What's up with the WPBA?

[pooltchr]

As everyone probably knows, there are only two events on their schedule this year. I heard yesterday that Brunswick is pulling back on their sponsorship. The deal the WPBA had was for Brunswick to pay the $25k to ESPN for TV coverage. I think that is a per event charge, which is a whole 'nother subject. (Most sports get paid by the networks for the rights to broadcast their competitions)

Anyway, this seems to tie in to the "What's wrong with pool" thread. My theory was that since pool isn't much of a spectator sport, it will not generate viewership of any significance to attract sponsors.

If Brunswick is bailing on the only viable professional tour we have at this time, I am starting to see that there are actually two separate issues.

What is wrong with pool? Absolutely nothing! League activity would indicate that pool is quite strong.

What is wrong with professional pool? There aren't enough people interested in watching it to make it work.

It's a little depressing, but thems are the facts as I see 'em.

Steve

 

[thebighurt]

As everyone probably knows, there are only two events on their schedule this year. I heard yesterday that Brunswick is pulling back on their sponsorship. The deal the WPBA had was for Brunswick to pay the $25k to ESPN for TV coverage. I think that is a per event charge, which is a whole 'nother subject. (Most sports get paid by the networks for the rights to broadcast their competitions)

Anyway, this seems to tie in to the "What's wrong with pool" thread. My theory was that since pool isn't much of a spectator sport, it will not generate viewership of any significance to attract sponsors.

If Brunswick is bailing on the only viable professional tour we have at this time, I am starting to see that there are actually two separate issues.

What is wrong with pool? Absolutely nothing! League activity would indicate that pool is quite strong.

What is wrong with professional pool? There aren't enough people interested in watching it to make it work.

It's a little depressing, but thems are the facts as I see 'em.

Steve

The problem with pool in this country is simple. This country isnt like England, Phillipines, etc. where pool is one of the only major sports. In this country all the sponorship money and t.v. coverage is and has been tied up already. You are competing against football, baseball, basketball, golf, Nascar, hockey, where the hell are you going to put pool? there is no room for it. Look at how much and fast poker has exploded. everyone is playing it but one of the only places you really see it is on the gameshow network on Sunday nights and on reruns of the World series of Poker. Pool is huge in the Phillipines because Boxing and pool are the 2 big sports. they are not competing against all the major sports we have in this country. People always say its because pool is boring is the reason is does poor...what does it look better and more exciting on Phillipine t.v.'s or England t.v.'s? All the major sponsorship dollars and time slots on t.v. are already tied up and they are making great money. Why the hell would they take a chance on pool?

 

[LWW]

The problem with pool in this country is simple. This country isnt like England, Phillipines, etc. where pool is one of the only major sports. In this country all the sponorship money and t.v. coverage is and has been tied up already. You are competing against football, baseball, basketball, golf, Nascar, hockey, where the hell are you going to put pool? there is no room for it.

So cuesports in the UK don't actually have to compete with soccer, rugby, cricket, formula 1 racing, moto GP racing, football, boxing, golf, tennis, cycling, horse racing, and darts?

Does the BBC know this? I mean ... they do broadcast all of this plus cuesports?

LWW

 

[justadub]

Look at how much and fast poker has exploded. everyone is playing it but one of the only places you really see it is on the gameshow network on Sunday nights and on reruns of the World series of Poker.

I see poker on TV all the time. ESPN ans ESPN 2, Sports Channel New England, NESN (New England Sports Network, the Red Sox TV outlet) and Versus. Spike TV, too, I think. Poker is all over the place, and it seems as boring to watch as pool could seem to other folks. Fer cryin out loud, ESPN not only shows Bass Fishing championships, but PROMOTES that show! Fishing? Love to do it, but to watch it?

This is it in a nutshell. Make it TV-friendly, get a sponsor, and it will be shown. There is enough time on the weekends available on these TV outlets, if there is a product to show.

Poker is a GREAT comparison. How and why it is SO popular on TV escapes me. But make no mistake, people really love watching it. Part of it has to be the personalities. Televised pool doesn't seem to have that. Keep the players mic'd, have a little woofing, get Joe Rogan or someone like him involved, and then you'll have a product the TV will want to show.

As I am typing this, ESPN is showing a promo for the Bass Fishing show....sigh.

 

[measureman]

I think one of the the problems with pool is it's somewhat sleazy reputation.
When ever i mention that i play pool to a non pool playing person almost always i get the question "Are you a hustler?" or "Are you a pool shark?"
It's the general public's perception (not entirely unearned) that has always held this game back.

