Whats this Mike Sigel IPT "best-ever" crap
- Thread starter Oranzith
- Start date
Is Mike really the Greatest?
This is a tough one to answer. First of all, he only recently became Mike The Mouth. During his playing days, he was Captain Hook or simply The Hook. So the new name is definately a product of the IPT hype factory.
How good was he? Damn good. Good enough to be one of the dominant players in an era with many great players. I think in the 70's and early 80's, Mike, Miz and Buddy were considered the top three players in any 9-Ball field. With Nick, Rempe and Hopkins not far behind. And pushing them were Little David, Kim, Mataya, Keith, Lebron and several others from time to time.
Then Earl came along, and he quickly became a factor in every 9-Ball event. And Efren and Parica came on the scene too, muddling the picture even more. As a money player, Sigel couldn't hold a candle to Buddy or Parica. They were the best! As a tournament player, Mike was always good, often great and many times, simply amazing.
During the 80's Pat Fleming came up the Accu-Stats scoring system, a very accurate measurement of a poolplayers skills. I read every issue from cover to cover and digested it. David had the best break, Earl ran the most racks, etc. But one statistic stood out in every issue. When it came to fewest errors (missed balls or position), Mike Sigel was the class of the field. He was nearly twice as good (half as many errors) as the next best players. No one was close to Mike in this category.
My personal observation, was that Mike was the toughest player to face in a final match. He rarely lost when he reached the finals. One time he won eleven final matches in a row (not eleven tournaments in a row). And in each final he was playing Earl, Buddy, Efren, Miz or another near great. No one really wanted to ever draw Sigel, and only Mizerak savored every opportunity to play him, whether it be 9-Ball, 14.1 or One Pocket. Steve wanted to prove he was better than this skinny kid.
Now, how would Mike rate against Wimpy. Hard to say. I will say that for the cash, Mike could not have stood up to Wimpy's relentless play. In a tournament setting, I would call it a draw. If there had been Accu-Stats when Wimpy played, it would not surprise me if he made even fewer errors than Mike. I saw him play and Wimpy just didn't miss balls. One miss a day was a only a fair day for him. He wanted to play perfect matches, with zero errors, and I suspect he had many of them. Typically in a Race To Eleven match, Wimpy might make one error total. And be quite upset about it too.
After winning matches by scores like 11-3 or 11-2, Wimpy would discuss the one ball he missed or the bad position he got in one rack. That is what he remembered.
Is Sigel the greatest? I don't know. Was he one of the greatest? Definitely!
This is a tough one to answer. First of all, he only recently became Mike The Mouth. During his playing days, he was Captain Hook or simply The Hook. So the new name is definately a product of the IPT hype factory.
How good was he? Damn good. Good enough to be one of the dominant players in an era with many great players. I think in the 70's and early 80's, Mike, Miz and Buddy were considered the top three players in any 9-Ball field. With Nick, Rempe and Hopkins not far behind. And pushing them were Little David, Kim, Mataya, Keith, Lebron and several others from time to time.
Then Earl came along, and he quickly became a factor in every 9-Ball event. And Efren and Parica came on the scene too, muddling the picture even more. As a money player, Sigel couldn't hold a candle to Buddy or Parica. They were the best! As a tournament player, Mike was always good, often great and many times, simply amazing.
During the 80's Pat Fleming came up the Accu-Stats scoring system, a very accurate measurement of a poolplayers skills. I read every issue from cover to cover and digested it. David had the best break, Earl ran the most racks, etc. But one statistic stood out in every issue. When it came to fewest errors (missed balls or position), Mike Sigel was the class of the field. He was nearly twice as good (half as many errors) as the next best players. No one was close to Mike in this category.
My personal observation, was that Mike was the toughest player to face in a final match. He rarely lost when he reached the finals. One time he won eleven final matches in a row (not eleven tournaments in a row). And in each final he was playing Earl, Buddy, Efren, Miz or another near great. No one really wanted to ever draw Sigel, and only Mizerak savored every opportunity to play him, whether it be 9-Ball, 14.1 or One Pocket. Steve wanted to prove he was better than this skinny kid.
Now, how would Mike rate against Wimpy. Hard to say. I will say that for the cash, Mike could not have stood up to Wimpy's relentless play. In a tournament setting, I would call it a draw. If there had been Accu-Stats when Wimpy played, it would not surprise me if he made even fewer errors than Mike. I saw him play and Wimpy just didn't miss balls. One miss a day was a only a fair day for him. He wanted to play perfect matches, with zero errors, and I suspect he had many of them. Typically in a Race To Eleven match, Wimpy might make one error total. And be quite upset about it too.
