What does it take to become a Champion?

second try

John,

You have a short memory to go along with your insecure bluster. I was one of the first to buy your 245 DVD directly from you when you were promoting it yourself. Then I helped promote the DVD right here on AZB. I don't hate you, I have tried to help you. That doesn't mean you don't let your ego overload your ass sometimes though.

You think you are big time? How many times have you played for a $160,000 purse? Maybe a dozen in or so in your life? How many times have you put up half of that purse out of your own pocket? Money that represented your net worth from getting a business loan, clearing two acres of woods, building a commercial building, and running a business sixty hours a week for seven years? I had that eighty thousand John that I had earned the hard way. Then I bet it on one game of barbox eight ball with someone that I knew could run out if he won the lag. That was in the early eighties, I'll let you and others do the math what that eighty thousand would be worth today. Then you come on here and talk like you are something and everybody before you have never been anything. It's actually kind of funny. Your pud would shrivel up until you had to pull it out with needle nosed pliers to take a whiz if you ever played for eighty thousand dollars of your own money that you had earned.

Another thing, I have watched you run that 245 many times, I have watched you compete as many times or more, I have watched most of the people you play against compete. I do know your game and I know the type of game that the people you compete with play. When I say something about your game I'm not talking totally out of my ass having never seen you play. When you talk about my game you have never seen me play an it is very doubtful that you have ever even faced someone that brought my style of play to the table. Not saying better or worse, but a different style. When you declare yourself knowledgeable about what I did before you were born you are as full of crap as a soup sandwich and that is the truth.

Right here in this thread you have declared that you have a gift that gives you better hand eye coordination and better competition skills than any of us lesser mortals. I definitely qualify in your definition of lesser mortals, it took me two years to play decent pool and seven or eight years of playing over sixty hours a week of pool to play my best pool. Obviously not one of the gifted.

You have the gift, I don't. You are young and in your prime. I'm old and have been in ten times as many wrecks and crashes as you have been in. Along with all I mentioned last night, I'm hard of hearing. Surely you can beat me in any competition that requires responding to a buzzer, lighting reflexes, and great hand eye coordination. You have at least a dozen physical advantages over me plus you have "the gift". All I have going for me is a few hundred thousand repetitions. This is your chance to prove that "the gift" trumps hard work and years of effort. The window is still open that you are sidestepping.

You like to lump anyone that disagrees with you into little people and haters. What you don't realize is that most disagree with you when you insist there is only one path to success, your path, including hundreds if not thousands of Olympic champions. It might inflate your ego to think that people like Russ and I hate you but it is far from true. As pro players go I think you are a pretty good guy. As a man, I think you have a little growing up to do and I don't hate the immature and insecure.

What do you have to achieve before you can accept that your words aren't a proclamation from God without feeling threatened and when are you going to go out and try to achieve that?

Hu
(My full name has been posted a handful of times lately. However "Hu" was good enough while I was making more money net playing pool than you have yet so it is plenty for me to use on a pool forum)
 
Are you a complete tool? John won the bloody US Open you twit, he is most definately a champion and won one of those very few tournaments that ALOT of pro's very much want to win. It is not his only win either, but it is a HUGE win that many world champions have NOT actually managed although they have tried.

This is an excellent post ^^

thats my point the top players didnt have to devote all their time.
for myself i got good so fast that i surpassed the people around me quickly.
its the same with all the other greats in other sports.
for the record not anybody can become champion in anything and i think you know that.
also your right im not a world champion but i did stay at a holiday in express last night.does that qualify me to speak on what it takes.lol

good post.just like 10,000 hours from now gatz will still be a c player living with his mom and dad at 30 talking about i can be great at anything lol.

And this is why I stay out of most threads, but I did get a chuckle out of this one :D. Infact I liked this one so much I put it in my signature, one to remember.

It's "write", you idiot. I'll get a life, if you go back to school....OK?

Why hate on Lee when his spelling and grammar is 10X better than Johns. I don't see you hating on him about it. Aslong as you get the idea of what hes trying to say wtf does it matter? Damn grammar police.

We have not heard from Russ or Gatz in awhile, they must be practicing?

Actually I was practicing at my local pool hall, whats wrong with that?. I usually have better things to, then to sit here all day and argue.
 