 

[deadstroke7]

I think one of the the problems with pool is it's somewhat sleazy reputation.
When ever i mention that i play pool to a non pool playing person almost always i get the question "Are you a hustler?" or "Are you a pool shark?"
It's the general public's perception (not entirely unearned) that has always held this game back.

No reaction like that when you say, "I play football, golf, basketball, race a car, etc, etc"

It's a good point. I have to go out of my way to explain to folks why pool is cool and how it isn't exactly what they think.

 

[MasterClass]

I think pool has always had a sleazy reputation. But it never really affected it's popularity.

It isn't much of a spectator sports. Competition hasn't changed much for years. It has always been like this. So why now is pro pool falling apart?

I think the root of the problem likely lies with governing body. Perhaps they are not doing such a great job that they think they are doing but would fight tooth and nail to hold on to their position.

I think it is human nature. Things aren't gonna get better.

 

[Melissa Herndon]

As everyone probably knows, there are only two events on their schedule this year. I heard yesterday that Brunswick is pulling back on their sponsorship. The deal the WPBA had was for Brunswick to pay the $25k to ESPN for TV coverage. I think that is a per event charge, which is a whole 'nother subject. (Most sports get paid by the networks for the rights to broadcast their competitions)

Anyway, this seems to tie in to the "What's wrong with pool" thread. My theory was that since pool isn't much of a spectator sport, it will not generate viewership of any significance to attract sponsors.

If Brunswick is bailing on the only viable professional tour we have at this time, I am starting to see that there are actually two separate issues.

What is wrong with pool? Absolutely nothing! League activity would indicate that pool is quite strong.

What is wrong with professional pool? There aren't enough people interested in watching it to make it work.

It's a little depressing, but thems are the facts as I see 'em.

Steve

The WPBA has never paid ESPN to broadcast our shows...nor has anyone else paid ESPN to broadcast our shows.

As for the WPBA's deal with Brunswick...well, you got the first part completely wrong...so I won't even address the rest. Whoever you "heard" that from is obviously not "in the know".

The facts as you see them...aren't facts at all.

Melissa

 

[Melissa Herndon]

The WPBA has never paid ESPN to broadcast our shows...nor has anyone else paid ESPN to broadcast our shows.

As for the WPBA's deal with Brunswick...well, you got the first part completely wrong...so I won't even address the rest. Whoever you "heard" that from is obviously not "in the know".

The facts as you see them...aren't facts at all.

Melissa

And I apologize if that came off as rude...but I get frustrated with people perpetuating gossip and speculation as fact. You were just repeating what you heard...but it isn't true...and it is a big pet peeve of mine to spread gossip instead of truth.

Melissa

 

[SUPERSTAR]

The WPBA has never paid ESPN to broadcast our shows...nor has anyone else paid ESPN to broadcast our shows.

As for the WPBA's deal with Brunswick...well, you got the first part completely wrong...so I won't even address the rest. Whoever you "heard" that from is obviously not "in the know".

The facts as you see them...aren't facts at all.

Melissa

Doh !!!!

 

[pooltchr]

Fine. I have no problem being corrected. I got my info from someone very close to one of the top WPBA players, and had no reason to doubt it. I'm sure we would all appreciate hearing the inside story as to what has happened that would cause the WPBA to cut their schedule to just two events. Would you enlighten us all, please?

Steve

 

[DRW]

reputation

I think one of the the problems with pool is it's somewhat sleazy reputation.
When ever i mention that i play pool to a non pool playing person almost always i get the question "Are you a hustler?" or "Are you a pool shark?"
It's the general public's perception (not entirely unearned) that has always held this game back.

There is more hustling on the golf course and cheating at poker then pool has ever saw. These facts have done nothing to decrease the popularity of either on television.

 

[Matt90]

yes sir

As everyone probably knows, there are only two events on their schedule this year. I heard yesterday that Brunswick is pulling back on their sponsorship. The deal the WPBA had was for Brunswick to pay the $25k to ESPN for TV coverage. I think that is a per event charge, which is a whole 'nother subject. (Most sports get paid by the networks for the rights to broadcast their competitions)

Anyway, this seems to tie in to the "What's wrong with pool" thread. My theory was that since pool isn't much of a spectator sport, it will not generate viewership of any significance to attract sponsors.

If Brunswick is bailing on the only viable professional tour we have at this time, I am starting to see that there are actually two separate issues.

What is wrong with pool? Absolutely nothing! League activity would indicate that pool is quite strong.

What is wrong with professional pool? There aren't enough people interested in watching it to make it work.

