Was Mosconi's 526 high run shot on an 8' table?

[yaffabernstein]

Given the number of times Mosconi ran 125 or 150 and out in competition, why is it so hard to believe that he ran 526 in an exhibition? And in case you think he did it because the table was easy, he ran over 300 multiple times on a 5' x 10' table (as did Irving Crane and probably others). As for the statement that "he preferred drinking wine and getting blitzed on speed, cigs and coffee", it's true that he loved his coffee and cigs before his stroke in 1956, after which he gave them up. But I've never heard that he had a drinking or "speed" problem. Are you thinking of Ralph Greenleaf?

What do you think the stroke was from, speed, long term use which blew up his head and he alsmost died of it. Why do you think he would be jumping all over and running around the table like a bunny rabbit, he was wired so tight its no wonder the band finaly broke. He loved to drink wine and beat up his old lady too. The guy had a lot of problems. Everyone hated his ass.

 

[Rich93]

Is this correct? I thought I read that Greenleaf had the record on a 5x10 and it was 170-something.

Well, now that you call me on it, I don't really know - maybe I overstated. I was going by memory, which in this case was faulty. I've since looked again at my source. In Mosconi's autobiography he says that Irving Crane set the exhibition high run record at 309 in Layton Ohio in 1939, and that he (Willie) equaled it in October 1945 while still in the army. Later on Willie talks about two runs in 1953 - 322 in Platteville Wisconsin and 365 in Wilmington North Carolina. He doesn't say how big the tables were for any of these runs. I have a vague recollection of reading an interview with Irving Crane where he talked about his high runs on a 5' x 10' - I think his 1939 run must be a good candidate. About Willie's, I'm more doubtful. His autobiography said the BCA went to a 9 foot table for the championships in 1949, but that poolrooms had been using 9 foot tables for years before that because they could fit more into their rooms.

 

[jay helfert]

What do you think the stroke was from, speed, long term use which blew up his head and he alsmost died of it. Why do you think he would be jumping all over and running around the table like a bunny rabbit, he was wired so tight its no wonder the band finaly broke. He loved to drink wine and beat up his old lady too. The guy had a lot of problems. Everyone hated his ass.

When did you become an expert on the personal life of Mosconi. I don't remember ever seeing you around, or are you another 21 year old know it all. Did you ever actually see him play?

I grew up in Dayton, Ohio and East High Billiards was still there (in Springfield) until about the mid 70's. I played pool there with Howard Barrett and Russ Maddox, who owned the place in the 1960's. I believe the tables were Brunswick Sport Kings, over sized 8 footers, which were quite common back then in the Midwest. I do not recall the pockets being buckets, but normal size for their day, which may have been 5". They were straight cut, with deep slate and very stiff. They would definitely reject a poorly hit shot.

From all accounts I heard over the years (from the locals), Mosconi did not miss or have a ball jump out of a pocket. Sport Kings took the balls real good anyway. He did finally miss a ball in the side. All those rumors were started by "knockers" and other envious types. If the shoe fits, wear it.

True, Willie wasn't always the most agreeable chap, but he and Flora (that's his wife in case you didn't know) always seemed to get along fine. If anything, he was especially respectful of her. I was around him many times over the years, for exhibitons, appearances and even some tournaments like The Legends of Pool. I never once saw him drunk or inebriated. Rather than looking like a jack rabbit around the table, he was poetry in motion.

Watching him run balls (and he was still running hundreds at EVERY exhibition well into his 60's) was like watching a great dancer perform.
I've seen many players who were wired on speed, and he wasn't. Period!
Of course, you may tell us he bought his speed from you. Otherwise how would you know all this. And you probably have copies of the police reports from the domestic calls to his home. Right?

Or maybe you're just talking out of your ass, about one of the greatest pool players who ever lived. I mean who the hell is Yaffa Bernstein anyway? You probably can't make a ball in the ocean.

 

[JoeyInCali]

When did you become an expert on the personal life of Mosconi. I don't remember ever seeing you around, or are you another 21 year old know it all. Did you ever actually see him play?

Jay, that's Fast Larry.
I kid you not.

 

[Alex Kanapilly]

I ran 1000 one time but there was no one there to see it! lol

I don't believe you! You are now my sworn mortal enemy and I must shoot holes in every one of your posts from here to eternity.

This must be how these fuedes start.

Alex... been looking for a sworn enemy.

 

[yaffabernstein]

When did you become an expert on the personal life of Mosconi. I don't remember ever seeing you around, or are you another 21 year old know it all. Did you ever actually see him play?

Jay, that's Fast Larry.
I kid you not.