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Becoming a Champion

I have heard many more times than I can count that the only way to get better at the sport is to play someone better then yourself. This absolutely makes no sense to me. If you play someone better then yourself you are going to Lose each time. In Any sport what do you gain from losing? Absolutely nothing. Think of the Olympics for example. Who would want to lose a chance to win Gold, Silver, or Bronze? No one. This is why you see Olympians get so upset when they fail to win a medal. If you are one of the people out there who has the want to become a champion the best advice I can give is to go out and get a quality cuestick. Once you are able to play with a solid hitting cue and get accustomed to it the possibilities are endless.
 
Gatz,

If you don't know the difference between "right" and "write", best go back to school and stay out of the pool hall. I certainly don't "hate" Lee, I don't know him whatsoever. However, I do see him post self serving, egotistical, chest thumping, blow hard comments. I simply asked if he could "blow bubbles out of his ass", figured he was great at everything else, maybe he could do that to.

As to my wondering if you were "out practicing", that was a tongue and cheek response to this whole "what it takes to become a champion" thread. Lighten up. :wink:

As for John, well, I'll excuse a few spelling errors since he's run 400 balls a couple of times. :eek:


Why hate on Lee when his spelling and grammar is 10X better than Johns. I don't see you hating on him about it. As Long as you get the idea of what hes trying to say wtf does it matter? Damn grammar police.



Actually I was practicing at my local pool hall, whats wrong with that?. I usually have better things to, then to sit here all day and argue.
 
TE,
If you and others are truly interested in a definitive answer to this question, then you need only wait another year or so (maybe less??) for Mark Wilson's book to be completed.

In my view, he is one of the 2 best pool instructors on the planet; and his "life's work" has been his instructional book that he has been working on for the past 10 or 15 years. I do not believe that he cares if it sells a single copy, his mission was to get down onto paper the information he has garnered in a lifetime dedicated to pool - information no one has presented and explained heretofore.

I have been fortunate enough to view it in the early stages, and can tell you that it is unlike any other pool book ever published (I own and have read almost all of them). In it, he will present extremely detailed information on what it takes to develop professional level skill; something not available up till now.

For students of the game, I believe this book will be indispensable if they are seeking to immerse themselves in the game - it is a great game, but exceedingly difficult to master without guidance.

What I don't think you mentioned and what a lot of people may not know is, Mark was a serious student of Jerry Briesath, who, for years, was considered to be the finest instructor in the country if not in the world.
I, for one, will be waiting with bait on my breath, as Smorg used to say, for Mark's book.
 
A few years back I watched the Challange of Champions and it was
Oliver vs. Francisco in the finals for $50,000. Hill hill and Oliver was at the
table ready to run out. He called a foul on himself even though no one
saw it. He lost 50G's and remember, second place paid nothing. How many
people do you think would do that, not many. People will try to cheat you
for $5 if you know what I mean. What he did was exceptional, at least
in my book. I think winning is not the only thing that makes somebody a
true champion.
 
A few years back I watched the Challange of Champions and it was
Oliver vs. Francisco in the finals for $50,000. Hill hill and Oliver was at the
table ready to run out. He called a foul on himself even though no one
saw it. He lost 50G's and remember, second place paid nothing. How many
people do you think would do that, not many. People will try to cheat you
for $5 if you know what I mean. What he did was exceptional, at least
in my book. I think winning is not the only thing that makes somebody a
true champion.

WOW! :eek: I'm sure this was telivised aswell. I wonder if this is on Youtube somewhere.
 
I haven't read the whole thread, but I noticed that two guys said that Ralf Souquet was "an easy draw" when he first started to enter tournaments in the United States.

FYI, he was 27 years old when he won the World 9-ball Championship in 1996.

Exactly when did he start to play tournaments in USA?

I think I remember that Ortmann either won or finished runner-up in a 14-1 tournament in 1989. If so, Ortmann was around 20 years old then, and since 1989 - 1996 Ortmann and Souquet completely dominated European pool. Btw, Ortmann won the World 9-ball Championship in 1995, if I am not mistaken.

I seriously doubt that Ralf Souquet was considered an easy draw.
 
I haven't read the whole thread, but I noticed that two guys said that Ralf Souquet was "an easy draw" when he first started to enter tournaments in the United States.

FYI, he was 27 years old when he won the World 9-ball Championship in 1996.

Exactly when did he start to play tournaments in USA?

I think I remember that Ortmann either won or finished runner-up in a 14-1 tournament in 1989. If so, Ortmann was around 20 years old then, and since 1989 - 1996 Ortmann and Souquet completely dominated European pool. Btw, Ortmann won the World 9-ball Championship in 1995, if I am not mistaken.

