What drives you guys?

[SUPERSTAR]

Let me start off by saying, that i don't play straight pool that often.
Usually around 5 times a year, and usually only when the tables get recovered.

I really don't think i have the attention span for it.

For whatever reason, i just can't stop from getting bored or stop myself from goofing off and taking flyers.

Perfect example is yesterday.
I walk into the pool room, and the tables have been recovered for less then a week now, so i figure to play some straight pool to take advantage of the non filthy conditions.

So i set up the break shot, and poof, i run a 56 right out of the gate.
Of course, the instant i mentioned that i was on a 56 ball run to the counter guy, i chunked the next break shot, and so ended my run.

Anyway, determined, i set up the break shot again, and ran a whopping 3, then a 5, then a 2, then i missed the break shot, then it was a varied assortment of less then 10 ball runs and missed break shots, before i finally got to 32 and froze myself to a ball.
After that, i just switched games.
It held absolutely no appeal for me after that.

Although afterwards, i did do the drill where you toss the balls on the table and try not to hit a rail, which i did about 6 out of 10 times, but then i got bored of that as well.

It's like i can give it a good try, but after that, it's just not there.

Is it a love of the game type of thing with you straight pool guys, or is it a competing against yourself type of thing?

What is it, cause i sure as hell don't have it.

 

[JimS]

I think it's the aesthetics of pool. The art within.

 

[Williebetmore]

Is it a love of the game type of thing with you straight pool guys, or is it a competing against yourself type of thing?

What is it, cause i sure as hell don't have it.

SS,
For me it is primarily love of the aesthetics of the game. Having said that, though, I hardly ever play any form of 14.1 by myself (a few racks occasionally). It is a game that is far better (and different) with an opponent, and with something on the line.

There is no other game that offers the solid 20 or 30 minutes of tension like you get at the end of a 2 hour game to 100 or 150, when the score is close, and every shot feels missable, no matter how easy.

I often play games to 250 or 500 with a professional (I receive a small spot......errr.....perhaps a medium size spot......errrr....alright, it's a monstrously big spot); and there is nothing like the pressure of a long game. That last hour as both players close in on the goal is intense pressure. Our last game ended 500-498; and the last rack of balls probably cut 5 years off my life - or at least added a few gray hairs.

For those players looking for a chance to prove themselves under pressure; straight pool is the ultimate test in pool.

 

[mullyman]

I don't have anything really driving me to play straight pool. I mean, sure, I want to up my high run every time I step to the table, but in all reality I play straight pool because it relaxes me and I just really enjoy it. There is no finer game on the table than 14.1.
MULLY

 

[JusticeNJ]

being in the zone in straight pool is a little different for me. i play all games, and some days straight pool is not my game of choice at all, but when i can really see the layout well, its just nothing like the other games for me. i think all games are hard, (some are easier than others), and do enjoy 9ball and one pocket, but straight pool is just, i dunno, different for me.

justin.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

SS,


There is no other game that offers the solid 20 or 30 minutes of tension like you get at the end of a 2 hour game to 100 or 150, when the score is close, and every shot feels missable, no matter how easy.

I often play games to 250 or 500 with a professional

See, i would be bored out of my mind with a game that long.
Whenever i have played someone who played the game way better then me, i was always bored out of my mind when i came back to the table after they had a huge run.
The only way that i would not be bored, is if the bet was enough to keep me interested.

As for excitement, it just doesn't happen sitting there watching someone.

BUT, i DO remember when there was a time when me and another guy used to have some good straight pool sessions, but we had a gimmick.

We played to 80 points, and we played "20 and stop" which forced you to take a different approach and use some smarts instead of just playing patterns and possibly running out.
It was way more exciting then regular straight pool to us and it guaranteed that you would come to the table multiple times during a game, instead of just nodding off as your opponent puts together a big package.

Many times, it would be, "run the rack and play safe", cause you didn't want to stop with the rack wide open so they could just run balls right back, and it added a twist on the strategy element and way WAY more suffer cause the scores were usually close.

