for posting.

What you have described above is exactly what I have found.

When the OB is close (a couple of feet) the dominant eye is leading. As the OB distance is increased the dominant eye becomes less dominant to a certain degree (this varies with the distance of the OB). In other words, on a close shot the cue will be under the dominant eye. On a longer shot the cue will be closer to the bridge of your nose.

To my way of thinking, there is nothing wrong with lining up all shots (in the standing position) using the dominant eye, but understand, that when you bend over to shoot, focus on the target with both eyes. Your cue stick will line up accordingly.

John :)
 
Randy/Scott:

Please explain why dominant eyes don't matter and why it's a myth that they matter. I happen to disagree, but I'd rather hear you out before posting my thoughts.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2
 
would shot line/find your best head position
be an accurate way to descibe it and get that accepted???
 
@onepocketJohn

This the reason why the See-System takes behalf of a pivot (or inside sweep like Stan of CTE/ProOne names it now) to thinn an object ball that is close to the CB to thinn a ball.
With these systems the position of the dominant eye stays the same and is adjusted by using a different visual.
With ProOne it is the same in my opinion.

If we do not use a system like these two and bring our cue down without using apivot ( motion of a circle with the cue while going down in our set position) but just straight your observation is absolutely correct!

The effect of less dominance of the dominant eye on longer shots is supported a little by a more shallow angle of object ball and dominant eye (in comperson to a close shot) and because of the fact, that we perceive the object ball smaller on longer distances then on close distances.


These effects add up in my opinion!

On cut shots of a 2/3rd hit and stiffer angles- the throw effect gets into play and calls for thinning the object ball a little more to compensate for throw.

Using no system it will help to have the cue more centered (closeer to your nose sometimes e en perfectly under your nose)

ProOne and SEE compensate this by having visuals ( virtual sighting lines from CB to OB) that would slightly overcut the object ball in case we would live in a world without friction.

Ekkes
 
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