I seriously doubt that Ralf Souquet was considered an easy draw.

I have over 300 DVD's of almost every possible telivised pool tournament here in North America, not match's, pool tournaments. I don't want people to start flaming like they normally do, saying something like "OMG THERE WAS MORE THAN 300 TELIVISED MATCH's IN AMERICA!!! OMG!!). And many times the commentators always said that when Ralf Souquet first started coming to America to play in tournaments he was considered "An easy draw". I'm not gona name names but the people that were saying this were players themselfs, and good ones at that. I also have this very old match where it's the finals of a tournament ( i think it was Varner and Reyes) and they interview Ralf about the match and he has a mustache LOL :grin-square: He looks freaken hilarious!

And I believe this match was around 89-91 I don't have my dvd's near me so i can't tell you for sure.
 
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hi

John,

You have a short memory to go along with your insecure bluster. I was one of the first to buy your 245 DVD directly from you when you were promoting it yourself. Then I helped promote the DVD right here on AZB. I don't hate you, I have tried to help you. That doesn't mean you don't let your ego overload your ass sometimes though.

You think you are big time? How many times have you played for a $160,000 purse? Maybe a dozen in or so in your life? How many times have you put up half of that purse out of your own pocket? Money that represented your net worth from getting a business loan, clearing two acres of woods, building a commercial building, and running a business sixty hours a week for seven years? I had that eighty thousand John that I had earned the hard way. Then I bet it on one game of barbox eight ball with someone that I knew could run out if he won the lag. That was in the early eighties, I'll let you and others do the math what that eighty thousand would be worth today. Then you come on here and talk like you are something and everybody before you have never been anything. It's actually kind of funny. Your pud would shrivel up until you had to pull it out with needle nosed pliers to take a whiz if you ever played for eighty thousand dollars of your own money that you had earned.

Another thing, I have watched you run that 245 many times, I have watched you compete as many times or more, I have watched most of the people you play against compete. I do know your game and I know the type of game that the people you compete with play. When I say something about your game I'm not talking totally out of my ass having never seen you play. When you talk about my game you have never seen me play an it is very doubtful that you have ever even faced someone that brought my style of play to the table. Not saying better or worse, but a different style. When you declare yourself knowledgeable about what I did before you were born you are as full of crap as a soup sandwich and that is the truth.

Right here in this thread you have declared that you have a gift that gives you better hand eye coordination and better competition skills than any of us lesser mortals. I definitely qualify in your definition of lesser mortals, it took me two years to play decent pool and seven or eight years of playing over sixty hours a week of pool to play my best pool. Obviously not one of the gifted.

You have the gift, I don't. You are young and in your prime. I'm old and have been in ten times as many wrecks and crashes as you have been in. Along with all I mentioned last night, I'm hard of hearing. Surely you can beat me in any competition that requires responding to a buzzer, lighting reflexes, and great hand eye coordination. You have at least a dozen physical advantages over me plus you have "the gift". All I have going for me is a few hundred thousand repetitions. This is your chance to prove that "the gift" trumps hard work and years of effort. The window is still open that you are sidestepping.

You like to lump anyone that disagrees with you into little people and haters. What you don't realize is that most disagree with you when you insist there is only one path to success, your path, including hundreds if not thousands of Olympic champions. It might inflate your ego to think that people like Russ and I hate you but it is far from true. As pro players go I think you are a pretty good guy. As a man, I think you have a little growing up to do and I don't hate the immature and insecure.

What do you have to achieve before you can accept that your words aren't a proclamation from God without feeling threatened and when are you going to go out and try to achieve that?

Hu
(My full name has been posted a handful of times lately. However "Hu" was good enough while I was making more money net playing pool than you have yet so it is plenty for me to use on a pool forum)

do you feel better.you just rambled on for a full page about nothing . after all that i can see even at your advanced age your still trying to prove to yourself and everybody else that you are or were a great player. jeesh get a life.
 
I haven't read the whole thread, but I noticed that two guys said that Ralf Souquet was "an easy draw" when he first started to enter tournaments in the United States.

FYI, he was 27 years old when he won the World 9-ball Championship in 1996.

Exactly when did he start to play tournaments in USA?

I seriously doubt that Ralf Souquet was considered an easy draw.

I think Ralf's first major tournament was the first BC Open in Binghamton, NY in, I think, 1985.