To me, watching a match like that would be way more exciting then just regular straight pool.

But as it stands now, it's like there is no reason to play.
It's like a dead game.

 

[CueAndMe]

I'm more into it as a meditation. I do enjoy playing with others when I'm playing well, but I always enjoy practicing alone. It's just an escape from life's serious issues as any obsession would be. And it's beautiful because of its continuous nature. You start, and you just go on and on and hopefully on and on some more. And it's also an ever changing puzzle that has many solutions, the best of which make execution satisfyingly simple. So there's lots to discover pattern-wise. It's not only about cueball control and shotmaking. I can see how it can get boring running 2's and 3's, but if you're capable of running 56's, you may be on the verge of discovering how beautiful the game can be with a little practice, reading, and an open mind.

 

[pdcue]

Let me start off by saying, that i don't play straight pool that often.
Usually around 5 times a year, and usually only when the tables get recovered.

I really don't think i have the attention span for it.

For whatever reason, i just can't stop from getting bored or stop myself from goofing off and taking flyers.

Perfect example is yesterday.
I walk into the pool room, and the tables have been recovered for less then a week now, so i figure to play some straight pool to take advantage of the non filthy conditions.

So i set up the break shot, and poof, i run a 56 right out of the gate.
Of course, the instant i mentioned that i was on a 56 ball run to the counter guy, i chunked the next break shot, and so ended my run.

Anyway, determined, i set up the break shot again, and ran a whopping 3, then a 5, then a 2, then i missed the break shot, then it was a varied assortment of less then 10 ball runs and missed break shots, before i finally got to 32 and froze myself to a ball.
After that, i just switched games.
It held absolutely no appeal for me after that.

Although afterwards, i did do the drill where you toss the balls on the table and try not to hit a rail, which i did about 6 out of 10 times, but then i got bored of that as well.

It's like i can give it a good try, but after that, it's just not there.

Is it a love of the game type of thing with you straight pool guys, or is it a competing against yourself type of thing?

What is it, cause i sure as hell don't have it.

First off, try Ritalin.

You might try playing against someone as it sounds like you
lack the self disipline for practice. Or maybe a structured practice,
drills, etc?..where you could measure improvement someway
other than by high runs.

IMHO - you answered your own question - straight pool guys
love the game and some of them enjoy competition against themselves.

Perhaps you would be better suited for the game when you are older
and, if you are lucky, wiser.

Dale<yet to get the wise part>

 

[SUPERSTAR]

First off, try Ritalin.

You might try playing against someone as it sounds like you
lack the self disipline for practice. Or maybe a structured practice,
drills, etc?..where you could measure improvement someway
other than by high runs.

IMHO - you answered your own question - straight pool guys
love the game and some of them enjoy competition against themselves.

Perhaps you would be better suited for the game when you are older
and, if you are lucky, wiser.

Dale<yet to get the wise part>

LOL. Your assuming i am young.
I've been playing pool for 19 years.
If anything, wiser DID come a long time ago, but the self discipline to play straight pool has evaded me for my entire pool career.

As for playing other people, unfortunately i can't just walk in the pool room and find a game of straight pool. It just doesn't happen. No one plays the game anymore.

As for the Ritalin, I refuse to stick stimulants into my system. So i guess i'm stuck.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

I'm more into it as a meditation. I do enjoy playing with others when I'm playing well, but I always enjoy practicing alone. It's just an escape from life's serious issues as any obsession would be. And it's beautiful because of its continuous nature. You start, and you just go on and on and hopefully on and on some more. And it's also an ever changing puzzle that has many solutions, the best of which make execution satisfyingly simple. So there's lots to discover pattern-wise. It's not only about cueball control and shotmaking. I can see how it can get boring running 2's and 3's, but if you're capable of running 56's, you may be on the verge of discovering how beautiful the game can be with a little practice, reading, and an open mind.