After winning matches by scores like 11-3 or 11-2, Wimpy would discuss the one ball he missed or the bad position he got in one rack. That is what he remembered.
Is Sigel the greatest? I don't know. Was he one of the greatest? Definitely!
Mike Sigel is not the best 9-ball player ever. Earl Strickland is, going by major titles alone.
Efren is the best all around player ever. Mike is definately in the top 5, but he's not the best ever IMO.
Efren is the best all around player ever. Mike is definately in the top 5, but he's not the best ever IMO.
Uh oh this thread could quickly turn into a "Mike Sigel Fact" thread. Hell, I'll start. Mike Sigel won so many finals he had to quit the game because his cue was outlawed under the assault weapons ban.
"Mike is the greatest"
If you listen closely they occasionally mention this is according to a magazine poll. They don't mention when it was taken either. People who respond to polls typically have a memory span that only covers the last major tournament or two. Likewise in the polls for other industries. Greatest actor? Greatest country music singer? Odds are it will be the pop flavor of the week.
Actually to set the record straight: According to a recent poll, it was unanimously decided that I am the greatest player of all time. I and my two dogs all voted for me. Of course I was holding their food at the time and it is amazing what they will agree to when lunch is on the line.
Hu
If you listen closely they occasionally mention this is according to a magazine poll. They don't mention when it was taken either. People who respond to polls typically have a memory span that only covers the last major tournament or two. Likewise in the polls for other industries. Greatest actor? Greatest country music singer? Odds are it will be the pop flavor of the week.
Actually to set the record straight: According to a recent poll, it was unanimously decided that I am the greatest player of all time. I and my two dogs all voted for me. Of course I was holding their food at the time and it is amazing what they will agree to when lunch is on the line.
Hu
I see you like to fill out polls
(I had to put ten characters in here to post)
(I had to put ten characters in here to post)
Cornerman said:
zeeder said:
But, since he's blasting out TONS of CO2, the plants are probably producing tons of O2 as a result.
Now we all need oxygen to survive, but TOO MUCH oxygen is toxic and can kill you, so someone needs to shut Mike Sigels mouth before we all die!
On another note, maybe all that CO2 is a part of his strategy when playing people. By blasting out so much CO2, he might be trying to suffocate his opponents or render then unconscious.
Apples and oranges...
As I see it the issue is Mike has been talking smack, he is playing on the IPT, and the two don't go together.
I say this because the first IPT full field event is near completion and Mike is out. Didn't even come close to threating this field. If KT's intention for the "Mouth" was strictly marketing then I am very interested to hear more...
On the other hand I think if Mike digs really deep into his history of great play, and is not blindsided by the money he has made this year, it would be great for the IPT and the "Mouth" marketing strategy.
It would also be awesome to see Mike play the way he can. He could take a tip from another sport legend George Forman. George did not talk about how he was the greatest on his comeback trail, but how hard he was working to beat the odds.
As I see it the issue is Mike has been talking smack, he is playing on the IPT, and the two don't go together.
I say this because the first IPT full field event is near completion and Mike is out. Didn't even come close to threating this field. If KT's intention for the "Mouth" was strictly marketing then I am very interested to hear more...
On the other hand I think if Mike digs really deep into his history of great play, and is not blindsided by the money he has made this year, it would be great for the IPT and the "Mouth" marketing strategy.
It would also be awesome to see Mike play the way he can. He could take a tip from another sport legend George Forman. George did not talk about how he was the greatest on his comeback trail, but how hard he was working to beat the odds.
In reference to "Cornerman's" and "Pool Bum's" comments to my original post: I would be interested in seeing if you could actually find and list a site written by billiards authorities on the history of billiards or the greatest players of all time that listed Mr. Sigel. I do believe, and wrote that he probably did dominate the game for a period of time, and certainly was a great player. The problem is that you are forgetting, or don't know, that billiards has been around a whole lot longer than just the last 25 years, and there's been a number of great players. I liken this to someone, such as a teenager, who when discussing baseball, knows only of the players of the last couple decades, and nothing of the great players of the past, and might argue that Barry Bonds, or some current player is the greatest player of all time, not knowing of players like Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig, Babe Ruth, Joe Dimaggio, etc.
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