See him play, he was house pro at the room I came up in. Played him, saw him run a century 50 times. It was Greenleaf who was the drunk, I saw him play too and Hoppe. Ralph would drink anything you would buy him and was a serious drunk bum. He got on Heroin and that is what finally killed him. Ralph never did speed, Wiille did. All the old straight pool guys were on diet pills or amphatemines in order to play all night long or for days. Long term use turns you crazy and fries your nurological system and its easy for a blood vessle in the brain to burst which happned to Willie. Do I know of what I speak, oh yeah, bet your ass I do. The same thing just happened to my video guy that happened to Willie. Speed kills dudes. Talk to blackjack about this. This is why he is crippled today, same thing.

 

[yaffabernstein]

When did you become an expert on the personal life of Mosconi. I don't remember ever seeing you around, or are you another 21 year old know it all. Did you ever actually see him play?

I grew up in Dayton, Ohio and East High Billiards was still there (in Springfield) until about the mid 70's. I played pool there with Howard Barrett and Russ Maddox, who owned the place in the 1960's. I believe the tables were Brunswick Sport Kings, over sized 8 footers, which were quite common back then in the Midwest. I do not recall the pockets being buckets, but normal size for their day, which may have been 5". They were straight cut, with deep slate and very stiff. They would definitely reject a poorly hit shot.

From all accounts I heard over the years (from the locals), Mosconi did not miss or have a ball jump out of a pocket. Sport Kings took the balls real good anyway. He did finally miss a ball in the side. All those rumors were started by "knockers" and other envious types. If the shoe fits, wear it.

True, Willie wasn't always the most agreeable chap, but he and Flora (that's his wife in case you didn't know) always seemed to get along fine. If anything, he was especially respectful of her. I was around him many times over the years, for exhibitons, appearances and even some tournaments like The Legends of Pool. I never once saw him drunk or inebriated. Rather than looking like a jack rabbit around the table, he was poetry in motion.

Watching him run balls (and he was still running hundreds at EVERY exhibition well into his 60's) was like watching a great dancer perform.
I've seen many players who were wired on speed, and he wasn't. Period!
Of course, you may tell us he bought his speed from you. Otherwise how would you know all this. And you probably have copies of the police reports from the domestic calls to his home. Right?

Or maybe you're just talking out of your ass, about one of the greatest pool players who ever lived. I mean who the hell is Yaffa Bernstein anyway? You probably can't make a ball in the ocean.

I know what a sport king is. I had one in my studio for years because the are soft pockets and pot balls well. It's a great table for ball bangers, like the Gandy big G was a soft table as well. I know who Flora was. Dark hair. True, Yaffa cant run 3 fookin balls, got me there. You never saw the bruises hidden under her makeup, you were not looking very hard. He was not on speed, damn man, they were all on speed. Willie was a dancer, has his moves cold and he was smooth as he sometimes ran around the table in a trot, he was still wired. How many pros today do you think are playing on pot, coke or speed. If I listed them all you would faint. Look at those shaking palseys on the back swings, you don't get that from drinking too much gatorade. I understand Willie was the 2nd greatest player of all time in pool right behind Ralph and I do respect his game and records. I respect Ralph more, but the truth is, he was a drunk and later went mad. This is a subject let's just close, it's going no where but into the sewer fast. He is your hero and I am sorry I offended you with the naken truth. Some things are best left buried and not dug up. My mistake.

 

[pdcue]

time to re-read the clipping

I have read the original local press clipping, that covered the match, in Springfield, OH. Mosconi did play on an 8' table. He did not 'miss' after pocketing 526 balls in 14.1...he merely elected to "quit" and go eat dinner, after shooting in balls for nearly 5 hours.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

I am looking at my Xerox of the orig article

"Mosconi's miss came on a difficult shot. His only possible out
was a long deep cut shot that couldn't even be banked"

the Springfield paper had a feature article in 2004 on the 50th anniv
of the event - there are people still in Springfield who were
in the room in 1954

the shot he missed was into a corner pocket
the previous break shot had been a thin cut into a side pocket
which brought the CB 2 rails into the back of the rack

Dale

 

[JamisonNeu]

yaffabernstein
Your posts in the last day or two are worthless as well as being the rudest lies I have ever heard. Mr. Mosconi and Ralph Greenlief are both gone and they can not defend themselves. So I am going to give it a go.
I am very disturbed by the things you wrote it is just plain hateful and makes anyone who reads your writing dumber just by having read it. You should never speak of the dead in such a way it is immoral and unforgivable. I should hope that anyone would know this. Did Willie Mosconi tell you this? Did Ralph Greenlief's tell you he was a herion junky? If not then you sir are guilty of being the worst type of person on this planet. I have no respect for you even if these lies were true. You are attacking the helpless and that should never be tolerated. I would call you a coward but, you are worse than that. They are dead and I bet Willie Mosconi or Ralph Greenlief could still give you 100 no count. You are a discrace of a human being and Yes, I would say that to your face.
Jamison