I think that's the problem. I don't see it as beautiful. Never have.
I sometimes wish i could see pool in general as a beautiful thing like so many i know, but i don't.

Also i am not a stranger to higher runs.
The 2's and 3's and missed break shots are all just carelessness and i know that.

I have run over 100 balls before, but even then, it wasn't like i was aiming for that, it just happened in the course of the game.

To me, it was almost anticlimactic. Like...big deal, what's all the fuss about.

Maybe I'll have to revamp my attitude.

But who knows if that is even possible, or if i will EVER be motivated for 14.1.

 

[Williebetmore]

, i was always bored out of my mind when i came back to the table after they had a huge run.
The only way that i would not be bored, is if the bet was enough to keep me interested.

.

SS,
Sounds like you need to play on tighter equipment, with faster players, and with someone not as good as you (handicaps allow all levels of players to compete). Give up a bit too much weight and try to outrun it. Good luck.

If you are "bored" by any pool game, you have our sympathy.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

SS,
Sounds like you need to play on tighter equipment, with faster players, and with someone not as good as you (handicaps allow all levels of players to compete). Give up a bit too much weight and try to outrun it. Good luck.

If you are "bored" by any pool game, you have our sympathy.

It's not possible.
Of the guys that want weight to play, they want way too much of it. Like 100-20 or 100-30. For like $10.
So not only do they want a free ride, they don't want to bet anything either.

Not worth it.

 

[Gerry]

In the rooms I came up in you were judged as a player by how many balls you could run. For someone to call you a "ball runner" was a badge of honor....kinda like when someone calls you a "player"

In it's purest form the game seems very simple and boring to watch, BUT, if you understand the ability of a great player making it look so simple, and all the shots are easy.....then you understand and can appreciate the greatest of games.

Many players don't get it til they try to run balls, or they see a great player not be able to run 50 balls.....14.1 is THE time honored game to learn ALL other games. Learn to play 14.1 well....all the other games will become easy.

G.

 

[Steve Lipsky]

Let me start off by saying, that i don't play straight pool that often.
Usually around 5 times a year, and usually only when the tables get recovered.

I really don't think i have the attention span for it.

For whatever reason, i just can't stop from getting bored or stop myself from goofing off and taking flyers.

Perfect example is yesterday.
I walk into the pool room, and the tables have been recovered for less then a week now, so i figure to play some straight pool to take advantage of the non filthy conditions.

So i set up the break shot, and poof, i run a 56 right out of the gate.
Of course, the instant i mentioned that i was on a 56 ball run to the counter guy, i chunked the next break shot, and so ended my run.

Anyway, determined, i set up the break shot again, and ran a whopping 3, then a 5, then a 2, then i missed the break shot, then it was a varied assortment of less then 10 ball runs and missed break shots, before i finally got to 32 and froze myself to a ball.
After that, i just switched games.
It held absolutely no appeal for me after that.

Although afterwards, i did do the drill where you toss the balls on the table and try not to hit a rail, which i did about 6 out of 10 times, but then i got bored of that as well.

It's like i can give it a good try, but after that, it's just not there.

Is it a love of the game type of thing with you straight pool guys, or is it a competing against yourself type of thing?

What is it, cause i sure as hell don't have it.

Hey Superstar,

I'm a little shocked... we go back a ways so I'll respect your opinion but I am curious - you mention that there's no one in your room to play and the game is all but dead? If you still play where I think you play, don't you have at least one world-class player in the room? And if so, isn't he doing what he can to promote the game to the other players?

Really hope you give the game another chance... I soured on pool during my Joss tour and Tristate tour days. The nonsense of short-rack rotation games returned nothing to me. Now that I am mostly a straight pool player, when I leave the poolroom, I usually feel like I enriched myself a little bit. It is rewarding in a way that 9-ball and 10-ball never was (to me, at least).