It's a little depressing, but thems are the facts as I see 'em.

Steve

Thats why I had to let the live streaming idea go for a while.Still love the sport and will continue to support it by playing and showing up at events .
We need more Earl or cowbell .....to make people want to watch it
Reality hit me when I said to a prominent sponsor of pool "Sir I am gettin over 1,000 viewers at a time " He replied "Thats really not enough to justify
doing advertising for my company" I then understood that pool is not a spectator sport .....it's a participation sport .So I'm going to go participate:thumbup2:

 

[jdxprs]

pool needs better marketing. most of the time when i catch pool on t.v. it is by accident. never knew sites like this one kept tv scheduling.

 

[stljohnny]

I'm sure it's been said 100 times already but I dont think the networks view pool as "quality" entertainment. The general public wouldn't know what a good positional shot when they saw it, so when someone has excellent CB control, all they see are "easy" shots. They'd probably watch the trickshot championships (although the days of crazy ball paths and multi-ball-in-one shots looks to be over). Maybe ESPN should broadcast Venom's Trickshot DVD - THAT would likely spread by word of mouth. Hell, I tell people about after just watching the trailer.

Anyway, there's no "big" action in pool - no one gets hit, no one jumps around (for the most part), no one yells, screams or points their finger or acts like a pompous ass. Hell, even in bowling there's the big *crush* of the pins for some noisy entertainment. For the most part, it's like watching chess. You have to understand the game before it's entertaining.

The problem is that by not showing they aren't exposing it and making people understand it by listening to the announcers. Ewa and Mitch do a pretty good job in my opinion explaining what the players are thinking and then doing on the table, but I doubt most people watch long enough to pick up on that.

I count myself lucky in that it actually was the WPBA championships being show on ESPN2 the last few years that made me start looking for more pool information. I looked up player's websites, then found some blogs, then found this site... and well, everything is linked to/from here so... I definitely hope that the WPBA continues to have air-time on tv somewhere. I love accu-stats, but I can't afford to buy all the dvds they offer. (Personally, I think they should partner with netflix and make them available for rent if they're not selling enough.)

 

[LC3]

There is more hustling on the golf course and cheating at poker then pool has ever saw. These facts have done nothing to decrease the popularity of either on television.

It's a matter of perception, not facts. The general public associates golf with doctors, politicians, and exclusive country clubs. Poker is in a grayer area, but my guess is that there's a certain romance associated with its old west saloon image and Las Vegas casinos. Pool's current reputation seems mostly derived from The Hustler and smoky rooms in rough neighborhoods. All isn't lost just yet, but there's a long road ahead.

 

[Joe_Jaguar]

The WPBA has never paid ESPN to broadcast our shows...nor has anyone else paid ESPN to broadcast our shows. Melissa

At every WPBA event I have been to here in the Chicago area (Villa Park, E. Peoria, Michigan City), Tipton has always walked around during the matches hawking raffle tickets stating that money goes to getting the matches on ESPN. Maybe he used the term production costs, but it always gave the impression to me at least that they were paying in some form to ESPN to get air time.

Hope they get a Chicago area event on this year's schedule.

 

[alstl]

ESPN should get off their cheap ass and put some money in the tour. The amount of money it would cost them to have 15 to 20 events a year is chump change for them.

 

[javi2]

.......................

 

[poolsnark]

ESPN should get off their cheap ass and put some money in the tour. The amount of money it would cost them to have 15 to 20 events a year is chump change for them.

Why? For "the good of the game"? Unlike the WPBA, ESPN is in the business of broadcasting sports to <gasp> make money </gasp>. Why would ESPN pay a dime for this programming when they can get it in swaps. As for Melissa's frustration about rumor mongering, here's the deal. The WPBA board has zero communication with anyone about anything. In fact, Melissa is one of the very few who actually does anything to separate fact from fiction (which is appreciated).

When an organization can't fill out its board, can't lock down more than two tour stops and has every appearance of being in a death spiral, people want to know what is going on. So they ask. And they speculate. But in 6+ weeks, the only "press release" that the WPBA has put out since the new board took office was a note letting everyone know that John Rousseau is president.

As for getting a sponsor, I do believe you actually have to have someone who's job it is to track down sponsorships for a tour to actually get a sponsor. Instead, there seems to be the mentality of "let's just do nothing because someone will come knocking on our door with a fistful of cash".

Its deckchairs on the Titanic and everyone knows it. If I'm wrong, I invite any member of the WPBA board to get online and actually give an update that goes beyond "I'm looking for office space in Phoenix".