Edit: I can find no mention of Ralf's name in the first three years of the BC Open. It may have been the fourth or, I believe, last year. If I can find it I'll post it. I know I saw him play in one of those tournaments and he and I spoke of it at the US Open in either 2000 or 2001. He remembered it fondly.
 
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twice you have ducked . . .

John,

That is twice you have ducked. Wanna go for three times?

Hu

do you feel better.you just rambled on for a full page about nothing . after all that i can see even at your advanced age your still trying to prove to yourself and everybody else that you are or were a great player. jeesh get a life.
 
hi

John,

That is twice you have ducked. Wanna go for three times?

Hu

ducked what.are you challenging me to a contest of somesort.your so busy talking about how great you used to play that ive lost track of what your point is anymore.
ive talked to the locals in your area and they told me you are a legend in your own mind and never could play top speed.that doesnt make you a badguy or anything im just saying what i was told.

im sure you could beat me in a viagra eating contest or something but the fact remains this whole argument started over what it takes to be a champion poolplayer.
if you think your more qualified than me to speak on the subject than you truly are smoking a fatty the size of a lysol can my friend.
maybe your stories of pool hustling impresses guys who cant play.
not me, im not impressed. ive made a living playing hometown hero nobodies and quite frankly it was alot of fun and easy money too.
by the way everything i say about pool i can back up and i put my name beside it.
.
now when it comes to gun shooting maybe your great and i respect that.
if im ever on a shooting forum and some nobody whos never won anything at shooting starts telling you how to become a top marksman ,i will be the first to tell that guy hes a joke.
 
all kidding aside i want people on here to know i like and respect 99 percent on here.
im very approachable and willing to talk with anybody no matter their skill level.
anybody thats ever met me can attest to that.
im really just coming off like a know it all arrogant person to get under russ and hu skin.
at any rate as you can read i have little patience for b-d players telling me what it takes to be a pro player.
if that makes me a bad guy im sorry.
i guess im just holding the fact that guys like russ and hu have made some super know it all lame posts in the past.
i think ive always held that against them.
another thing russ in closing you are extremely jealous of me and you need to work on that.
one you could never be me and two thats a character flaw as you like to say.
am i making you mad yet lol.
if your mad and need to let off some steam maybe you could write another 3 pager about what it takes to be a pro.breath deep russ .
you know your tag line used to say you better pray to god that you play better than short stop speed if your gonna woof at me.
well i think im qualified.woof woof lol

p.s. see you at derby

Okay. I am gonna be real honest with you. I have ZERO jealously as related to you.

Bustamente, mebbe. Efren, DEFINITELY.

But in all honesty, it's THIS guy I am jealous of, John. You are a great player, and a great guy (when you aren't putting lesser players down), but in my opinion, you will never approach mastery of your craft like he has his.

This demonstration of talent makes me see how pointless arguing about what it takes to be a top pool player really is..

Andy McKee - Acoustic guitarist

Drifting

Tight Trite Night (Don Ross cover)
I have never heard the acoustic guitar played like this in my life.

Art of Motion

Rylynn

Cover of Toto's "Africa"



Russ
 
A few years back I watched the Challange of Champions and it was
Oliver vs. Francisco in the finals for $50,000. Hill hill and Oliver was at the
table ready to run out. He called a foul on himself even though no one
saw it. He lost 50G's and remember, second place paid nothing. How many
people do you think would do that, not many. People will try to cheat you
for $5 if you know what I mean. What he did was exceptional, at least
in my book. I think winning is not the only thing that makes somebody a
true champion.

I am not sure if it was the same match or not, but same players (Oliver and Francisco), same format (Challenge of the Champions), Bustamante was running out and was starting to shoot the 9. Oliver stopped him and told him to call his pocket as it was required in that format to call the 9.

Although I am not positive, I also believe that this may have been the final game that Bustamante needed.
 
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I am not sure if it was the same match or not, but same players (Oliver and Francisco), same format (Challenge of the Champions), Bustamante was running out and was starting to shoot the 9. Oliver stopped him and told him to call his pocket as it was required in that format to call the 9.

Although I am not positive, I also believe that this may have been the final game that Bustamante needed.
It happened about 5-7 years ago or so.
 
John,

That is twice you have ducked. Wanna go for three times?

Hu
I love how you and others like you keep on saying how good they used to be 20 or so
years ago. I'll bet you 20 years ago you had the same excuse so chance is, you never
played well. I just love these pool teachers who know everything but never did anything.
 
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