- Steve

 

[SUPERSTAR]

In the rooms I came up in you were judged as a player by how many balls you could run. For someone to call you a "ball runner" was a badge of honor....kinda like when someone calls you a "player"

In it's purest form the game seems very simple and boring to watch, BUT, if you understand the ability of a great player making it look so simple, and all the shots are easy.....then you understand and can appreciate the greatest of games.

Many players don't get it til they try to run balls, or they see a great player not be able to run 50 balls.....14.1 is THE time honored game to learn ALL other games. Learn to play 14.1 well....all the other games will become easy.

G.

See, i can understand this. But i also think that times have changes, and what used to be the standard has changed with it. So now instead of how many balls did you run, it's how many rack did you run.

When i was coming up, we had Jimmy Caras in the room. He gave us pointers here and there, and the older players would be lining up to play him, just to see some of the knowledge. Granted, he wasn't in his prime, but it was still nice to see him just look at the rack every now and then, and say to someone, "why don't you hit it HERE, to make THAT in the side."

And your looking at him like he's an alien wondering if he secretly has some crack addiction that made him lose his mind.

And then he'd repeat himself, and be .."hit it with a little left on the right side of this ball", so reluctantly, you'd do it, and watch in amazement as the ball in the middle of the pack that he pointed out, would go right into the hole, or miss by just a fraction of an inch.
I think those were the only times i can remember enjoying straight pool simply because it was still this big mystery. And by him being there in the room, it was like everyone wanted to play the game to have him critique it.
He was a modern day hero who freely and gladly shared his knowledge.

There aren't to many of those around anymore.

As for the badges of honor, that's changed as well.
No one cares, and if they do slightly care, they want video proof to confirm it.

Although i agree with what your saying, i will say that straight pool probably hasn't shown squat to anyone about bank pool, but i guess that's the lone exception.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

Hey Superstar,

I'm a little shocked... we go back a ways so I'll respect your opinion but I am curious - you mention that there's no one in your room to play and the game is all but dead? If you still play where I think you play, don't you have at least one world-class player in the room? And if so, isn't he doing what he can to promote the game to the other players?

Really hope you give the game another chance... I soured on pool during my Joss tour and Tristate tour days. The nonsense of short-rack rotation games returned nothing to me. Now that I am mostly a straight pool player, when I leave the poolroom, I usually feel like I enriched myself a little bit. It is rewarding in a way that 9-ball and 10-ball never was (to me, at least).

- Steve

He is the lone exception to the rule. And he is the only world class 14.1 player in the room.
I am sure he would love to play straight pool instead of our usual 10-ball, but i really don't have the motivation, or the time.
Usually, When i get there, I'm either pressed for time, or he is on his way home and the short games are more accommodating to the circumstances.
When i said there was no one to play with, i was talking about the regular everyday guys. It's just not part of the pool culture in the room.

He does what he can to promote the game. But it's not the same these days.
Promoting the game only goes so far.
I think my previous post summed it up a little but to continue.

Sometimes i think you need something supernatural.
Something MAGICAL.

When i was coming up, we had heroes to look up to. People that we wanted to be like, who amazed us.

Even the other day when i ran the 56, there was a table in the next row where one of the guys just stopped playing with his friends and focused all his attention on me.
He was completely absorbed in what i was doing.
I would say, that given the right exposure, that 1 in 100 kids gets that way when they see good pool.
It was rare when it did happen, but they were usually the ones who asked questions, and practiced, and eventually made up the next generation of aspiring pool players.

Sometimes getting flattened with bewilderment is the difference between a kid coming back and wanting to learn the game, and them just not caring.

I remember back in the early days of the pool room, when he hired GRADY to come do an exhibition.

And to GRADY's credit, he got on a table that he had never played on before, and ran over 100 twice.

Some of the people in the audience had never seen anything like that before and i know that as a result of that exhibition, that several of the kids in there dropped everything, and started playing pool all the time.

Ahh, if i could be young again and have that type of motivation and drive.

Oh well.

I'll never say never though, cause who knows what the future holds.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

I think another thing is that in straight pool in particular, if you don't know the game, you really lose bad to the guy who does.

And i think that's a key element to the game not being that popular in my area.

No one wants to lose bad, and they don't want to risk losing with a huge spot either cause then they still feel as if they look bad.

They want to be able to blast a shot, miss, and crap the money ball in.
They want the quick fix.

I don't think the majority of them understand the term sacrifice.

There might be a couple of straight pool games, but it always the same people playing each other once a week, and for me to get a game with them isn't even an option.

I kind of envy those with a good straight pool culture in their area, simply because it's not a huge hassle to get a game.

Maybe if i walked into a pool room, and EVERYONE was playing 14.1, it would be of more interest to me.

I mean if i walked into the room and no one wanted to play 10-ball, 1 pocket, back pocket or bank pool and all they wanted to play was straight pool, then i guess i'd have no choice.

But then, how do you go about generating that interest?

 

[md5key]

I play because I'm really competitive, and it's a game where I'm constantly playing against myself - and there are no excuses - if I don't get my high run I lose that day. Doesn't mean I didn't play well, I just didn't play well enough.

I also play for the meditation qualities that bluepepper mentioned. I'm going through a crazy house building experience right now and the only time when I don't think about it is when I'm at the pool table. I played for a few hours last Sunday and when I was driving away I realized I hadn't thought about the house ONCE the entire time I was at the table.

 

[lfigueroa]

Let me start off by saying, that i don't play straight pool that often.
Usually around 5 times a year, and usually only when the tables get recovered.

I really don't think i have the attention span for it.

For whatever reason, i just can't stop from getting bored or stop myself from goofing off and taking flyers.

Perfect example is yesterday.
I walk into the pool room, and the tables have been recovered for less then a week now, so i figure to play some straight pool to take advantage of the non filthy conditions.

So i set up the break shot, and poof, i run a 56 right out of the gate.
Of course, the instant i mentioned that i was on a 56 ball run to the counter guy, i chunked the next break shot, and so ended my run.

Anyway, determined, i set up the break shot again, and ran a whopping 3, then a 5, then a 2, then i missed the break shot, then it was a varied assortment of less then 10 ball runs and missed break shots, before i finally got to 32 and froze myself to a ball.
After that, i just switched games.
It held absolutely no appeal for me after that.

Although afterwards, i did do the drill where you toss the balls on the table and try not to hit a rail, which i did about 6 out of 10 times, but then i got bored of that as well.

It's like i can give it a good try, but after that, it's just not there.

Is it a love of the game type of thing with you straight pool guys, or is it a competing against yourself type of thing?

What is it, cause i sure as hell don't have it.

The charge of "boring" is one leveled against 1pocket a lot. But really, IMO, whether it's 1pocket, or 14.1, or some other game, it's more of a mindset and the ability to appreciate the subtlty of the game and it's challenges.

What happens to many of us is that we think, that because we rattle off a 50, or 70, or even a 100 once in awhile, it signifies that we "know" the game. But nothing could be further from the truth. It's not the occasional run that means anything -- players will often accomplish a high run, more through the good grace of God and fortuitous rolls, than anything else. It's being able to consistently run 50's, or 70's, or 100's that has significance. And, IMO, the way you get there is recognizing the depth of the challenge the game of 14.1 presents.

I don't think people run 3's and 10's because they lose their attention span, or get bored. It's because they don't have the knowledge and skills to not get out of line, rattle a ball, or get frozen to the stack. Sure, those things happen to even great players, just with far less frequency than to your average bear.

Lou Figueroa

 

[SUPERSTAR]

What happens to many of us is that we think, that because we rattle off a 50, or 70, or even a 100 once in awhile, it signifies that we "know" the game. But nothing could be further from the truth. It's not the occasional run that means anything -- players will often accomplish a high run, more through the good grace of God and fortuitous rolls, than anything else. It's being able to consistently run 50's, or 70's, or 100's that has significance. And, IMO, the way you get there is recognizing the depth of the challenge the game of 14.1 presents.

I don't think people run 3's and 10's because they lose their attention span, or get bored. It's because they don't have the knowledge and skills to not get out of line, rattle a ball, or get frozen to the stack. Sure, those things happen to even great players, just with far less frequency than to your average bear.

Lou Figueroa

I will have to disagree on this.
For one, i think you are generalizing the situation.

The world class 14.1 player that Steve and myself were referring to used to practice straight pool all the time.
There are times where he would peel off 60's 70's and 80's, and miss and set up the break shot again, to miss it. Then set it up again, and break, and run like 10 balls and the balls wouldn't cooperate with him, and he'd get into trouble, and then he would lose his concentration for a while and perform poorly throughout that whole time. Then, he would pull it together and return to form, or he would be in the tank, and quit for the day.
If you are talking about a hack, then i will agree that 3's and 10's are basically the best they can do, with the occasional higher run.
But if you are talking about higher level players, 3's and 10's happen when they can't concentrate, or just don't care, or aren't disciplined enough to play the proper way when they know how to.

But i will agree that experienced players know how to work the stack much better then people who have no clue about straight pool, and therefore can generate higher runs more consistently as a result.

Just like the other day. The missed break shots and the low ball runs are not a result of not knowing the game. I know exactly why they happened. And i know that after the initial run, which had ALL of my attention, i started to hit the break shot too hard, and as a result, would send the balls apart, and watch them come clustered back together, or would end uptable with some long off angle shot, or would just tie myself up with lots of stuff all along the rails.
Sure i could have hit the balls a little softer, but i didn't. That's my whole point.
I also know that i do not always have the discipline to take the right shot all the time, despite knowing what the right shot is. That is something i am lacking. Hence, my first question in an effort to maybe identify with something someone said, that might straighten my mind out.

Cut to yesterday. Was up at 4 in the morning, and at the pool hall at 5pm very fatigued, figuring to find some of that enrichment Steve was talking about and see if it just hit me or something.

Mind you, this is all happening on triple shimmed pockets. I'm not sure of the measurements, but it's the tightest table in the room where 2 balls don't fit in the mouth, and everyone usually uses them for one pocket. When the table is worn, balls have been known to go down the rail, and STILL not fall in.
Just to give you an idea.

So anyway, after getting warmed up, i got to 28, before i broke the balls too hard, and got into trouble 2 shots later.
Then it was a couple runs less then 20, then a couple of turkeys thrown in there, and then i got to 34, and this guy who comes in there for league, who i have played tons of times over the years in the handicap tournament, walks up to me, and starts to critique my patterns while i am playing. (INSTANT FRUSTRATION) as i feel a certain responsibility to people in the room, to answer questions they may have about the game, etc. etc., but right there, i am in the tank. The guy is annoying the crap out of me, and comments on how i should hit a certain shot with a certain english, and i am toast at that point.
He's a nice enough guy, but i really want to strangle him because it's hard enough for me to focus, yet now i have to do it with a critic in my ear.
So i miss, and he feels the need to explain what i did wrong, when this guy can't make 2 balls in a row. Typical.
So at that point, i am just shaking my head.

So i go back to crushing the balls and not getting anywhere, repeatedly, and then i settle down again, and am halfway into the 3rd rack of a run, when another person comes up and asks me about why i am playing straight pool. etc. etc.
Again it gets annoying.
And then, finally, someone comes up and is talking about me and if i'm causing trouble on the forums (i love to argue) and we chat for a bit, but again, i am distracted, despite that being kind of funny.
Basically, all of those encounters were harmless.
It is up to me to deal with them and not be affected by them, but undoubtedly, they take away my focus, and i misjudge either the shot, or the speed, and it's back to square 1.

So for some of us, it's not about being a hack, but instead, it's about losing ones mind. Once the concentration is gone, so are the patterns, the speed, and the correct choices.
It's about holding onto that focus so one can try to do better then the 1 and done.

Maybe i should address the practicing in privacy issue in another thread.